VC Dutchwest "Large Cat" 2461, my diary thread (w/ pics)

[VCBurner]

Not a good overnight burn last night. I can't blame the stove. The wood, which was cherry and oak, is not as dry as it should be and I stuffed a huge oak split in there. It was 67 in the house at 6am, three or four fresh splits went in at 10pm. The bed of coals were not as big when i put in the coals, either. I was trying to tone down heat rpoduction last night because it was 78 in here at 7pm. I won't do that again. Boy, would I love a new cat!!

Chris have you tried vacuum cleaning your cat and inspect that the holes are not blocked? There is also a cleaning procedure you can try :
http://www.condar.com/combustorcleaningmanual.pdf

Ray

Yes I did it the other day. Same day that I pulled the stove away fron the fireplace. I was amazed to see how little ash was in the secondary burn chamber! The cat had small parts that had cracked away. Not too many though. The overnight burn from the night before was as good as usual. The furniture pads are still under it BTW!

Oh! Good news is...I loaded her up at 6am (this morning,) the house was at 67...four hours later house is at 77 and she's still going strong!! Stove temp is slightly over 400, but the cat is at 500. So, yeah, I need a new cat, badly. I looked into ordering one and found a couple of good deals. Thanks for the links! I also found 15' of 6" flex liner for $129 plus $50 shipping= $180! It's the good SS 316Ti too, not the thin cheap liner. Well, enjoy your day!
Thanks for the post.
Chris

 

[VCBurner]

I took the top off, cleaned the cat and refractory as well as the convectory/blower channels. I definitely need a new cat. That will be next month. There was so little build up in the flue that I didn't even need to brush it, I'll do it when it's time to install the liner.

Sounds like your cat is still working, stove is burning clean and you are getting plenty of heat. Are you seeing any smoke?

Hello Todd,
Yes, I think it still works. But, not up to par with a new cat. I can't see any smoke once the cat lights off, but it is sluggish and only stays at 800 for a short time. I'd say it's time for a new one.

It only climbs up to about 800-825 during the burn cycle. With a new cat it would go well over 1000 and coast around 800 for a while on the downslope. I know the wood is not the main culprit. I tried a load of BIO bricks and it only climbed up to 850. The shorter chimney is to blame for maybe 100-200 of those lacking degrees. Last year, when it was connected to a taller stack in climbed up to 1000 only a couple of times that I can remember. In conclusion, the cat needs replacement. That will be the first thing. I'll see how the temps change with a new combustor. A liner is next...then a vaccu-stack chimney cap maybe...a double wall 3' pipe on top of the stack to add to the draft. A little at a time, I'll get there. So far since I started burning wood I've probably saved around $4000 in heating costs. I've spent a little over $1000 counting two stoves, a chainsaw, and other miscelaneous items. I'm still way beyond the red even with all of the items listed above.

Nice to hear from you Todd,
Take care,
Chris

 

[BrowningBAR]

I took the top off, cleaned the cat and refractory as well as the convectory/blower channels. I definitely need a new cat. That will be next month. There was so little build up in the flue that I didn't even need to brush it, I'll do it when it's time to install the liner.

Sounds like your cat is still working, stove is burning clean and you are getting plenty of heat. Are you seeing any smoke?

Hello Todd,
Yes, I think it still works. But, not up to par with a new cat. I can't see any smoke once the cat lights off, but it is sluggish and only stays at 800 for a short time. I'd say it's time for a new one.

It only climbs up to about 800-825 during the burn cycle. With a new cat it would go well over 1000 and coast around 800 for a while on the downslope. I know the wood is not the main culprit. I tried a load of BIO bricks and it only climbed up to 850. The shorter chimney is to blame for maybe 100-200 of those lacking degrees. Last year, when it was connected to a taller stack in climbed up to 1000 only a couple of times that I can remember. In conclusion, the cat needs replacement. That will be the first thing. I'll see how the temps change with a new combustor. A liner is next...then a vaccu-stack chimney cap maybe...a double wall 3' pipe on top of the stack to add to the draft. A little at a time, I'll get there. So far since I started burning wood I've probably saved around $4000 in heating costs. I've spent a little over $1000 counting two stoves, a chainsaw, and other miscelaneous items. I'm still way beyond the red even with all of the items listed above.

Nice to hear from you Todd,
Take care,
Chris

Is the catalyst warped? Is there any damage to the honeycomb?

 

[VCBurner]

It's not warped, but it is showing some signs of age. Some cracking of the catalyst. A few chuncks missing.

 

[raybonz]

It's not warped, but it is showing some signs of age. Some cracking of the catalyst. A few chuncks missing.

Yup time for a fresh one..

Ray

 

[VCBurner]

Check out these pics of this rebuilt older Consolidated Dutchwest. Federal Airtight I believe! I can't believe how good it looks!! This person did an incredible refinishing job. A bit pricy, but I'm sure it was a lot of work making it look this good!
http://cgi.ebay.com/Vermont-Casting...&otn=5&po=LVI&ps=63&clkid=6440588458152678934

 

[raybonz]

Check out these pics of this rebuilt older Consolidated Dutchwest. Federal Airtight I believe! I can't believe how good it looks!! This person did an incredible refinishing job. A bit pricy, but I'm sure it was a lot of work making it look this good!
http://cgi.ebay.com/Vermont-Casting...&otn=5&po=LVI&ps=63&clkid=6440588458152678934

Boy that stove is cherry! It is the exact same stove as mine except I don't have the rear heat shield, warming racks or brass rail.. I have everything else in those pics including the round 6" flue outlet (came with oval too).. These stoves came with everything Chris including the ashbin, gloves, wood carrier and firetools with stand plus spare door latch threaded knobs, furnace cement and all the coal burning stuff plus a cooktop without the cat probe recess and hole... Mine is still in good condition but some parts may be hard or impossible to get new now such as the inner top.. If that ever lets go I'd probably have to retire it..

Ray

 

[VCBurner]

I'd like the warming shelves myself. I didn't know you had a non-probe gridlle top! Cool feature.
I thought you'd like this one Ray!

Does your inner top look like this? There's one on E Bay with this title: 30002233 Inner Top for Dutchwest Large Woodstove
Here's a link
http://cgi.ebay.com/30002233-Inner-...917?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3eff8a2cfd

 

[raybonz]

I'd like the warming shelves myself. I didn't know you had a non-probe gridlle top! Cool feature.
I thought you'd like this one Ray!

Does your inner top look like this? There's one on E Bay with this title: 30002233 Inner Top for Dutchwest Large Woodstove
Here's a link
http://cgi.ebay.com/30002233-Inner-...917?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3eff8a2cfd

Mine came with both a probe and non-probe griddle hot plate.. As for the top it is not the same as there is no place for a cat on that one... Must be a real old stove or some non-cat?

Ray

 

[VCBurner]

I guess you could always buy one for parts. I've seen some, both older CDW's and newer models for as low as $200-300 on CL.

 

[raybonz]

I guess you could always buy one for parts. I've seen some, both older CDW's and newer models for as low as $200-300 on CL.

I think you got a great deal on your stove plus you can get any parts you need.. There is site that may custom make some of those obscure parts called Woodsmans part plus http://www.woodmanspartsplus.com/68/catalogs/Wood-and-Coal-Stove-Manufacturers-Cross-Reference.html . I think they have a foundry up in NH or access to one.. Bought a fixed center grate for my stove from them last year..

Ray

 

[VCBurner]

Check out this video on U Tube, too bad it’s in Japanese. No wonder the Orientals are going to take over the world! No one could come up with a video like this here? They’d rather just say: burning fires is more an art than a science. As if this adds to the mistique of fire burning. Dutchwest Japan just studied the stove and broke it down to simple terms! Unbelievable!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk3AobjJB64&feature=related

 

[BrowningBAR]

Check out this video on U Tube, too bad it’s in Japanese. No wonder the Orientals are going to take over the world! No one could come up with a video like this here? They’d rather just say: burning fires is more an art than a science. As if this adds to the mistique of fire burning. Dutchwest Japan just studied the stove and broke it down to simple terms! Unbelievable!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk3AobjJB64&feature=related

Orientals are rugs.

 

[VCBurner]

Check out this video on U Tube, too bad it’s in Japanese. No wonder the Orientals are going to take over the world! No one could come up with a video like this here? They’d rather just say: burning fires is more an art than a science. As if this adds to the mistique of fire burning. Dutchwest Japan just studied the stove and broke it down to simple terms! Unbelievable!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk3AobjJB64&feature=related

Orientals are rugs.

:lol: LMAO, Really though did you watch the video Browning?

Am I being politically incorrect? I don't mean to sound like a jerk. Is the corect term Asian? Asia to me is a pretty large continent, I can't refer to all Asians as one thing, there are too many diverse countries. Anyway, the Japanese really hit this nail head on!

I learned two things today mostly from watching this video and thinking about it:

1)You should shut the secondary all the way while reloading the stove, to keep the cat from cooling off too fast.
2)Shutting the primary down all the way while reloading, will keep the smoke from coming out of the side door. The primary air comes down from above the glass door and washes the glass while going to the firebase. This forces the smoke down and out the door when it's open. If the primary air is shut, the smoke will get sucked in the door and up the flue, even if a little tries to roll out from the bottom splits.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Am I being politically incorrect? I don't mean to sound like a jerk. Is the corect term Asian? Asia to me is a pretty large continent, I can't refer to all Asians as one thing, there are too many diverse countries.

I don't actually care, I just thought it was funny. I knew an asian girl that would get upset every time someone called her oriental. Her reply would be "ORIENTALS ARE RUGS!"

 

[VCBurner]

I came across this site the other day:
http://www.discountstove.com/cdwidguide.html

It has a guide for recognizing Dutchwest stove models. I've yet to find out the exact year of production of my stove. Sometime between 1993 and the time I bought it in 2010. What I can't tell is if it is pre or post 1997. There were a few minor changes made in 1997. The guy who sold it to me says it was about 6-7 years old. But, I really don't know. There's a manufacture code in the back, no date. For the most part of it this stove has remained the same since 1993. Those stoves can use the same parts being made for the 2011 Dutchwest 2461. Not too many stoves around have withstood the test of time like this one.

 

[VCBurner]

I got a new steel cat a couple of days ago. Thanks Ray! It just got put in tonight and the first fire with it is under way! I took some pics to document the cat replacement. I'll update the thread with the results of the first burn. The pics are of the old ceramic cat with some cracks, the stove with the top off, the new and old side by side and the new cat in place. Yes those are my feet with sandals and socks :cheese:

Edit: I had no interim gasket to put around the cat so I stuffed a piece of rope gasket around the spots that it would fit. It did not fit all the way around the cat. There was only enough space to stuff the rope around half of the cat, the rest was pushed tightly against the cast iron. The part that fit the most rope was the part closest to the bypass damper. I added the last picture of the stove back together and the first fire after the new cat.

 

[VCBurner]

Wow! This cat lights off, I mean glowing, at 350 degrees! I can also engage the cat without having my wood all burned half to a crisp. I still have not had very high temps beyond 1000 though. I need a liner next, with an extention and a vacustack cap! Tomorrow, I'll load it up for an overnight with a full load of oak, just to see how hot I can get the cat.

Edit: Right now the cat is at 800 and glowing so bright that I can see its glow reflect off the top piece of wood in the firebox. I'm loving the heat coming out of this thing. Running this stove has become even better!
I'm going to try to play with the settings now to adjust to the new and totally improved cat. Anyone who needs a cat should seriously consider a stainless steel cat, awesome! This one cost me $50 plus $9 shipping from ebay, yes it usually costs near $190. I have to thank Raybonz again for this one, he's the one who found it. Thanks brother!

 

[raybonz]

Wow! This cat lights off, I mean glowing, at 350 degrees! I can also engage the cat without having my wood all burned half to a crisp. I still have not had very high temps beyond 1000 though. I need a liner next, with an extention and a vacustack cap! Tomorrow, I'll load it up for an overnight with a full load of oak, just to see how hot I can get the cat.

Edit: Right now the cat is at 800 and glowing so bright that I can see its glow reflect off the top piece of wood in the firebox. I'm loving the heat coming out of this thing. Running this stove has become even better!
I'm going to try to play with the settings now to adjust to the new and totally improved cat. Anyone who needs a cat should seriously consider a stainless steel cat, awesome! This one cost me $50 plus $9 shipping from ebay, yes it usually costs near $190. I have to thank Raybonz again for this one, he's the one who found it. Thanks brother!

Right on Chris! I knew you'd be amazed how well this cat performs! I did contact Woodstock Stoves and they do have the 6"x2" cat in S/S for $125.00 which is an excellent deal because these Sud Chemie cats may be the last of the Mohicans.. I find this stove much easier to run with the S/S cat and I am running catalytic in 5-10 mins now.. I am glad you like it and also that you got the same great deal that I did! The timing was right as you had mentioned that you needed a new cat and these popped up..

Ray

 

[raybonz]

I got a new steel cat a couple of days ago. Thanks Ray! It just got put in tonight and the first fire with it is under way! I took some pics to document the cat replacement. I'll update the thread with the results of the first burn. The pics are of the old ceramic cat with some cracks, the stove with the top off, the new and old side by side and the new cat in place. Yes those are my feet with sandals and socks :cheese:

Edit: I had no interim gasket to put around the cat so I stuffed a piece of rope gasket around the spots that it would fit. It did not fit all the way around the cat. There was only enough space to stuff the rope around half of the cat, the rest was pushed tightly against the cast iron. The part that fit the most rope was the part closest to the bypass damper. I added the last picture of the stove back together and the first fire after the new cat.

I like the design of your stove better than this old one.. I can see it has better airflow characteristics around the cat and also along the back and over the inner top.. Your stove looks like it is in good condition..

Ray

 

[VCBurner]

Right on Chris! I knew you'd be amazed how well this cat performs! I did contact Woodstock Stoves and they do have the 6"x2" cat in S/S for $125.00 which is an excellent deal because these Sud Chemie cats may be the last of the Mohicans.. I find this stove much easier to run with the S/S cat and I am running catalytic in 5-10 mins now.. I am glad you like it and also that you got the same great deal that I did! The timing was right as you had mentioned that you needed a new cat and these popped up..

Ray

Oh yeah! It is so much easier knowing the cat will engage when you shut the bypass! I tried at 350 cat probe temp this morning, while the cat was still dark and it was almost automatic, the glow was there in a matter of seconds. I didn't reload until 9am, right now it is glowing red. Each time I start the reload I'll try to engage a little earlier to see how quickly I can do it. I'm still testing the waters. But so far I'm totally impressed with the SS cat. Anyone thinking of replacing theirs should definitely get one of these. Like you said, even at $125 from Woodstock it would still be a deal. What do you mean about last of the Mohicans? Are they not producing them anymore?

I like the design of your stove better than this old one.. I can see it has better airflow characteristics around the cat and also along the back and over the inner top.. Your stove looks like it is in good condition..

Ray

I lucked out with this one. All the parts are in good shape, nothing's warped and the old cat lasted just long enough for me to get a new one. The old cat still functions too, so I'll hang on to it just in case. The pictures of the secondary chamber and convection chamber is a bit misleading due to the dirty look and flash that makes it look even worse. I vaccum the chamber each time, but there is surprisingly little fly ash build up in the cat chamber. This is not a high maintenance stove in that reguard, or any aspect in my eyes. Keeping in mind this is my first EPA stove. I'm still very pleased with this stove, even more now that it has a supercharged cat!

 

[raybonz]

Right on Chris! I knew you'd be amazed how well this cat performs! I did contact Woodstock Stoves and they do have the 6"x2" cat in S/S for $125.00 which is an excellent deal because these Sud Chemie cats may be the last of the Mohicans.. I find this stove much easier to run with the S/S cat and I am running catalytic in 5-10 mins now.. I am glad you like it and also that you got the same great deal that I did! The timing was right as you had mentioned that you needed a new cat and these popped up..

Ray

Oh yeah! It is so much easier knowing the cat will engage when you shut the bypass! I tried at 350 cat probe temp this morning, while the cat was still dark and it was almost automatic, the glow was there in a matter of seconds. I didn't reload until 9am, right now it is glowing red. Each time I start the reload I'll try to engage a little earlier to see how quickly I can do it. I'm still testing the waters. But so far I'm totally impressed with the SS cat. Anyone thinking of replacing theirs should definitely get one of these. Like you said, even at $125 from Woodstock it would still be a deal. What do you mean about last of the Mohicans? Are they not producing them anymore?

I like the design of your stove better than this old one.. I can see it has better airflow characteristics around the cat and also along the back and over the inner top.. Your stove looks like it is in good condition..

Ray

I lucked out with this one. All the parts are in good shape, nothing's warped and the old cat lasted just long enough for me to get a new one. The old cat still functions too, so I'll hang on to it just in case. The pictures of the secondary chamber and convection chamber is a bit misleading due to the dirty look and flash that makes it look even worse. I vaccum the chamber each time, but there is surprisingly little fly ash build up in the cat chamber. This is not a high maintenance stove in that reguard, or any aspect in my eyes. Keeping in mind this is my first EPA stove. I'm still very pleased with this stove, even more now that it has a supercharged cat!

What I mean is I have not seen another Sud Chemie cat on e-bay since those 3 surfaced and all at the same time.. Sud Chemie only manufactures S/S cats for Condar now so you have 2 choices at least on our particular cat size..

1) You buy them for $125.00 from Woodstock (the best option for a 6"x2" S/S cat)
2) You buy them from Condar for the exorbitant price of $179.00 (I suspect some serious price gouging going on here!)

$54.00 more from Condar?? Really??? Obviously they are making a killing here! I tip my hat to Woodstock once again they have impressed me! They will be a serious contender if/when I upgrade...

Ray

 

[kpauley]

I have a 2461 and was trying to locate a blower for it, I see you mentioning it in this great thread. I see it referenced in the manual but it doesn't show any part number and I'm trying to source one and see more pictures of what it looks like. If you have a p/n or any other info that could help me in finding where to get one it would be great.

Also, I see you referenced a top - down load or start, what does that mean?

 

[raybonz]

I have a 2461 and was trying to locate a blower for it, I see you mentioning it in this great thread. I see it referenced in the manual but it doesn't show any part number and I'm trying to source one and see more pictures of what it looks like. If you have a p/n or any other info that could help me in finding where to get one it would be great.

Also, I see you referenced a top - down load or start, what does that mean?

http://www.electricmotorwarehouse.com/fasco/fasco_blower.htm .. Look at 50747-D401 the important thing is the blower flange diameter.. I am pretty sure I have the Dayton 4c440 on my stove and added a bat handle toggle switch to it at the motor junction box.. I also drilled the flange to reorient the blower.. Oil it once or twice a yr. and it will last you a decade..

Or look here: http://www.electricmotorwarehouse.com/dayton_blower.htm and look at blower 1TDN7 ...

Ray

 

[VCBurner]

I have a 2461 and was trying to locate a blower for it, I see you mentioning it in this great thread. I see it referenced in the manual but it doesn't show any part number and I'm trying to source one and see more pictures of what it looks like. If you have a p/n or any other info that could help me in finding where to get one it would be great.

Also, I see you referenced a top - down load or start, what does that mean?

Welcome to the forum kpauley,

The part #for the cdw fan kit is 0009973. This is without the rheostat. (Dutchwest Stove Thermostat Blower Fan Control Part #000FT1)
I wish I had the rheostat on mine. But like Ray said, you can adapt other fans to this stove, in some cases the fan may even be a better fan than the ones they sell for these stoves. Although, I've had no problem with mine at all, and it comes with the block off plates for the bottom of the stove where the convection air would come in. With the fan on the 2461 you need to block off these inlets in order to blow the air out of the intended outlet.

Top down is kind of like starting a fire in reverse. Big splits on the bottom and smaller at the top with kindling to top it off. This lights the fire from the top of the pile and spreads down. It is great, because you don't have to add splits to the top of the fire, which often smothers the fire, killing its intensity. I sort of use a modified top down now, two logs front and back, kindling in the middle with increasing kindling to small splits on top. Laying small kindling bridging across the two logs and building up from there. The top down fires are great, though, because you generally don't have to add anything to it once it's lit. They take a little longer to generate heat but are more hands off once started.

Glad you liked the thread hope it helps you! Here's a picture of what the fan looks like: