What to do with the existing chimney?

[Soopah 27]

Hi Guys,

Longtime lurker, first time poster...

Planning a new istall in Southwestern Ontario (our 1st) in our dining room/kitchen area of 2 story L shaped farmhouse (1890)
Area is approx 360 sq ft and open, ceiling is at 9ft. House is leaky - but getting tighter by the day...

Hoping to install a Super 27 this year, but realize it is late.

The last installer here threw us a curve-ball, (our old exterior masonry chimney). I had not considered using the old chimney. We had planned a corner install - with the chimney going straight up through the second floor - to the roof. The old chimney had just been sitting there quietly and I had forgotten about it. (we recently installed a new high eff furnace & elec water heat)

While it's not being used - the suggestion of lining the old ext chimney didn't thrill me. ...And the suggested install thrilled me less - with 2 90 degree bends, required to reach the old chimney. Installer was WETT certified & insisted it WOULD draft.

Here's the question - is there any way that it is worth doing? Would it make any more sense to attach to the old chimney on the second floor? The old chimney is just sitting there...and I will have to deal with it one way or the other.

We could change from a corner install, to flat on the chimney wall - to eliminate one of the 90 degree bends, but it may not look as nice. Center of chimney is approx 4 ft away from the corner.

(Quotes for the straight-up install are coming in around $2,500 I assume lining the old chimney will cost a lot less.)

We don't want to sacrifice performance for saving a few bucks.

Any ideas?

(I know what John Gulland would say)

 

[webbie]

Answer: it depends!

First question - can you insulate the liner? If not, I might nix the idea.

Variables like climate do matter in this case. If you were in North Carolina I might say it could work without insulation.

Another thing - get a price on the liner - insulated. It might not be much less, and that may help your decision.

 

[Soopah 27]

Wow,

Thanks for the quick response! I'll check on the insulated liner tomorrow.

Masonry chimney is supposed to be 8". Would an insulated liner fit?

 

[webbie]

Probably will be a tough fit. If an 8x8 flue, the interior is usually 7" square or so, and the OD of a flex 6" pipe is about 6.5 - not much room!

 

[Soopah 27]

Well, I got the quote back from the contractor who wanted to use the existing chimney & the significant savings promised, by lining the old chimney - didn't pan out... The quote DID NOT specify an insulated liner, leading me to believe - one probably wouldn't be installed.

So, it looks like we'll be installing a new chimney, straight-up through the living space. With a different vendor...

Is 360 sq/ft too small a room to install a PE Summit?

 

[begreen]

I think you'll be glad in the long run that you are installing straight up in the interior of the house. It will draft better and will be much easier to clean.

RE: the Summit. That's a jump up from the mid-sized PE. How is this area connected to the rest of the house? Are there large connecting openings to the other area or smaller doors? Is there a stairwell adjacent to the stove area? If yes, is the ceiling flat and continuous to the stairwell or is there a doorway break in between? If you can post some pictures and/or a sketch that would help.

 

[Soopah 27]

RE: the Summit. That's a jump up from the mid-sized PE. How is this area connected to the rest of the house? Are there large connecting openings to the other area or smaller doors? Is there a stairwell adjacent to the stove area? If yes, is the ceiling flat and continuous to the stairwell or is there a doorway break in between? If you can post some pictures and/or a sketch that would help.

The area is connected by 2 small doors on the south side of the room. Stove will be in the North/west corner. Stairwell is also on south side of room. But, the ceiling is definately not flat. The ceiling joists are currently exposed. (they run east to west)

Will this be a big restriction to air movement? My plan was to leave the celing joists about 4" proud from the surface of the sheetrock - (currently no sheetrock installed) for an exposed beam effect. I may rethink this - if it will cause air movement to "stall" in the dining room.

 

[begreen]

Great diagram. Stick with the Super 27. It looks like you will get good heating on the first floor and some benefit on the second. Don't worry about the exposed ceiling joists. I was asking about something more like a door or archway significantly below the ceiling. You should be fine.

 

[Soopah 27]

OK thanks, I was getting worried about the exposed joists...

Diagram is via an OLD version of Home Architect, very simple to use and CHEAP ($6 on auction site)

 

[elkimmeg]

If the chimney flues and b general condition is good condition rhen why not use it as it stands? an 8/8 clay flue interior location may not need an insulated liner the insulation would only be needed of the chimney and clay liners were in disrepair.

Again if the chimney is in decent shap then just connect to it most 6" stoves will work quite well connected to an interior 8/8 flue Many will argue with good grounds that is the best possible flue
the masonry mass heats up stores the heat and continues to promote a strong draft. Works rather well for me for 2 stoves

 

[Soopah 27]

If the chimney flues and b general condition is good condition rhen why not use it as it stands? an 8/8 clay flue interior location may not need an insulated liner the insulation would only be needed of the chimney and clay liners were in disrepair.

Elk,

The Existing chimney is on the Exterior. It is in pretty good shape, about 20 years old, but we didn't see a big price advantage in lining the old girl. So, I'm going to shy away from going that route. With my limited knowlege of stove operation - I don't want to take a chance with less than optimum draft etc... that lining the old ext chimney may provide.

So - a new interior chimney it is.

I'd rather be safe than sorry... :coolsmile: