i repeat my last post THAT IS JUST THIS ONE MAN'S OPINION. and i thought that this forum was for opinion and to educate from experience. if this is not that type of web site than i will leave it and you can preach what ever you feel you have to
Why so much hate over electric vehicles?
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Yes of course this is for opinions and education. And some people have opinions that differ from yours. I will say it's doubtful I will buy one until the battery tech improves as well but not because of fire danger. I am more concerned with better range and better charging times. Which I am sure will come.
No offense. You don't need to buy an EV if you don't want to.
But I'm entitled to look at stats rather than anecdotes if I want to.
EbS-P
Minister of Fire
The fire risk is real for property or those inside a property but low for the driver. All the deaths in the Teslas that have burned would have resulted in deaths in and ICE. Two things. I would have t consider if I would park in an attached garage. (Probably would but would make sure I had a fire rated door t it and smoke detector in garage and no holes in h ceiling to the attic. )
Those are all things any attached garages should already have. As well as co detector with the smoke. Those should also be linked to the ones in the home
EbS-P
Minister of Fire
Should yes….. but a house built 60 years ago and remodeled a time or 3, it’s doubtful down here. The integrated smoke detector is the key.
Oh I know many don't have them. I was just saying it's not something that is unique to having an ev. Every attached garage should have that regardless and I would without question do it if I had one
Stay calm, you are not alone in your opinion. It's a rational concern. The odds of a lithium battery fire are very low, but on occasion, it does happen. My guess is that it will not be an issue for much longer. The industry is aware and changing. There are other chemistries, including some lithium varieties, that do not have this issue. You will see them coming online in the coming years. BYD is building the first sodium ion battery plant right now. Toyota has announced it will be selling cars with solid state batteries in 2 yrs.
I'm actually a little more concerned about the small motor industry changing. Things like lawn mowers, drills, etc. There are a lot more of them out there than EVs right now. Still, if the risk was high, the insurance companies would make an exception and charge for coverage. To my knowledge they do not, but I am not an insurance expert.
Kiddie has ones that do it wirelessly I have them in my house and even the detached garage next to the house
you have one in your garage? around here the fire dept mandates only heat detectors in the garage. one for each bay. anyone that has put a c/o or smoke detector in their garage it goes off everytime they start a car. both types. i suppose if you don't have a gas or diesel car it's worth doing. but the problem is with the detector itself. with temps. the fire dept. wants a smoke up in the attic but the smoke detector in the directions will tell you not for a space that is over 104 degrees every attic i've been in is hotter than that in the summer
back to electric cars i did here that about toyota's. they said that the average vehicle will go about 900 miles to the charge. that's not bad but they didn't get into the details of how much charging it will take. they said in about 2025 it will be. but then again they said they were doing a diesel engine for the tundra years ago. yes they are 500,000 mile trucks but the average people driving them around here is 10 mpg. that's a little tuff to take with every other truck getting teens and 20's to the gallon
bogieb
Minister of Fire
My 60+ year old home never had any detectors at all until I put some in when I moved here 10 years ago (smoke/fire as well as CO - all battery operated).
Never thought of putting any detectors in the garage since most of my fire dangers are inside the living part (my vehicle doesn't fit - very few vehicles would fit). Of course even when I had a small car that I did park in the garage, I never thought of a fire/smoke detector. Hmmm, maybe I should start thinking about that.
I have plenty of fire risks I'm willing to live with: 2 pellet stoves (which are primary heat), 2 propane tanks next to the house that run my combi-boiler (which I really only use the HW function) and cook stove. And then of course I have Li-on batteries for all my Ryobi tools. I don't think the chances for issues with an EV or hybrid would keep me from getting one if it fit my needs and circumstances.
Mine has only gone off if you let a car idle in the garage for 10 mins or so
DBoon
Minister of Fire
Nobody is getting upset or taking things personally, but we are challenging anecdotal statements that are presented as hard truths and personal belief systems that present facts as one person's opinions. If you look again at the replies your post generated, then perhaps you see why it generated the replies it did.
It's fine to express an opinion about your risk tolerance based on what you personally have knowledge of vs. the benefit you see to the risk-taking activity (i.e., "A firefighter I know had to put out an EV fire and I wouldn't want a fire in my attached garage, and I don't really value what EVs provide anyways; therefore I don't find the risk of having an EV outweighing the benefits of having an EV."). Just don't expect that opinion to apply to everyone and/or if you don't get broad agreement on that opinion that people are taking your post personally. They are not.
Frankly, I am sure that there are plenty of people on this forum who would go skydiving because they find the reward pretty awesome and the risk really, really low. I would not go skydiving - that is not within my risk/reward formula, no matter what statistics people would give me about deaths per 100,000 for skydiving. And yet I have routinely bicycled on crowded roads in dense areas (within the last 5 years), and in wintertime with snow on the road (many years ago). That is surely more risky that falling through air from a plane (and I have one accident at 20 mph with the side of a bus to prove it), and yet I keep cycling. I also play ice hockey a couple of times a week, still, despite everyone I know telling my about that horrible hockey death in the UK a couple of months back. Everyone's risk/reward threshold is different for different things. That's fine.
There are plenty of places to go that are simply echo chambers. Some would allege that this is one of those places. I would disagree. Your opinion or beliefs might be in the minority but I think you will find that people on this forum are willing to listen if you are willing to explain. That's called a conversation. But if you simply want to state an opinion and have everyone line up to agree with you and you are frustrated when they do not, then that is not a conversation.
No, I didn't read all 9 pages of this thread lol. That said...
Wind and or solar doesn't produce enough electricity to charge a country full of EVs, probably never will, especially in the NE USA climate. So until someone comes up with a better mouse trap the need to burn fossil fuel to charge batteries for EVs, tools, electric stoves, water heaters, etc., will continue. Nuke would work but that's being shut down, at least in NYS. So at this point in time EVs aren't much if any cleaner to operate than gassers. EVs aren't going to have much if any affect on climate change, which is cyclical anyways so there's that.
So I could cease fiddling with small gas engines, I went from gas to electric for my weed whacker and also bought an e-chainsaw. Both work great and glad I made that choice. Key word is "choice".
Wind and or solar doesn't produce enough electricity to charge a country full of EVs, probably never will, especially in the NE USA climate. So until someone comes up with a better mouse trap the need to burn fossil fuel to charge batteries for EVs, tools, electric stoves, water heaters, etc., will continue. Nuke would work but that's being shut down, at least in NYS. So at this point in time EVs aren't much if any cleaner to operate than gassers. EVs aren't going to have much if any affect on climate change, which is cyclical anyways so there's that.
So I could cease fiddling with small gas engines, I went from gas to electric for my weed whacker and also bought an e-chainsaw. Both work great and glad I made that choice. Key word is "choice".
Might want to check the latest stats, things are changing fast. Wind and solar generated 16% of US electricity in 2023, far more than consumed by the US's measly couple million EVs. More than coal last year, btw. Nuke generation is still near its historic peak, and is only like 18%.
Solar and wind generation is expected to triple by 2030, saving us all money in the process, while a full fleet of EVs (not expected before 2040) is only expected to use half that much juice (about 25% more than current total generation).
Since 40+% of the grid is run off natural gas, you could say that EVs are run off natural gas. But since EVs use only a quarter of the energy per mile as a gasoline car, and natural gas turbines are way more efficient than gasoline engines... BEVs come out way ahead on emissions on US average grid electricity. Like <1/3rd the emissions per mile currently and getting better as the grid gets greener.
The transition will be all about choice and lower cost. The scolds that think otherwise are all in the same unpopular camp as Carter's cardigan.
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EVs look like just expensive toys to me because the energy costs of making EVs are so much higher than making ICE vehicles. Over the life of the vehicle, the energy cost is still lower in an ICE vehicle. And then there are the toxic death cloud unquenchable battery fires. So I'll wait a while to see if this is more than just a fad. For actual green mileage, I'll keep riding a bike.
Based on what assumptions?
In spite of knowing that there are many more ICE fires yearly?
they absolutely are being shoved down our throats. Biden signed a bill where the Army Corp of engineers are required to purchase utility EV’s to service their property. Problem is they cannot get them due to parts shortages plus they have zero charging stations. This administration is not using any common sense in the way they are forcing EV’s before the infrastructure is ready.…in the same manner they tried to force the clot shot on everybody. The price of the vehicles are far beyond what averagecAmeruicans can afford, parts and repair facilities cannot keep up.
Due to the current administration’s war against energy production the electric companies cannot keep up with the electric demand even without EV’s in every driveway. We already have brownouts now during peak usage times.
California and now other states have passed laws where manufactures will not be permitted to sell new gassers in the near future… do you not see that? Do you really have to ask???
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No it’s just common sense to ask questions when the party pushing something turns out to be some of the largest users of what they want to limit for the rest of us.
Enough of the politics. There have been energy brownouts long before EVs hit the scene. There is no war against energy production. Quite the contrary.
US Army corp POV-
Huntsville Center answers charge to electrify Army’s vehicle fleet
Electric vehicle charging stations have begun popping up at Army installations across the Nation, less than a year after the Army announced plans to reduce its climate impacts by decreasing fossil
www.hnc.usace.army.mil
US Army ready to pursue electric light recon vehicle
The Army evaluated General Motors’ Hummer EV, a Canoo platform and a Lordstown Motors truck.
www.defensenews.com
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It’s only going to get worse considering how EV’s are being forced on us
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