Woodstove decision/heating

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Jaison

Member
Dec 2, 2022
67
Connecticut
Making this post for a family member -
He is currently wanting to upgrade his stove to heat his home better and is looking towards the BK Ashford 30.2. We are wondering if this will enough to heat his home - here are details.

He currently has a Jotul v1 Oslo f500, but burn times are not long enough for him and not enough heat output.

The freestanding stove is in the center of the house with vaulted ceiling ~22-23 feet high In the 300sqft living room, everywhere else is about 8 feet high, and above the stove is the 3/4 story living area. Total living area is about 2060 sqft. Home is well insulated and has two ceiling fans above the stove where the 3/4 upstairs living area is.
 
Well seeing how the stove is in an area that is equivalent to 900-1000 sqft (stove ratings are typically on 8ft ceilings.., so you have to adjust for volume of area too), so total area that is being asked to heat is around 2600-2700sqft. Not many stoves can take care of that, probably none in this blast of cold we have been seeing. If he wants to upgrade to the BK, that is a pretty stove too. In this weather, the stove ratings I would cut in half, that's how cold its been. We have been inundated with calls that "my stove, my fireplace, my furnace is not heating like normal." Good luck with your search.
 
Well seeing how the stove is in an area that is equivalent to 900-1000 sqft (stove ratings are typically on 8ft ceilings.., so you have to adjust for volume of area too), so total area that is being asked to heat is around 2600-2700sqft. Not many stoves can take care of that, probably none in this blast of cold we have been seeing. If he wants to upgrade to the BK, that is a pretty stove too. In this weather, the stove ratings I would cut in half, that's how cold its been. We have been inundated with calls that "my stove, my fireplace, my furnace is not heating like normal." Good luck with your search.
Thanks for the response. While he is looking at the Ashford because of the long burn times, any stove that has good heat output and rated for decent burn times (at least 10 hours) will do. He just wants to know his options and if he should go catalytic stove or not. I brought up the PE Summit, and Lopi liberty.
 
I agree with you, the summit and liberty would be great choices, but if winter is normal for them in NC, that might be too much stove. Its hard to cover all desires, and stay within comfort too. If it does get too hot inside, I guess you can always "burp" the house, have windows open for a while.
 
You can make a little fire in the big burner. Can't make a small stove burn more than it's capacity. Any of the mentioned stove's should work. The cat preference is pretty much a preference. Cat has to be replaced after so many hours. Non-cat no replacement but the Ashford probably has the edge on amount of heat and burn time. Just my .02
 
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He is in Connecticut too
I agree with you, the summit and liberty would be great choices, but if winter is normal for them in NC, that might be too much stove. It’s hard to cover all desires, and stay within comfort too. If it does get too hot inside, I guess you can always "burp" the house, have windows open for a while.
 
OMG- sorry! Forget all I said about getting too much stove... I mixed this answer to something else I was reading on, I apologize. Get the biggest, most aesthetically pleasing stove then, he can use all the BTUs he can get in this crazy cold...
 
Easiest transition would be to another secondary tube stove. My guess is the F500 is getting leaky.

I like the PE T6. More budget friendly but less pretty options exist from Drolet, Osborn.

I’d throw out a Woodstock Ideal steel too
 
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We haven’t looked at Woodstock yet. My question with the ashford - and I’d like to get your opinions - would it have no issue heating his house? I see on low it’s rated at 10k btu/hr steady heat. On high about 9 hours at 30k Btu/hr.
 
I do not have experience with a Jotul Oslo, but I looked up the firebox size, and I found some estimates on Hearth that said it was about 2.2 cubic feet of usable volume. The manufacturer says that the Ashford is 2.9, I believe. I am currently sitting in front of my Sirocco, which is the same firebox as the Ashford, but without the cast iron cladding, and I can put a large amount of wood in there, but I've never measured to see if the 2.9 is really accurate. All things being equal, a larger firebox should yield longer burns with more btu's produced. I have heard reports that the Blaze King thermostat limits the high end enough that it can't produce enough heat, but I'd be surprised if that's a problem in a well-insulated house.

We live in Virginia, so a warmer climate than Connecticut, but even with the recent cold spell that has been quite sustained down here, our Sirocco has not struggled in any way and hasn't really had to be pushed. We've often burned just two loads a day, though for a day a two we added a quick small third load, but that was mostly just an opportunity to burn it on high to get rid of some punky poplar and clear the firebox of creosote. After one of those loads, we even let the stove go cold for a few hours because it would have been too warm had we stoked it right away. Come to think of it, it was probably still two loads a day, just that one of them was quick and hot, and the other was longer and lower.

Our house is new construction and well insulated and air sealed. We do have an outside air kit that brings fresh air to the stove. It heats approximately 2,700 square feet, the majority of which is on the main floor where the stove is fairly centrally located, but a good portion is up a flight of stairs. All our ceilings are the standard eight feet, however, so we don't have heat pocketing up in a ceiling area.

I will say that we have chosen to let our electric heat cycle from time to time during this cold snap just to move some warmer air to our unfinished basement and our conditioned attic, but the stove has not needed any supplementation. If we didn't want to circulate air to those other areas, the stove could easily take on more heating in our house.

I'm wondering about the two complaints about the Oslo, though. I can understand wanting longer burn time which can be achieved by any stove with a bigger firebox, but I am curious about the "not enough heat." Is it not enough heat ever, or is not enough heat with the loading schedule that the relative is able to maintain? Put another way, is it that stoking the Oslo round the clock doesn't provide enough heat, or is it that it's plenty warm in the evening with a good fire blazing, but the house cools before morning because the stove goes cold, and it's playing catch up after that?

I'm asking those questions, because if it's only a matter of needing a bigger firebox, the Ashford is larger from what I read, and that will be helpful. If the Oslo isn't able to provide enough heat even when stoked regularly, though, I would question the burning practices or the wood or the construction of the house causing something not to work well, and a different stove may well not help.

We do feel that we benefit a lot from the thermostatic control of the stove. A large tube stove would be too hot for us on many occasions. The drawback is the blackened glass that occurs when burning on low. People often say that burning a Blaze King on high negates the advantages of a cat as the burn times reduce to similarly sized non-cat stoves. That may well be true, but I haven't had to burn my stove on high regularly to find out. I think by keeping the house consistently warm, a high burn becomes less necessary, but again I live farther south and in perhaps a sunnier area. Maybe others with Blaze Kings in colder climates can speak to this. Does @Poindexter still visit here?
@stoveliker ? @Dieselhead ?
 
it all depends on how well insulated the place is.
I think the (modern) f500 (at least from what I can find online) has a similar range of heat output as a BK. So you would not gain much there unless the current stove is leaking and therefore putting out less than what it could.

If it is the reload schedule that's the issue, then you'll have a longer burn time (at the same output) with the BK because of the larger firebox.
If it's BTUs per hour that you need, then I'm not sure the BK is going to help.
 
I'm wondering about the two complaints about the Oslo, though. I can understand wanting longer burn time which can be achieved by any stove with a bigger firebox, but I am curious about the "not enough heat." Is it not enough heat ever, or is not enough heat with the loading schedule that the relative is able to maintain? Put another way, is it that stoking the Oslo round the clock doesn't provide enough heat, or is it that it's plenty warm in the evening with a good fire blazing, but the house cools before morning because the stove goes cold, and it's playing catch up after that?
The stove is hot, but not hot enough to maintain heat and temperatures without constant feeding, which is something he isn’t looking to do, especially at night. It provides good enough heat in the evenings when he is home to feed it, but at night he isn’t looking to wake up in the middle Of the night to feed it, so he is playing catch up. You can imagine with that high of a ceiling how much it cools down.

Maybe Hearthstone Mansfield? I forgot all about hearthstone.
 
it all depends on how well insulated the place is.
I think the (modern) f500 (at least from what I can find online) has a similar range of heat output as a BK. So you would not gain much there unless the current stove is leaking and therefore putting out less than what it could.

If it is the reload schedule that's the issue, then you'll have a longer burn time (at the same output) with the BK because of the larger firebox.
If it's BTUs per hour that you need, then I'm not sure the BK is going to help.
I forgot Hearthstone existed to be honest, they have good hybrid stoves. The Mansfield or the GM80 look like good stoves with decent BTU output for the first few hours at least - with 30 hour burn times on low. Not much information on the BTU output on low though or if it is constant like the blaze king.
 
One important question- if the Oslo is not keeping up now, did it keep up on our more recent milder winters? If so, then obviously the cold is creating a need for more heat readily being available. If so, then the biggest stove he can get would be a benefit, espec if he doesn't want to overly maintain the stove. A large BK might be the right answer, so when (and hopefully if) our winters are less cold. In this weather, no one's stove is keeping up without more feeding, or having had more stove than normally needed. From what I'm reading, this Oslo has performed pretty well, considering the volume its being asked to heat.
 
One important question- if the Oslo is not keeping up now, did it keep up on our more recent milder winters? If so, then obviously the cold is creating a need for more heat readily being available. If so, then the biggest stove he can get would be a benefit, espec if he doesn't want to overly maintain the stove. A large BK might be the right answer, so when (and hopefully if) our winters are less cold. In this weather, no one's stove is keeping up without more feeding, or having had more stove than normally needed. From what I'm reading, this Oslo has performed pretty well, considering the volume its being asked to heat.
It kept up a decent amount but he is definitely looking for a stove with longer burn times with just as much heat output or more where he won’t have to reload at night. The Blaze King looks good for burn time but that BTU output even in mild winters, say 20-30 degree nights, I’m not sure if you’d even feel the heat with that cathedral ceiling. I could be wrong.

But then there’s the Hearthstone Heritage or the GM80, the largest they have that are hybrids that seem to be the best of both worlds.
 
homes with cathedral ceilings benefit a lot from a ceiling fan running in reverse; not pushing down creating a wind you can feel (as cold draft) but sucking up air to displace the warm air pooled up there.

A more radiative stove also works better there than a convective one - like feeling an IR heating panel on your body.
 
I do not have experience with a Jotul Oslo, but I looked up the firebox size, and I found some estimates on Hearth that said it was about 2.2 cubic feet of usable volume. The manufacturer says that the Ashford is 2.9, I believe. I am currently sitting in front of my Sirocco, which is the same firebox as the Ashford, but without the cast iron cladding, and I can put a large amount of wood in there, but I've never measured to see if the 2.9 is really accurate. All things being equal, a larger firebox should yield longer burns with more btu's produced. I have heard reports that the Blaze King thermostat limits the high end enough that it can't produce enough heat, but I'd be surprised if that's a problem in a well-insulated house.

We live in Virginia, so a warmer climate than Connecticut, but even with the recent cold spell that has been quite sustained down here, our Sirocco has not struggled in any way and hasn't really had to be pushed. We've often burned just two loads a day, though for a day a two we added a quick small third load, but that was mostly just an opportunity to burn it on high to get rid of some punky poplar and clear the firebox of creosote. After one of those loads, we even let the stove go cold for a few hours because it would have been too warm had we stoked it right away. Come to think of it, it was probably still two loads a day, just that one of them was quick and hot, and the other was longer and lower.

Our house is new construction and well insulated and air sealed. We do have an outside air kit that brings fresh air to the stove. It heats approximately 2,700 square feet, the majority of which is on the main floor where the stove is fairly centrally located, but a good portion is up a flight of stairs. All our ceilings are the standard eight feet, however, so we don't have heat pocketing up in a ceiling area.

I will say that we have chosen to let our electric heat cycle from time to time during this cold snap just to move some warmer air to our unfinished basement and our conditioned attic, but the stove has not needed any supplementation. If we didn't want to circulate air to those other areas, the stove could easily take on more heating in our house.

I'm wondering about the two complaints about the Oslo, though. I can understand wanting longer burn time which can be achieved by any stove with a bigger firebox, but I am curious about the "not enough heat." Is it not enough heat ever, or is not enough heat with the loading schedule that the relative is able to maintain? Put another way, is it that stoking the Oslo round the clock doesn't provide enough heat, or is it that it's plenty warm in the evening with a good fire blazing, but the house cools before morning because the stove goes cold, and it's playing catch up after that?

I'm asking those questions, because if it's only a matter of needing a bigger firebox, the Ashford is larger from what I read, and that will be helpful. If the Oslo isn't able to provide enough heat even when stoked regularly, though, I would question the burning practices or the wood or the construction of the house causing something not to work well, and a different stove may well not help.

We do feel that we benefit a lot from the thermostatic control of the stove. A large tube stove would be too hot for us on many occasions. The drawback is the blackened glass that occurs when burning on low. People often say that burning a Blaze King on high negates the advantages of a cat as the burn times reduce to similarly sized non-cat stoves. That may well be true, but I haven't had to burn my stove on high regularly to find out. I think by keeping the house consistently warm, a high burn becomes less necessary, but again I live farther south and in perhaps a sunnier area. Maybe others with Blaze Kings in colder climates can speak to this. Does @Poindexter still visit here?
@stoveliker ? @Dieselhead ?
We have been cold in CT this year! The stove has been fine with it, usually doing 12 hour overnight reloads of hardwood and 12 hour daytime loads of softwood. Heating 3ksqft open floor plan with 9ft ceilings and lots of French doors and windows. We’ve been sub zero and run the stove with a wispy flame and blower on medium. Freezing and above our burn times increase greatly. I do have the largest stove they currently make. Not apples to oranges comparison as our houses are different as well.
 
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homes with cathedral ceilings benefit a lot from a ceiling fan running in reverse; not pushing down creating a wind you can feel (as cold draft) but sucking up air to displace the warm air pooled up there.

A more radiative stove also works better there than a convective one - like feeling an IR heating panel on your body.
He does have two ceiling fans above the stove right on top of the 3/4 upper floor. I agree, more radiating heat in a home like that the better, so that probably eliminates the soapstone stoves.
 
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I’m living with a soapstone stove (Progress) and I’ve never felt radiative heat like this. It’s really nice. It’s not that too-hot-by-the-stove and then gone 10 feet away. It’s like a force.
 
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@John Lehet , I've never experienced a soapstone stove and would love to. We regularly used soapstone footwarmers in our house growing up. My mom still has hers that she used in northern Vermont as a child, and we bought some smaller ones for all our kids when we were living with her a while back. I'm afraid that they don't get as much use nowadays, but they still stay by our stove and get put to use occasionally.

@Jaison , does your relative have an infrared temperature gun he can use to find out just how much heat is pooling in that cathedral ceiling? Even though you say the house is well insulated, I'm wondering if there's a bigger source of heat loss up there. I admit that I can't really picture the living space above that you describe, and I wonder how heat moves there. I also wonder how hot the top of his Jotul is when it's cruising on a load.

Just out of curiosity, I tested the stove top of our BK Sirocco just now. The stove thermostat is turned very low, but my husband stoked it maybe an hour and a half ago with a load of tulip poplar, and it's putting off over 500 degrees in the center where the cat is. The sides are shielded and are only around 125 right now.

We had a night in the twenties last night instead of in the teens or single digits, and my husband actually got up and shut the stove blower off completely as he was a little warm.
 
I’m living with a soapstone stove (Progress) and I’ve never felt radiative heat like this. It’s really nice. It’s not that too-hot-by-the-stove and then gone 10 feet away. It’s like a force.
I’ve never been in the room with a soapstone stove before, but that sounds nice!
@John Lehet , I've never experienced a soapstone stove and would love to. We regularly used soapstone footwarmers in our house growing up. My mom still has hers that she used in northern Vermont as a child, and we bought some smaller ones for all our kids when we were living with her a while back. I'm afraid that they don't get as much use nowadays, but they still stay by our stove and get put to use occasionally.

@Jaison , does your relative have an infrared temperature gun he can use to find out just how much heat is pooling in that cathedral ceiling? Even though you say the house is well insulated, I'm wondering if there's a bigger source of heat loss up there. I admit that I can't really picture the living space above that you describe, and I wonder how heat moves there. I also wonder how hot the top of his Jotul is when it's cruising on a load.

Just out of curiosity, I tested the stove top of our BK Sirocco just now. The stove thermostat is turned very low, but my husband stoked it maybe an hour and a half ago with a load of tulip poplar, and it's putting off over 500 degrees in the center where the cat is. The sides are shielded and are only around 125 right now.

We had a night in the twenties last night instead of in the teens or single digits, and my husband actually got up and shut the stove blower off completely as he was a little warm.
No infrared temp gun unfortunately, we don’t know his stovetop temp but his pipe temps cruise between 350-400 degrees.

I think he’s looking to have a night as you are where he’s feeling toasty as well. The BK Sirocco sounds nice. My only worry with that is the low heat output on low with a 22-23 foot ceiling. X marks the Woodstove location. Above it is the “balcony” where the 3/4 story is, the pipe runs right through the floor out the ceiling straight shot.
 

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Agreed- the soapstone stoves are very radiant, but the density and thickness of the slabs used tend to store the heat and release at a slower steadier rate. I'd still suggest the larger stoves, 3cft firebox.
 
Agreed- the soapstone stoves are very radiant, but the density and thickness of the slabs used tend to store the heat and release at a slower steadier rate. I'd still suggest the larger stoves, 3cft firebox.
The Hearthstone GM80 he has his eyes on - 3.1cuft firebox hybrid Woodstove. Says 30 hours of heat on low.
 
@Jaison , thanks for including the floor plan. That helps me understand the three-quarter living space. Do you know if your relative has ever tried putting small floor fan on his balcony and blowing cooler air from the living space into the top of the cathedral ceiling there. You would think it wouldn't be too different from running ceiling fans in reverse, but it might be worth just trying it to see if there's a place it could be set up without impeding foot traffic.

I would not expect the BKs on low to satisfy the heat demand during prolonged cold, but what I'm trying to say is that even on low during moderate and recently some pretty severe cold they are capable of heating our 2,700 square feet of well-insulated space. If we ran them on a higher setting where we reloaded three times in twenty-four hours instead of only twice, we'd be putting that many more BTU's in the space. I think that just the larger firebox on a BK would be an improvement over the Oslo.

I can't speak to other stoves to compare them, but is the Hearthstone Heritage large? I thought it was a medium-sized model. I can't speak to the performance of the GM80, but we looked at a GM60 when we lived in Texas and were considering a freestanding stove. I just remember that we ruled that one out because its firebox was smaller than we expected from the literature, but I can't remember specifics now. They are beautiful stoves, probably more attractive to me even than the Ashford. Is he able to see one in person to compare the firebox volumes in real life? Has the stove be redesigned so that it now takes a six inch pipe?
 
@Jaison , thanks for including the floor plan. That helps me understand the three-quarter living space. Do you know if your relative has ever tried putting small floor fan on his balcony and blowing cooler air from the living space into the top of the cathedral ceiling there. You would think it wouldn't be too different from running ceiling fans in reverse, but it might be worth just trying it to see if there's a place it could be set up without impeding foot traffic.

I would not expect the BKs on low to satisfy the heat demand during prolonged cold, but what I'm trying to say is that even on low during moderate and recently some pretty severe cold they are capable of heating our 2,700 square feet of well-insulated space. If we ran them on a higher setting where we reloaded three times in twenty-four hours instead of only twice, we'd be putting that many more BTU's in the space. I think that just the larger firebox on a BK would be an improvement over the Oslo.

I can't speak to other stoves to compare them, but is the Hearthstone Heritage large? I thought it was a medium-sized model. I can't speak to the performance of the GM80, but we looked at a GM60 when we lived in Texas and were considering a freestanding stove. I just remember that we ruled that one out because its firebox was smaller than we expected from the literature, but I can't remember specifics now. They are beautiful stoves, probably more attractive to me even than the Ashford. Is he able to see one in person to compare the firebox volumes in real life? Has the stove be redesigned so that it now takes a six inch pipe?
Hearthstone heritage has same size firebox as the GM80 from what I saw. GM80 also has a 6 inch pipe model now too