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  1. ahoy30

    ahoy30 New Member

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    I'm trying to give someone a Garrison 2 to replace the smaller stove he has in his shop, and he asks if its airtight. Another friend has a stove(can't remember off hand what it is) that he'd been heating his house with that he wanted to sell him but got the same question. What don't I know, here?

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  2. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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  3. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    Airtight was an early innovation for wood stoves to provide better heat than an open fireplace or the older open wood stoves like the Franklin Wood stove.

    The theory is that open fireplaces and wood stoves are only 15 percent efficient because they pull in already warm room air to feed the fire and send it up the chimney. So engineers figured out if they kept the combustion air separate then the stove would heat all of the room air and be 70-80 percent efficient!

    See pics of my old Franklin and air tight Consolidated Dutchwest and current wood pellet stove in the same location!
    http://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/...rs-franklin-143-433-owner.78639/#post-1001007

    The pellet stove has a complete separate path for heating room air and really works great!
    Here is one I have in the for sale section that I can deliver.
    http://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/us-stove-5660-48-000-btu-wood-pellet-stove-1195-salem-nh.87467/
  4. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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  5. ahoy30

    ahoy30 New Member

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  6. ahoy30

    ahoy30 New Member

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    So basically any stove with a door is airtight?
  7. Locust Post

    Locust Post Minister of Fire

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    Airtight just means you have control of how much air feeds the fire. With gaskets on the doors that seals them so the only air allowed to enter the burn chamber is through the draft caps/vents.
  8. ahoy30

    ahoy30 New Member

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    gotcha, thanks
  9. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    NO, you need rope gaskets on the doors to be airtight! Stoves have special channels and flanges for these gaskets, so you cannot make a stove airtight that was not made that way!
  10. DanCorcoran

    DanCorcoran Minister of Fire

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    Another type of "no": modern EPA-listed stoves are designed to provide secondary feed air, even with the door closed and the primary air control completely closed. This isn't a problem, it is designed that way on purpose.
  11. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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    Wood won't burn in anything "airtight".
  12. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Yes, you need air to burn wood but where the air comes in can make a big difference. I learned that from my Wood/Coal "Airtight" stove. When burning wood I opened the combustion air intake above the wood because wood burns from top down. When I burned coal and put in the coal grates, I opened the combustion air inlet below the coal grates because coal burns from the bottom up.

    So if the joints and seams in the stove are not caulked and sealed then air will come in everywhere! "Airtight" means all the joints and seams are air sealed.

    As far as the Garrison 2 goes, this is from the manufacturer's comments:

    "Recognizing the widespread interest
    in efficient stoves that also allow
    fire-watching, Garrison uses double
    cast-iron doors as the focal point of
    their wide- faced octagonal stoves. The
    doors can be closed securely for airtight
    efficiency or left open with the
    spark guard screen in place for safely
    viewing the fire."

    Closing the doors was one of the 1st steps to Airtight efficiency but if the seams are not cemented with high temp caulking or equiv., then the stove is NOT truly "airtight" by today's standards!

    More info on Garrison Stove Works
    P.O. Box 41 2, Claremont,
    New Hampshire 03743
    603-542-876 1
    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/wiki/Garrison_Stoves/
    A very popular stove line in the time period from 1978 to 1982. The full line consisted of 3 sizes of wood stove and 1 coal unit. The first model was the Garrison I, a large steel stove with an 8” flue. This was followed by the Garrison two and three, smaller units with a 6” flue. All had rear takeoffs which allowed for easy venting into an existing masonry fireplace.
    Note: Garrison also made a dual-fuel model for a short time which could burn coal as well as wood.
  13. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    What if the seams are welded?
  14. Locust Post

    Locust Post Minister of Fire

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    I have to disagree to some extent Don. My stove and I think a lot of wood stoves especially without a grate feeds air under the wood or you could say at or through the red coals under the wood. When it reaches the back it draws upward and it is slowed and kicked back into the firebox by the baffle before it rises up the chimney. I do have air at the top that I can open which is meant to act somewhat like a secondary burn but not as efficient as the burn tubes.
  15. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Thanks for the input Locus Post
    What I said about intake air above the wood fire was based on the 1990 design of the VC Duchwest.

    Newer stoves may have a better design!

    However I stand behind what I said on the definition of "Airtight"
  16. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    As long as the seam is completely air sealed.
    I believe they are spot welded to save money and then the rest of the seam is cemented.

    I thought they might use high temp RTV but Vermont Castings uses a higher temp Furnace Cement.

    Here is an excerpt from the Vermont Castings Resolute Acclaim Non Cat stove manual.

    Repair Missing Cement in Seams
    The cement in the stove seams may deteriorate over time and fall out in places. Just as with the stove doors, it is necessary to keep the seam seals in good condition. Spot-fix with furnace cement (available from your local dealer) any areas where the cement seal is visibly deteriorated. Allow 24 hours for the new cement to dry.
  17. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    Here is what Vermont Castings does. > http://autonopedia.org/crafts_and_technology/Woodburners/Wood_Stoves_Part1.html

    Figure 2.22 (left)-The DownDrafter (patent applied for) by Vermont Woodstove Company.
    [​IMG]
    Figure 2.23 - Cross-section of the DownDrafter. Wood is gradually converted to charcoal as volatile substances are driven off by the heat. Slanting grates funnel the hottest coals to two choke points. Smoke must pass through the coals in order to gain access to the stovepipe, and is heated and completely burned in the process.

    Note that a downdraft stove might also be called a "coking" stove. The volatile substances are driven out of the fresh wood at the top of the firebox and pass down through the coals, where they burn completely, to provide the heat needed to continue the wood-distillation process. By the time the wood has been completely stripped of volatiles and has become charcoal, it has settled down into the zone of primary combustion to provide the fuel for coking the next charge of wood.
  18. Locust Post

    Locust Post Minister of Fire

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    Good here Don.........I'm on with you on the definition of airtight.
  19. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    I believe you are incorrect in two ways. That is, comparing cast iron construction to steel and assuming steel stove seams are spot welded.
  20. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    What stove is that exactly? Did it ever make it into production? How does this relate to on the market VC stoves?
  21. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    I know that the VC cast iron stoves use furnace cement for the seams.

    Is the entire seam welded on the steel wood stoves? Please explain BG
  22. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Not sure if their wood stoves are exactly like this but not too far off. Right?
  23. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    From the VC stoves there is quite a bit of difference. But they both do burn wood.
  24. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    Getting back to the OP's stove and off this tangent, yes if it is an exterior seam in the firebox.
  25. rkshed

    rkshed Feeling the Heat

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    For what its worth, I heated my small ranch with a Garrison II last winter and purchased NO oil. Ahoy, your friend will be very happy with it. Replace the door gaskets first and make sure neither of the doors is warped.If any of the bricks are cracked, Aubuchon sells them for $3.97 each.
    Have fun!

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