Another New Jotul 550 Install With Pictures

[jadm]

I have read the directions and will now attempt to get my pictures on here. If nothing appears I will try again when my husband gets home. ( He understands this tech. stuff much better than I ever will!)

First direction was to hit post reply button so I guess I have to close this and then come back again.

If no pictures appear you will know what happened. :down:

 

[jadm]

:coolgrin:

So much for my attempt in transferring the pictures.

I did everything it said to do but zilch when I hit the preview post button and the same when I hit the submit button...

 

[jadm]

Okay, sounds reasonable BUT how do I do that?

Are the instructions where I found the other ones in the Perfect Picture section?

I read them but the other instructions were easier for my brain to follow so I chose them :smirk:

You know - the path of least resistance...

Guess I'll have to go back and try to figure out the other directions. Think I will take a nap first. :blank:

u gotta compress your px before u upload it...

 

[jadm]

Another attempt at getting a picture on here.....

 

[begreen]

Yea, success. Looks great and much appreciated by at least one other family member .

 

[High_Iron]

Looks great. If those inserts were available 2 months ago I would have gotten one. Instead I went with the readily available Hampton. Congrats!

 

[raybonz]

Very pretty stove insert! Looks like you'll get lots of heat from a stove like that..

Ray

 

[jadm]

How do you like your Hampton? That was one I was considering too but in the end decided on this one.

Looks great. If those inserts were available 2 months ago I would have gotten one. Instead I went with the readily available Hampton. Congrats!

 

[jadm]

It does throw out a lot of heat. I have to figure out how to keep the heat up without feeding it so much :grrr: . Haven't quite gotten the hang of shutting down the primary air. Sometimes it works, other times the bricks begin to get dark and the flames struggle so I have to open it back up. Each load is different. I am having fun playing with it and figure in 5 years I will know what I am doing. :coolhmm:

Very pretty stove insert! Looks like you'll get lots of heat from a stove like that..

Ray

 

[fugazi42]

Looks great! Is that a heat shield above it? I'm wondering how you were able to get the clearance for the wood mantel. I'm in the process of ripping out my wood mantel and replacing it with a piece of bluestone so it meets the clearance requirements.

Josh

 

[jadm]

Yes, that is the heat shield. It made it so the clearances were lowered and I was able to leave my mantel as is. It doesn't look too bad. Eyes are drawn to the fire not to it. The picture makes it stand out more than it really does due to the shadow.

We toyed with the idea of moving out mantel too but decided against it due to the holes it would leave behind and it would be too high throwing the proportions off. Would look tooo strange.

Check in the manual and it gives the clearances with the mantel. It changed the measurement by 10".

Looks great! Is that a heat shield above it? I'm wondering how you were able to get the clearance for the wood mantel. I'm in the process of ripping out my wood mantel and replacing it with a piece of bluestone so it meets the clearance requirements.

Josh

 

[fugazi42]

It looks great with the heat shield. You are right- it doesn't stand out much.

The heat shield wasn't an option with the 450 I installed, so I had to change out the mantel in order to have it meet code. That was a while back and I just got the bluestone for the mantel delivered today.

 

[jadm]

Fugazi-

Did you have an insert before your 450?

I wondering how you are doing with the unit you got.

What kind of stove top temps are you able to reach and how well does it heat your space?

How does it handle coal pile up?

I know our units are different but I still like to get experience from other Jotul insert users.

It looks great with the heat shield. You are right- it doesn't stand out much.

The heat shield wasn't an option with the 450 I installed, so I had to change out the mantel in order to have it meet code. That was a while back and I just got the bluestone for the mantel delivered today.

 

[Bill]

Those new stove's sure look good, it's a shame to burn wood in them and get ash all over. I wish they would stay new looking forever. Nice looking doors.

 

[fugazi42]

Perplexed,

The Jotul 450 is the first wood stove we've owned. We had it installed two years ago and have used it as our primary heat source in the winter. It has easily paid for itself in the past two years alone. I think it's a great unit overall. The 450 heats our home pretty well- it's a 16 year old 2400SF colonial with a layout that isn't great for heating with wood. The 450 keeps our downstairs comfortable, but the upstairs stays pretty cool- downright cold some nights. My wife and I just decided to take the plunge and install a second stove, a Jotul 500, in a place that will get more heat upstairs.

I just got a stove thermometer a few weeks ago. It wasn't until I found hearth.com that I realized I should have one.. The 450 burns at a steady 550 degrees most of the time, when the air control is set at about 25% open. We operate the blower on ours constantly, otherwise it doesn't distribute heat well. I usually get a decent overnight burn- last night I piled in wood at around 10:00pm and the blower was still on at 4:00am, which isn't bad for an insert.. It does tend to build up a huge coal bed, at which point it's not throwing much heat into the room. The solution to reducing the coal bed, as I learned here, is to throw one or two splits in, and run it at about 75% open, stirring the coals occasionally.

My neighbors just had a 550 installed and they are pretty happy with it so far. It looks like a great unit.

Good luck with yours!

Josh

 

[jadm]

Josh-

Thanks for the info. I am doing the same thing with my coals. It is what I used to do with my old unit. I was hoping that it wouldn't happen with this one but at least the same trick works. I just feel like I am wasting wood doing it.

I am having trouble shutting down the air and not having smoke coming out of my stack. This morning it was good and hot and I shut it down to about 25% open, which is as low as I have been able to go, it burned clean for awhile but about an hour later I noticed smoke coming out of my stack. Temp. was still high in the insert and it still had flame going. Stopped smoking once I opened it up a bit but then I feel like I am burning up a lot of wood.

How many cords of wood do you use in a season? What type of wood are you burning?

I'm afraid of loading this unit up at this point because of the smoke. I usually put about 4 hard wood logs on at a time.

I am curious how your neighbors are doing with their 550. There aren't many out there yet to compare notes with.

Perplexed

 

[RonB]

Josh-


I am having trouble shutting down the air and not having smoke coming out of my stack. This morning it was good and hot and I shut it down to about 25% open, which is as low as I have been able to go, it burned clean for awhile but about an hour later I noticed smoke coming out of my stack. Temp. was still high in the insert and it still had flame going. Stopped smoking once I opened it up a bit but then I feel like I am burning up a lot of wood.

I'm afraid of loading this unit up at this point because of the smoke. I usually put about 4 hard wood logs on at a time.

Perplexed

My firebox likes to be full. 3/4 full or better and it is easier to maintain high enough temps to eliminate smoke, even when dampened down. More logs mean more or longer heat not necessarily more smoke. It is true somewhat, I am (as you will be) using more wood to maintain hotter burning temps and cleaner flues.

 

[jgoodnow]

Perplexed, when you have some extra time read some of the posts by Mike Wilson. He owns a Jotul 450 Kennebec and has written quite a bit on his operating procedures. For example:

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/11705/#131786

Some stoves should not have the air all the way down, because if they do, there is not enough primary burn in the stove to touch off the secondary burn at the top baffle plate.... think of the primary burn as a pilot light for your secondary, sometimes you have to keep it lit so that it can light the gasses on the top of the stove, which is secondary (clean) combustion. Try it again, during the day, and observe. You may find that the lowest your stove can go is 1/4 air, maybe 1/8… who knows. But you will learn, and it will take time. I just don’t think you can start a fire on day one, let it go, and then damper it down for the night and expect perfection. I know if I damper mine down all the way, I sometimes lose primary, which kills secondary, which results in smoke, and dirty glass.

In another post I think he said he has not had much success with his primary air less than 1/4 (i.e. 1/4 open, 3/4 closed). I have noted the same thing. He burns 24/7 and does seem to get long burns, with just three reloads per day. I haven't gotten anywhere near that, but I burn evenings and weekends, so I'm not trying for an overnight burn. My insert, with the "Mike Wilson thermometer location," runs at about 500 degrees. I like to get it to about 550 before I cut back on the air, then it will hover at around 500 for a few hours. From a cold start it takes anywhere from 1/2 to 3/4 hour to get above 500.

You have a big advantage in that this is your second insert so you have something to compare to. I'm just starting my third month with my first insert, so still just learning the ropes.

 

[jadm]

Therm - Thanks for the input. When things get explained to me it makes sense as to what I am experiencing. The quote you added does make a lot of sense. I will check out more of his threads.

Highest temp. I have been able to maintain for any length of time is about 400* but that isn't accurate because on the 550 there is nowhere to place a therm. for a semi-accurate reading. I ordered an IR therm. yesterday and when it arrives I will know more what temps. I am dealing with. Longest I've been able to maintain that is about 1 1/2 hours.

Takes me about an hour or more to get the temps. up. First load of wood is just warming the flue and unit up and giving me a coal bed. Second load is working on the temps. At least that is what has been happening so far. I just panic because of the amount of wood I am using with the air so far open.

I am also running into my impatience and how uncomfortable it feels to feel so incompetent. I do so hate to be at this end of the learning curve. >:-(

 

[fugazi42]

Perplexed-

I agree with Therm- check out Mike's posts about his 450- they helped me a lot. After more than a year with mine I'm just finally beginning to understand how to load and operate it properly... The posts here were a big help. One suggestion- I believe- and others have posted this as well- that the stove won't get to its hottest temperatures with the air 100% open. I usually have the air 100% open until the fire is roaring, then choke it down to 50% until the stove reaches temperature (600 degrees or so) then go down to about 3/8 open. If I close is down to 1/4 or less the fire smolders.

To answer your questions above, I'm burning mostly hard and soft maple, along with black birch, ash, sycamore, cottonwood, and spruce. The wood I have this year is far from optimal- the maple and sycamore is still pretty wet, but I have no choice. Next year will be better- I have 5 cords of red oak stacked already. Based on the last two years I expect we'll burn 4 cords in an average winter. I made that estimate based on what the Jotul 450 consumes. I think the new stove we're installing will consume less. I expect to run both only on the coldest days.

I'll try to get over to see my neighbors this weekend to see how they like their 550.

Josh

 

[jadm]

Josh - Thanks for the input. On my old unit I had to shut the air down too to get it hotter. My frustration has been that when I try that with the 550 I get the blackened fire bricks.

I have gone through and read a lot of various threads on the forum and what I keep getting is what I knew worked with my Napoleon.

Keep blowers off at the beginning or else they cool things down. (I do that.)

Shut air down gradually. ( I do that.)

If things blacken up a bit - be PATIENT and let it balance itself out.( I DO NOT DO THIS :red: )

I get scared of the creosote thing BUT today I am going to practice patience. :shut:

I did read through Mike's posts and they all made a lot of sense to me.

One of my problems is that I do compare the 550 with my old Napoleon. I forget how long it took me to get comfortable with that unit. Even though some aspects are basically the same this is a whole new experience. Kinda like a new baby. After each one of my children were born I knew how to do the mechanics of the infant thing but learning who each child was was a whole different thing - and it still is even after 18 years. I'm still learning with them and I imagine I will continue to learn with wood burning for the rest of my life.

Patience has never been my forte.

 

[jgoodnow]

Combining what RonB said about his firebox wanting to be at least 3/4 full with what Mike Wilson said about having a "pilot light" to maintain secondary combustion, it is possible that another advantage of a full firebox is that the flames are higher up in the firebox, i.e. closer to the secondary combustion air jets at the top. In my view, this may help keep secondary combustion going. However, I think the main advantage of a full firebox is the inherently higher operating temperature.

Right now my goals are twofold: 1) minimize the time from cold start to when I can cut back the air, and 2) try to achieve long burns. I figure it will take me a season or three to get the hang of it.

 

[boostnut]

I've got to agree with Ron and Therm, mine runs better and has more consistant temps with the air cut down to about 1/4 if the firebox is full. When I say full I mean jam packed to the top FULL. I like to start with a few smaller splits to get the stove temp up to the 400+ range then load it up completely. Give the full load a few minutes of wide open air and then cut the air down. You wont be feeding it nearly as often this way.

BTW, where is mike these days?

 

[oldAGE]

Perplexed - Wow, I love the hearth. It looks nice and soft. Almost like a Golden Retriever. Very cleaver of you!

AGE

 

[jadm]

Thanks for all of your responses. Today I did get it to 75% closed and it stayed there for awhile. So I consider that progress. :coolsmile:

I have not been brave enough to really fill the firebox up yet. I get scared of it getting too hot. I imagine I will get more comfortable with that in time.

The IR I ordered a couple of days ago arrive today and as soon as I read the directions I will start playing with it. Have to wait until the kids are all asleep or else I won't be able to get MY hands on it.