Any Catalytic Owners? Blaze King Princess Catalyst Question

[SkydiverChris]

Evening everyone,

Just thought I'd see if anyone out there had any experience with catalyst stoves. I have a 2 year old Blaze King Princess and last time I gave it a good inspection, I noticed that the catalyst had several fractures in it. Nothing major, but I'm wondering if I did something to it, or how I can telll if/when the Catalyst needs replacing.

Here's a video from when I first bought it. Obviously, it was new, I didn't have a great handle on how to run it and I was wasting a tonne of heat up the flue. Now, I have a good handle on how to operate it, but I'm curious if anyone knows much about catalysts themselves.

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Thank you!

 

[Highbeam]

Cracking and even minor fracture/loss of the catalyst is normal on ceramic cats in the BK. So long as the dang thing doesn't fall out. The manual tells you how to test for cat effectiveness. Is it still working? Just looks bad? That's okay.

95% of cat failures on BKs are from a leaky door gasket.

 

[SkydiverChris]

Thanks for your quick response, you've made me feel better that it's not problematic. It still seems to be working, just not quite as efficient as I recall.

Thanks again!

 

[rdust]

On the 5th season with mine. It's not as efficient as it was in year one but it's still working. It has some cracks but its still complete. Sound like what you have is normal. Post a pic next time you let it cool if you can so we can ease your mind.

 

[Stacey]

I am new to the site and not sure how to start a new thread. We recently purchased a used BK Princess. The manual says to only close the flu once the stove is in the active zone (1,100 degrees F), what happens after you close the flu and it drops below the active zone, do you have to open the flu back up?

 

[Heftiger]

Yes, open it back up. But this should only be happening at the end of the cycle, if it's going inactive when you still have wood in the box, something else is wrong.

 

[Stacey]

No wood, just ashes..... We will put in a large load, get it really, really hot then close the flu and turn the fresh air down just a little and then we go to bed. 6 hours later only ashes left and in the inactive zone. It really never does that "funny, upsidedown flame".

 

[Heftiger]

When you leave it wide open, where on the thermometer is the catalyst temp? It sounds like me like your wood isn't dry enough for optimal performance.

 

[Stacey]

We are burning Oak that we cut and split just over 2 years ago. When it is wide open it gets very HOT, not sure of the actual temp, but its way high in the active zone. The room that it is in stays in the mid 80's and had been as high as 93 degrees. Could the catalyst just need to be cleaned or replaced?

 

[Heftiger]

It's possible. The manual online has some steps for testing your catalyst. You should be getting way more than 6 hours of burn time with your oak.

Have you tested your wood with a moisture meter?

 

[Woody Stover]

I am new to the site and not sure how to start a new thread.

You can do that from the forum topic page, where there's a "post new thread" button. Since SkydiverChris seems to have gotten his answers for now, maybe it'll be OK if I go ahead and hijack his thread temporarily.

We recently purchased a used BK Princess. The manual says to only close the flu once the stove is in the active zone (1,100 degrees F)
We will put in a large load, get it really, really hot then close the flu and turn the fresh air down just a little and then we go to bed. When it is wide open it gets very HOT, not sure of the actual temp, but its way high in the active zone. The room that it is in stays in the mid 80's and had been as high as 93 degrees. 6 hours later only ashes left and in the inactive zone. It really never does that "funny, upsidedown flame".

I suspect you are running the stove with too much air, as SkydiverChris said he was at first, and sending "a tonne of heat up the flue." The catalyst should go active when the internal temp of the stove is over 500°F. You may not know when that occurs, and maybe some BK owners will chime in with where their stove top, cat, and flue meters are when they close the bypass, cut the primary air and the cat lights off. My Dutchwest and Keystone are hot enough to light the cat at a stove top temp of 200 or 250. When the cat lights, I cut the air to almost nothing. I start with the air open but begin cutting it in steps after about 10 minutes, depending on how fast the load takes off. By the time the stove is almost to temp, I've already cut the air to about 1/4 open. Then I close the bypass and cut the air back more, to my cruise setting...almost closed. There's no flame in the box, just some glowing coals and a glowing cat. That's really the way cat stoves are made to run. Occasionally I will run a small amount of flame in the box, but not usually. It sounds like you have the air wide open, the stove and flue get really hot (probably way too hot, which can damage the stove and flue.) Then you cut the primary air "just a little" and go to bed. That's why your wood is gone in 6 hrs. If your sq. footage or layout and stove location are such that you have to run the stove really hot to get adequate heat to other areas of the house, then you have other issues that need to be addressed. We can heat our space with the stove running fairly low, unless it's really cold and windy out.

We are burning Oak that we cut and split just over 2 years ago. Could the catalyst just need to be cleaned or replaced?

Oak that has dried in the stack for 2 years should be adequate, but it's not guaranteed. Until you can judge the dryness of various species by the heft of a split, testing several freshly-split pieces with a moisture meter is the only way to tell for sure.
Did the previous owner say if he had replaced the cat at some point? How old is the stove? There should be a manufacture date on the metal UL tag on the back of the stove, if he didn't tell you the age.

 

[jetsam]

We are burning Oak that we cut and split just over 2 years ago. When it is wide open it gets very HOT, not sure of the actual temp, but its way high in the active zone. The room that it is in stays in the mid 80's and had been as high as 93 degrees. Could the catalyst just need to be cleaned or replaced?

Can't tell if your cat is good or bad from that, but you are probably burning stove much hotter than you ought to be. That stove's biggest strength is low, slow burns... would you rather your room be 90 degrees for 6 hours, or 75 degrees for 18 hours? After you get it burning nice and hot, turn the thermostat way down and prepare to be pleasantly surprised.

 

[Stacey]

no, I will have to check that out. We have a 2,300 sq ft story and a half home and it heats the whole place, no problem.

Can't tell if your cat is good or bad from that, but you are probably burning stove much hotter than you ought to be. That stove's biggest strength is low, slow burns... would you rather your room be 90 degrees for 6 hours, or 75 degrees for 18 hours? After you get it burning nice and hot, turn the thermostat way down and prepare to be pleasantly surprised.

I am definitly wanting to achieve a low, slow burn. The manual says to get a hot burn in the active zone, then close the flu for atleast 30 minutes before turning down the fresh air and to cut the air in small increments. When I do this the tempature quickly falls (30 minutes) into the inactive zone. Once I open the flu, tempature quickly rises again.. Very frustrating, we are burning a tone of wood and the house is getting too hot.

 

[Woody Stover]

sounds like me like your wood isn't dry enough for optimal performance.

Yep. If you can't cut the air without the cat crashing, wood moisture may be an issue. That's assuming that you have an adequate chimney...

 

[blueguy]

Yep. If you can't cut the air without the cat crashing, wood moisture may be an issue. That's assuming that you have an adequate chimney...

Or he's turning it down too low causing the cat to crash.

FWIW, I can get 24 hours out of a firebox with my tstat set a little over 2, which is approx. the 3 o'clock position for the swooshers. Much lower than that, and my cat crashes. To be fair, my wood isn't the best, so I have to run it a little higher....

 

[jetsam]

FWIW, I can get 24 hours out of a firebox with my tstat set a little over 2, which is approx. the 3 o'clock position for the swooshers. Much lower than that, and my cat crashes. To be fair, my wood isn't the best, so I have to run it a little higher....

I can run mine almost on the minimum tstat setting with marginal-to-damp wood if I start with some nice coals. If you turn it down a little and the cat crashes, your cat may be partly plugged. Pull the stainless steel plate off next time it is cool and see if you can peer through the cat with a flashlight, or if it is plugged.

A secondhand stove could also have a faulty gasket around the cat, or a poisoned cat from burning garbage/paint/PT.

There is some good background and troubleshooting info from Condar here:

(broken link removed to http://www.condar.com/combustorcleaningmanual.pdf). (This is from a cat manufacturer, not a stove manufacturer, and they do not tell you that you need to replace the cat gasket if you take the cat out of a BK.)

(broken link removed to http://www.blazeking.com/PDF/Wood%2520Stove%2520TroubleShooting%2520Guide.pdf)

 

[SkydiverChris]

Hey,

I don;t mind that the thread was taken over, as long as it's helping someone. Everyone posting above is 100% correct. You either have a cat that has been "spoiled" by burning paint/garbage/glued wood, or you're leaking air around the flue vent, the catalyst or the door. If it's a used stove, I;d suggest starting with the gaskets because they're relatively cheap. Replace the gasket around the door and if you remove the chimney from the top of the stove and open the flue, there's another gasket that seals the flue. If you do that and still have an issue, it's most likely the gasket around the cat. The cat's do ahve a 10 year warranty, but unfortunately, I'm not sure a faulty gasket would be covered under that (nor would burning garbage/painted wood etc)

If you were going into the inactive zone and you still had wood in the stove in the morning, that would indicate wet wood or that you turned it down too quickly and it choked. Doesn't sound like either of these are your problem. If you're waking up to ashes, you're getting too much air. When the stove is working optimally, you shouldn't really see anything going on, other than some red embers. I don't typicaly have any flame once the stove is running in the Active zone.

Important things to remember: Get the stove WELL into the active zone (at least 1/3 to 1/2 way) witht he thermostat set to MAX. Once you have it going, close the flue, and the door if you had it open, but leave the stove on MAX to let it stabilize and get flowing properly. I'll then turn it to about 2 if the stove is roaring pretty good, or half way between 2 and 3 if it's going slowly. Every 10 minutes, as long as it hasn't gone out to a smolder, I'll keep dropping the temp a little. I might adjust it 4 or 5 times between 2 and 1.5 where I typically run it (right where the silver "Normal" bar starts on the thermostat).

Let us know how it goes, and there are a tonne of people that can help.

I'm also in the process of making a Youtube video that will answer many of the questions people typically have about these stoves. I'm trying to answer everything possible so it can be useful.

Thanks!

 

[jetsam]

Get the stove WELL into the active zone (at least 1/3 to 1/2 way) witht he thermostat set to MAX. Once you have it going, close the flue, and the door if you had it open, but leave the stove on MAX to let it stabilize and get flowing properly.

I find that just using cat temp as a guide can stall my cat. I let 'er blaze until I feel like the largest splits/rounds in the stove are "properly on fire" (which I confess I don't have a real scientific definiton of ). Then I put the cat in and let it go for a couple minutes, then crank it right down to wherever it's going (around 10% for warm nights, maybe up to 50% for cold nights, not that I've had a night colder than about 20F yet, which is bizarre). If the new wood went in on top of a good bed of coals I'll close the bypass a lot sooner than otherwise- it seems to do well no matter what I do if it's starting with a nice coal bed.

 

[Woody Stover]

leaking air around the flue vent

That's the bypass gasket, correct? I'm not familiar with the construction of BKs...

If you were going into the inactive zone and you still had wood in the stove in the morning, that would indicate wet wood or that you turned it down too quickly and it choked...Get the stove WELL into the active zone (at least 1/3 to 1/2 way) witht he thermostat set to MAX. Once you have it going, close the flue, and the door if you had it open, but leave the stove on MAX to let it stabilize and get flowing properly.

I find that just using cat temp as a guide can stall my cat. I let 'er blaze until I feel like the largest splits/rounds in the stove are "properly on fire"

Yep, I failed to mention that. You have to have the stove up to temp, and enough of the load burning to sustain a cat burn. This comes with experience.