EPA 2020 regulation questions.

Texas123 Posted By Texas123, Apr 15, 2019 at 1:00 AM

  1. Texas123

    Texas123
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    I have noticed Jotul has one EPA 2020 compliant stove but none of the others are compliant.
    Some of the other brands have partial compliance according to the literature.

    Using Jotul as an example, does this mean unless they upgrade the other stove models will they legally be a one stove company on January the 1st of 2020?
    Not being an engineer I don't see how you can install a catalytic converter in these smaller stoves.
     
  2. bholler

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    Yes if they only have one compliant stove they will only be able to sell one. And cats work perfectly fine in small stoves. But 2020 does not require cats at all there are some non cats that comply and other that are clean enough but haven't been retested yet.
     
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  3. peakbagger

    peakbagger
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    There will be shakeout of stove manufacturers and most likely some stoves released to the public that will not be user friendly or suffer from unexpected durability issues. Probably more than a few great sales on old stock that will not comply. I missed out on a great deal on boiler a few years ago when some regulation changed and the dealer had excess inventory.

    The other prediction is there is going to be a increase in posts from new stove owners the winter of 2021 regarding that their stove "will not work". In order to get clean emissions, marginal installations just are not not going to be good enough. Stove drafts will need to be within specs meaning some folks may need to put in insulated liners and may need to increase stack height. Stoves in tight homes may need to add fresh air supplies. Folks with marginally seasoned wood are going to be out of luck. Probably good deals on used wood stoves in the summer of 2021 ;)
     
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  4. kennyp2339

    kennyp2339
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    I also agree with @peakbagger and I will add by 2021 they will be posts of "help my stove is running to hot" or "I cant turn my stove down enough" seeming that low budget stoves are simply eliminating the air control or making the air flow bigger when the control is turned down all the way, look at what US stove is releasing lately.
     
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  5. Woody5506

    Woody5506
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    I wonder if new regulations are bound to steer people away from wood burning. Obviously this could've been said in the past already, and I'm sure it did make people choose alternative methods. I guess what I'm saying is even if stove manufacturers are able to keep up with regulations, how many people are going to be willing to do what Peakbagger mentioned - proper installs + optimally seasoned wood, which means ideally keeping 3+ years worth unless you have some other source for seasoned wood. It's tough enough for a lot of people running EPA stoves, makes me wonder if the 2020 regs are bound to make it tougher?
     
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  6. bholler

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    What stoves are doing that to meet 2020? Those us stove co stoves have been on the market 10 or 15 years now.
     
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  7. begreen

    begreen
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    That is unfortunately a given. Some problems may be valid, but a lot will not be. I predict that at least half of those with issues will be the stove owner and not the stove. We see this every fall as new stove owners try to burn damp wood and claim that the stove is not getting enough air. Another 25% will be installation problems of too short flue systems, negative pressure, etc..
     
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  8. mar13

    mar13
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    Actually, the last day to sell the preEPA2020 will be May 15, 2020. So still over a year away.

    Pacific Energy seems to have found a solution for non-cat stoves. Lopi is also showing non-cat stoves that are meeting regulations. I wouldn't be surprised, though, if the current cat-stove manufacturers will get at least a short-term boost in business.
     
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  9. webby3650

    webby3650
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    Have these manufacturers actually passed the emissions testing with a non cat, or “should pass”?
    The only Lopis I’ve seen that were actually 2020 compliant so far were hybrid.
     
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  10. Highbeam

    Highbeam
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    The epa list is current through April. Lots of stoves that “should” pass have not passed yet.
     
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  11. Ctwoodtick

    Ctwoodtick
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    I understand that stoves that don’t pass the 2020 standards they can’t be sold after the deadline. Maybe a silly question, but if certain epa stoves don’t meet the 2020 standards, will you still be able to purchase parts for these stoves after the deadline?
     
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  12. webby3650

    webby3650
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    I know that ;)
     
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  13. bholler

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    Yes parts will still be available. You can still get parts for some pre epa stuff.
     
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  14. bholler

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    Mostly because they havnt been tested yet. Not that i am saying they will but there is so much speclation here about how horrible it will be when the stove that are compliant on the market are fine
     
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  15. mar13

    mar13
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    The Lopi Evergreen is noncat and passed
     
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  16. Highbeam

    Highbeam
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    It’s like being pregnant, the stove either has passed or has not. I am not going to speculate or assume that a female should become pregnant either.

    Those green stripes are earned.
     
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  17. Woody Stover

    Woody Stover
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    My Keystone is 1.4 cu.ft, has a cat, and tested below 2 g/hr. No green stripe yet, however...
     
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  18. peakbagger

    peakbagger
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    I wonder I f there is some value to manufacturer that has a warehouse full of non compliant stoves to not admit that they have a compliant one yet? I expect the average person would want the 2020 compliant version if it was listed which would mean one less sale of non compliant version. Given the timing I could guess the company would have a blow out sale to dump excess inventory this summer and fall and then roll out the 2020 complaint versions at a later date.

    Pure speculation but expect some marketing geek has already planned it out.
     
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