Firewood For the Poor in North Carolina

[Simonkenton]

I live out in the NC mountains, in rural Madison County, 20 miles west of Asheville.

Two days ago, I noticed that on a vacant lot in town, a guy had a little firewood operation. He had several logging truck loads of hardwood on the ground. He had a gasoline powered splitter. He had a big Ford F250 pickup and had it loaded with some good looking firewood, red oak and maple. Of course, all this wood was green, freshly spllit.
I asked him how much it would cost to load up my little Nissan.

He told me he didn't sell the wood. He said I needed to go down to the county and register, as a poor person, and then once I was registered he would bring me a load for free.
He told me he was real busy and he was 35 loads behind.

Well, that is a weird deal, he is loading up poor people with wood that is absolutely green. He seemed to be working hard for the late winter rush, but, for most wood stoves, that wood wouldn't begin to be ready to burn until next year.

 

[Lake Girl]

I've seen a couple of articles on "wood banks" for providing heat to folks in economic hardship... church groups mostly. They should be cutting now for next year's supply at least. Has anyone gone to county officials and made that point that they are setting disadvantaged folks up for the possibility of a creosote fire by providing green wood... ensuring further economic hardship? What does the local fire departments say? Are the stoves inspected before supplying wood? Are there fire and CO detectors supplied and functioning?

It is a positive approach if they are providing seasoned wood and ensuring safety.

 

[mellow]

I applaud his efforts, green wood is better than no wood when it comes to keeping warm. Most of those people have non-epa stoves.

 

[branchburner]

for most wood stoves, that wood wouldn't begin to be ready to burn until next year.

That's true, even though most wood stoves in use are pre-EPA, and can better handle green wood. Seems few people around me burn wood that has been seasoned over half a year. Still a lot of old cast iron smoke dragons around.

Curious, is this fellow doing this on his own, or as part of a larger charity?

 

[Lake Girl]

I applaud his efforts, green wood is better than no wood when it comes to keeping warm. Most of those people have non-epa stoves.

I agree with the effort but see the need for a bit of pre-planning by the county. I know, it's an oxymoron for most governments

 

[spirilis]

That's a respectable service he's doing there. Echoing everyone else, it would be nice if he could "get ahead" and keep ahead for the safety of the recipients.

 

[branchburner]

I think I found the answer to my question above, guessing this is the charity sponsor:
(broken link removed to http://www.wakegov.com/humanservices/social/energy/Pages/warmthforwake.aspx)

No mention of seasoning the wood.

 

[Simonkenton]

Thanks for that link, branchburner. Now, that is in Raleigh, about 200 miles from here, but, I would imagine that this program is along the same lines. So, you gotta be over 60 [I qualify] and you gotta be poor [I don't qualify.]
Quite possible that the man I spoke with was a volunteer. It was just him and his wife out there in the cold, splitting that wood. Obviously that was his own pickup truck.

My county, Madison, has the reputation for being one of the poorest counties in the state, lots of poor Appalachian people living here and few government rules and regulations. I doubt that the govt. is inspecting any wood stoves or requiring CO detectors. And many of these people would have old old wood stoves, I'd imagine some Sotz barrel kits and some home made stoves as well. You can burn that green wood pretty well in a Sotz barrel kit, I did for 3 years. As long as you have dry wood to light it up, or to relight it if the coals get low, you can get pretty good heat from green wood. Helps if you split it real small.

 

[kennyp2339]

Nice deal helping the handicapped, I'm poor and split my own, my best friend is even worse off then me and he splits his own. I don't see how being poor opens the flood gates to free wood, I totally understand the cause of helping someone that physically cant split, I would even help out.

 

[Lake Girl]

I was thinking it was a county run program initially ... looks like they just provide the names of those eligible. Wonder how tough it is to get volunteers or donations?

 

[ambull01]

He told me he didn't sell the wood. He said I needed to go down to the county and register, as a poor person, and then once I was registered he would bring me a load for free.
He told me he was real busy and he was 35 loads behind.

Quite possible that the man I spoke with was a volunteer. It was just him and his wife out there in the cold, splitting that wood. Obviously that was his own pickup truck.

So I know the guy is doing a great thing, I really love that. Jeez, can he freaking rephrase his directions? Almost like saying go register as a beggar and if you're sorry enough I'll give you some firewood. I may just be overreacting but I used to live in the NC mountains. Poverty is rampant in the Appalachians but from what I saw they are prideful people. Go register as a poor person would be a slap in my face. Anyway, end of rant.

 

[Simonkenton]

No, the way I put that was unfair to the man. I was not quoting him, I was paraphrasing. He was very polite, he said "You need to go down to the county office and register. I don't know what your financial situation is but if you qualify as being of low income, and you get registered, then I will bring you a load for free."

I was driving my '98 Nissan pickup so I looked like a person who might be low income.

 

[ambull01]

No, the way I put that was unfair to the man. I was not quoting him, I was paraphrasing. He was very polite, he said "You need to go down to the county office and register. I don't know what your financial situation is but if you qualify as being of low income, and you get registered, then I will bring you a load for free."

I was driving my '98 Nissan pickup so I looked like a person who might be low income.

Oh okay, sorry. I was picturing the Nazis identifying all the Jews and making them second class citizens. Have to learn to let these types of things go. I'm in the National Guard now and subject to yearly mandatory briefings. A lady from DC came up and did a briefing about the Guard museum and a scholarship for children that lost a parent in combat. Her slide said something along the lines of the successful applicant or something like that. Umm, you need a parent that died in combat to qualify! I wouldn't call that successful.

Anyway, sorry to derail the thread.

 

[mellow]

It is sad that I even think about this but these days it is entirely possible:

"I am sueing your church for giving me green wood that started a chimney fire and burned my house down"

Hopefully the are making people sign disclaimers, I see an ambulance chasing lawyer being all over this one if that ever happens.

 

[firefighterjake]

It is sad that I even think about this but these days it is entirely possible:

"I am sueing your church for giving me green wood that started a chimney fire and burned my house down"

Hopefully the are making people sign disclaimers, I see an ambulance chasing lawyer being all over this one if that ever happens.

This reminded me of a recent story up here . . . guy without insurance has his business burn down . . . he is now turning around and suing the firefighters who responded to the emergency.

The comments following the story are quite interesting.

If there is any glimmer of hope (for lawyers) . . . it appears as though none of them were willing to take up this case as the owners are representing themselves.

http://bangordailynews.com/2015/02/...ant-destroyed-in-2013-blaze-sue-firefighters/

 

[Simonkenton]

from firefighter jake's link:

"Robert L. Cousins claimed that firefighters discriminated against him because he is “a 100 [percent] disabled Vietnam veteran purposefully made homeless, jobless by the willful and wanton destruction” of his business and home."

Firefighters discrimante, because the business owner is a disabled Vietnam Vet? What in the world? That is an absolutely bizarre accusation.
If the guy is 100 percent disabled, sounds like he ought to be confined to bed, or else to a wheel chair. How can a 100 percent disabled person run a restaurant? Sounds like a weepy-whiner to me.

Hold the presses: A lawsuit so lame that even ambulance chasers won't touch it and the couple has to represent themselves.

Keep us updated Jake, I think the judge will toss this one out of court.

 

[Dune]

from firefighter jake's link:

"Robert L. Cousins claimed that firefighters discriminated against him because he is “a 100 [percent] disabled Vietnam veteran purposefully made homeless, jobless by the willful and wanton destruction” of his business and home."

Firefighters discrimante, because the business owner is a disabled Vietnam Vet? What in the world? That is an absolutely bizarre accusation.
If the guy is 100 percent disabled, sounds like he ought to be confined to bed, or else to a wheel chair. How can a 100 percent disabled person run a restaurant? Sounds like a weepy-whiner to me.

Hold the presses: A lawsuit so lame that even ambulance chasers won't touch it and the couple has to represent themselves.

Keep us updated Jake, I think the judge will toss this one out of court.

I am 100% disabled legally.
I have congestive heart failure.
I could certainly "run" a restaurant though, or any other business, just not by myself.
I can't stand up for long periods or walk very far, but there is no reason for me to be in a wheel chair.
I have a handicap tag and have no problem taking a front row space considering how difficult walking is for me, and that I take care of a few other people and hence do more than my share of errands.

Not saying I agree with the "victim", just trying to spread education about disabilities in general.

 

[Grateful11]

You'd be surprised at the number of elderly people that think they get more heat out of green wood than well seasoned wood. Don't me why or how they came to this conclusion but I've heard it number of times.

 

[kennyp2339]

Wow- just read that article, As a firefighter I can safely say that the top priority is safety, if the risk out weighs the benefit you don't do it. Firefighters are trained to identify building construction, it is nearly impossible to preplan every building that is built, when there's a fire you have to make decision within the first couple of seconds of what you want to do regarding offensive or defensive operation. This guy seems like a whacko and needs mental health, the article just sounds horrible it reminds me of an old history teacher saying " ladies and gentlemen, Lets play a game called how low can you go" Good luck brother firefighters that are affected by this.

 

[Lake Girl]

Wow- just read that article, As a firefighter I can safely say that the top priority is safety, if the risk out weighs the benefit you don't do it. Firefighters are trained to identify building construction, it is nearly impossible to preplan every building that is built, when there's a fire you have to make decision within the first couple of seconds of what you want to do regarding offensive or defensive operation. This guy seems like a whacko and needs mental health, the article just sounds horrible it reminds me of an old history teacher saying " ladies and gentlemen, Lets play a game called how low can you go" Good luck brother firefighters that are affected by this.

A lot goes into that initial size-up. How involved was the structure when they first arrived on-scene? As long as occupants are out, the next concern is the safety of the firefighters. What are the operating rules/training of the fire dept? Our Northern Protection teams (extremely rural) only allow for exterior attacks ... no entry period. The goal is to stop spread to other structures and/or surrounding forest.

The owner took a gamble by not having insurance ...

I applaud his efforts, green wood is better than no wood when it comes to keeping warm. Most of those people have non-epa stoves.

Time to start educating the folks that organize the programs ....

 

[Oldman47]

Wow- just read that article, As a firefighter I can safely say that the top priority is safety, if the risk out weighs the benefit you don't do it. Firefighters are trained to identify building construction, it is nearly impossible to preplan every building that is built, when there's a fire you have to make decision within the first couple of seconds of what you want to do regarding offensive or defensive operation. This guy seems like a whacko and needs mental health, the article just sounds horrible it reminds me of an old history teacher saying " ladies and gentlemen, Lets play a game called how low can you go" Good luck brother firefighters that are affected by this.

My own training as a brigade member for a large industrial plant was to first do a good size up and then choose a strategy. Sometimes an aggressive attack can actually suppress a fire rather quickly but quite often it is best to just protect exposures in a defensive approach. Even if you decide that an attack is appropriate it is always a good idea to still protect exposures. Who needs the aggravation of another fire breaking out behind the brigade? A lot of our live fire training was about how to fight a structure fire even though that would not be what we would face in an industrial setting. The live fire training labs were mostly for training local volunteer fire departments and that was reflected in the training lab arrangements. We just did not have any live fire training lab available for those industrial settings. For us protecting exposures in the real world would have meant protecting the next room in the building to a greater or lesser extent, not protecting the next building.

 

[firefighterjake]

Sorry about derailing this thread . . . just one comment kinda made me think of this other story.

 

[blacktail]

Our state department of corrections participates in some kind of program to give firewood to low income people. The facility in the article isn't the only one that has inmates cutting firewood. Sounds like seasoning is up to the recipients.
(broken link removed)

 

[kennyp2339]

Our state department of corrections participates in some kind of program to give firewood to low income people. The facility in the article isn't the only one that has inmates cutting firewood. Sounds like seasoning is up to the recipients.
(broken link removed)

That's one great idea, our county guys always cut the trees in the right of way, they end up chipping them, they should bring them to the jail to get split it and sent out to the less fortunate

 

[Simonkenton]

That is a great story, blacktail, getting the inmates to cut and deliver the firewood. Most guys in prison are young guys, many of them are in pretty good shape. I would imagine most would prefer to spend 8 hours doing honest work, and getting out of that damn jail for a day.
Plus, I betcha many of the grateful recipients give a nice home cooked meal to the inmates.

Moreover, smart from the warden's perspective, an inmate who just spent 8 hours splitting firewood is not llikely to start a riot that night, he wants to hit the bunk.
Great story.