Got trailer... need winch

[kavu]

Your healthier and it's better than going to the gym ( less the cuties )

That is true. The first 6 years i broke by hand then used the electric to make them small. After i got the 22 ton, it made things a lot easier. Less physical but i can always use the fiskar to get some exercise. Splitting wood and cuties would be great. We need one of those gyms

 

[byQ]

Something like this might work. He is lifting logs with a 2500 lb Harbor Freight winch. It is barely doing the job but he gets them loaded. I wonder where one can get the swinging vertical metal pole like this? And I wonder how hard it would be to attach this pole so it could pick up/move a log without bending? He really saves himself a lot of work.

 

[Tar12]

The question would be how long will the battery last.....

 

[Ashful]

Something like this might work. He is lifting logs with a 2500 lb Harbor Freight winch. It is barely doing the job but he gets them loaded. I wonder where one can get the swinging vertical metal pole like this? And I wonder how hard it would be to attach this pole so it could pick up/move a log without bending? He really saves himself a lot of work.

Fun to watch, but his "max" log is smaller than anything I've ever hauled. Mine are several times that weight.

No plans on lifting, here. When logs are 3000 lb., you're best just dragging 'em!

 

[jetsam]

That guy would save himself a lot of time and effort by backing up to his log and lifting the end up 6" onto the trailer.

Better yet, he could just buck it before lifting it, which he presumably is going to do anyway.

I could see having a little winch to drag large (36"+) rounds up into my trailer, but it's not too hard to roll them up the ramp if they are kind of round.

If it's an "easy" big round, sometimes I will just split it to make it easier to lift, too. I always pack a maul with my saws for that purpose.

 

[Ashful]

@jetsam, I don't completely agree that it's easier rolling rounds. Too many of mine are out-of-round with buttress roots or other abnormalities, and they can be very heavy. I'm hauling oak, bucked to 18 inches:

40" round = 825 lb.
44" round = 998 lb.
48" round = 1188 lb.
54" round = 1502 lb.

If I can drag these up onto the trailer as a single log, I'd much rather do that than push them up my 4' tailgate ramp, which is what I've been doing. I imagine when I get the big'uns (eg. over 48"), I might still be dragging single rounds, but the 24" to 40" stuff can be dragged up as perhaps 8 foot logs (24" x 8' = 1583 lb), and anything under 24" could be dragged up as 16 foot logs (12" x 16' = 792 lb.). My trailer box (shown above) is 16' long.

 

[jetsam]

@jetsam, I don't completely agree that it's easier rolling rounds. Too many of mine are out-of-round with buttress roots or other abnormalities, and they can be very heavy. I'm hauling oak, bucked to 18 inches:

40" round = 825 lb.
44" round = 998 lb.
48" round = 1188 lb.
54" round = 1502 lb.

If I can drag these up onto the trailer as a single log, I'd much rather do that than push them up my 4' tailgate ramp, which is what I've been doing. I imagine when I get the big'uns (eg. over 48"), I might still be dragging single rounds, but the 24" to 40" stuff can be dragged up as perhaps 8 foot logs (24" x 8' = 1583 lb), and anything under 24" could be dragged up as 16 foot logs (12" x 16' = 792 lb.). My trailer box (shown above) is 16' long.

I love the way you did a table with sample diameter-to-weight calculations. I think we might be related.

Where did you get 63 lbs/cf?

My ideas are probably influenced by the fact that my trailer is single axle with lowish leaf springs. I try not to put more than ~2000 pounds on it.

A decent sized winch is going to require either a wire all the way from the fuse box, or its own battery and a charge controller to trickle charge it off the taillight circuit. I imagine that's something trailer winch vendors have figured out, though.

I might consider just a 20-40w solar panel to keep a charge on it,since the trailer parks in the open and sees only occasional use. Save me some wiring!

 

[Ashful]

I love the way you did a table with sample diameter-to-weight calculations. I think we might be related.

Where did you get 63 lbs/cf?

My ideas are probably influenced by the fact that my trailer is single axle with lowish leaf springs. I try not to put more than ~2000 pounds on it.

A decent sized winch is going to require either a wire all the way from the fuse box, or its own battery and a charge controller to trickle charge it off the taillight circuit. I imagine that's something trailer winch vendors have figured out, though.

I might consider just a 20-40w solar panel to keep a charge on it,since the trailer parks in the open and sees only occasional use. Save me some wiring!

The 63 lb/cu.ft. is a number I've been using for years. I think I got it from averaging the green weight of several of the oak species we have in this area.

Yes, I have a battery on the trailer, used to activate the trailer brakes in event of a hitch failure. I think I might need to upgrade that to a larger deep-cycle battery, sized to handle the peak/average ratio of current draw on that winch, versus the charging circuit already run to the trailer thru my 6-point plug.

 

[byQ]

How about an arch to go with your winch?

 

[maple1]

There's using your noodle...

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

How about an arch to go with your winch?

How about an arch to go with your winch?

I think a call to social services is in order. Having your toddler check the tension of the cable at work at least deserves a Darwin award nomination.

 

[Ashful]

How about an arch to go with your winch?

I like that. In fact, an arch like that was my "plan A", but I hadn't seen a good place to attach one on the top rails of my trailer. I like his idea of using the gate attachment pintels, which works surprisingly well. I'd have thought the arch pivot would need to be farther forward on the trailer to work very well, but I was wrong on that. The only thing I don't like about this is that it means pulling off my very heavy gate to install the arch, and then hauling without a gate, unless I'm going to swap them back and forth for each run.

I came up with this "plan B", because I lacked the foresight to think of using the gate hinge points. I think this could work fairly well. I'd be dragging more than lifting, but with the winch up high like this, it also gives me a place to tuck a large deep-cycle battery.



Maybe the best plan is to get that winch mounted up high, as shown in this photo, then consider the arch as phase 2.

 

[jetsam]

I like the arch, but I think it'd be simpler for me to have a frame-mounted winch in front, and drag the logs up a ramp in the rear. If you have a landscaping style tailgate, maybe screw a piece of plywood over it for easy sliding.

 

[Ashful]

Need to get moving on this. Ready to buy, now. What size winch, and why? I'm inclined to just go big, as I'm worried about duty cycle and loaded speed, if I go too small. I'd rather spend a few extra dollars for a 12,500 lb. winch, than wait an extra several minutes per log for a 4000 lb. winch, but the big'uns do come with the penalty that I could easily break something on the trailer or mount if a log snags.

Any advice folks have on battery isolators would be appreciated. The plan is to mount an extra battery (or even two) in the elevated winch mount (shown above).

Yes, I know hydraulic would be preferable, but we're talking $3k+ with truck mods (and I plan to unload this truck soon) vs. less than $1k for electric (and an ability to swap trucks randomly).

 

[Jags]

Stick with electric unless you are willing to build a self contained hydro unit on the trailer itself. Go big. You never know when you are gonna be loading something you never even thought of (dead skidder, ancient obelisk, etc.). I would think a 12500# unit would cover darn near anything.
I once heard somebody say. - if its worth doing, its worth overdoing.

 

[Ashful]

Lol... making me eat my own words, there? I'll have to look at speed and current draw of those big units, as speed and battery life are going to be important factors. Trailer payload is inly 5500#, so I don't need to worry about hauling 10k# skidsteers, but I will buy big if it means better speed or reduced battery draw.

 

[Jags]

I haven't done the math, but my suspicions say that a 10,000# unit pulling at 25% capacity probably isn't going to use much (if any) more juice than a 3500# trying to pull the same 2500# load. Line speeds can be all over the place - buyer beware.

 

[brenndatomu]

Harbor freight has a 12k # winch that is highly rated among the 4x4 mud truck guys...can be had for $300 on sale (maybe less) http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0LE...256.html/RK=0/RS=sfyjeiahIWyeozsnwS0hfTdY.T0-

 

[Ashful]

Cool. Thanks for the link! I was looking at Warn and Superwinch, but could add this to the list, too. I haven't looked at Harbor Freight in years, since they mostly sell junk, but I guess they might have a few good items. I don't need to pay for a highly-advertised name or winch size bragging rights, but will pay more for a unit that won't let me down when I need to use it.

 

[byQ]

I want to rig a winch up to a bit smaller trailer (8'x16' dually). I'm just looking to drag big rounds, half logs, and maybe an occasional full log. So I'm going to go with a mid size winch (5000-8000#). I'm going to use synthetic line instead of cable because it is safer, stronger and easier to work with. Easier to roll up and to move around. This makes sense because I'll probably be winching for several hours.

And I'm going to attach one of those truck cranes to the front of the trailer. Also I would like to have some extension twine, say 100', to retrieve wood that is far away. Lastly I'm going to use some sort of wagon or wheels that I can winch in in order to carry rounds or logs easier.

 

[Ashful]

Research that synth line before making the purchase, Q. It may not be as abrasion resistant as this application requires.

 

[mustash29]

I played around doing some mild 4x4 / off road things for a few years and have a little experience with winches.....

I got a good used Warn M-8000 off CL for about 400. I mounted it to a home made portable cradle (piece of C channel, 2" tube stock & 3 huge bolts) that plugs into the front receiver hitch on my S-10 ZR2. I never had to work it hard when wheeling but it never let me down either.

I got 2 different log loads delivered to the house. A tri-axe load of 16-20 footers and a tractor trailer load of similar sized logs. The Warn and S-10 did a nice job of dragging the logs off the top of the pile for easier bucking. When getting low in the piles, instead of cutting in the dirt, I would chain a log up to the cable and run it through a pully block that was hanging about 10 feet up in a 12" pine tree. Poor man's crane hoist system. Bucking at waist height was nice.

A series wound winch motor like this can draw upward of 400 + amps when working hard. The stock battery and 100 amp alternator were becoming taxed when at idle. Mostly because the alternator only puts out about 40 amps at idle. I upgraded to an AD-244 alternator. It bolted right up and plugged right it to the 4.3 L motor. The case is only barely bigger than the stock one, but the AD-244 puts out 100 amps at idle, does a max of 145 and cools itself better. The AD-244 is what comes stock on a full size GM truck with the HD electrical system. My Duramax has one as stock equipment. The only way to go bigger from the factory is to order dual alternators, but you get dual crappy 100's, which could be swapped out to 145's, etc.

We have an '06 Jeep Unlimited that is lifted 4.5" and running on 33's. I put a Smittybilt XRC-8 on it. I got that thing stupid cheap from www.winchdepot.com for 269 shipped. It's a good winch and has faster line speed than the Warn. We used the Jeep to drag a few logs out of the woods here and there and usually I have to strap the rear end to another tree or the winch will just drag the Jeep around like a rag doll.

I have a 16 foot 14 K GVWR trailer that I originally bought to haul the Jeep to wheeling events with. I've hauled more wood, mulch & stone on it though, LOL. I have not gotten around to mounting a winch on my trailer yet, so I will be interested in seeing how your project turns out.

I would think something in the 8-10K range would be a minimum starting point. You can always rig up a snatch block for 2x the power but that will cost you by being 2x slower line speed.

I would not want to use synthetic line for wood work. Too much potential for abrasion damage and that stuff is costly, but wire rope gets heavy and needs constant attention so you don't "birds nest" it on the winch drum.

 

[greg13]

Lol... making me eat my own words, there? I'll have to look at speed and current draw of those big units, as speed and battery life are going to be important factors. Trailer payload is inly 5500#, so I don't need to worry about hauling 10k# skidsteers, but I will buy big if it means better speed or reduced battery draw.

Don't forget to factor in the friction from dragging it, It will add to the weight.
Come BIG or stay home!

 

[Ashful]

Follow-up post, I'm happy to say the winch and my custom welded stand both worked flawlessly. In about 5 hours today, I cut and skidded five cords of wood, and hauled three cords of it home (with an extra trip to deliver my tractor back home), and unloaded it all into my wood processing area at home. This is a huge success, as I was working completely alone, I am happy with the progress.

My only issue was actually created by the winch manufacturer, not my customization. They put way too much line on the spool, such that it binds up unless wound completely evenly on the drum. This is simply not practical, I will be cutting at least 20 feet off the factory line, it is unnecessarily long.

Some photos.

 

[Ashful]

Oh, also, battery supply was a non-issue. Skidded eight logs per load without noticing any drop in performance. Did not bother running truck for recharge, other than the trip home to drop off a load.