Help me choose a Stove!

[Machria]

Congrats! Reading your recent re-summary of your wants, namely contemporary looks, high end, and three flights of stairs, I'd have figured a BK Chinook was the winner. I'm sure you'll be thrilled with the PH, though. Their owners are... umm, fanatical.

I kinda gave up on the "modern" look of it, and decided to at least get something "High End" looking, which the progress is. I did/do like the Chinook thought, decent looking unit.

 

[ScotO]

I kinda gave up on the "modern" look of it, and decided to at least get something "High End" looking, which the progress is. I did/do like the Chinook thought, decent looking unit.

Congrats on the Woodstock, one of my favorite stoves made! Judging from others on this site, that Woodstock will serve you well for many years to come. I haven't heard any real negatives about it from those that own one. Welcome to the club, BTW!

 

[rideau]

PH owners are not fanatic. Just incredibly content with their stoves, and unwilling to listen to those who don't have them label the PHs as failures, difficult to run, or run-of- the- mill, when in fact they are extremely responsive, easy to use, put out an amazing amount of heat, are impressively efficient, and have significantly longer burn time than the Fireview,a full cat and Woodstock's next largest stove.
In short, PH owners knew what they wanted from the PH, and Woodstock has more than delivered it.
Not surprisinngly, that makes for satisfied and enthusiastic owners. But not fanatics.
We can still see that other stoves are also excellent, but have different strengths and are better for different owner needs.

 

[Highbeam]

PH owners are not fanatic. Just incredibly content with their stoves, and unwilling to listen to those who don't have them label the PHs as failures, difficult to run, or run-of- the- mill, when in fact they are extremely responsive, easy to use, put out an amazing amount of heat, are impressively efficient, and have significantly longer burn time than the Fireview,a full cat and Woodstock's next largest stove.
In short, PH owners knew what they wanted from the PH, and Woodstock has more than delivered it.
Not surprisinngly, that makes for satisfied and enthusiastic owners. But not fanatics.
We can still see that other stoves are also excellent, but have different strengths and are better for different owner needs.

You sound like a politician. Lighten up, it's okay to be fanatical about something you are "incredibly satisfied" with. Just don't let it cloud your judgement.

 

[rideau]

Machria,
We've all been concentrating on helping you choose a good stove for your situation. Rereading some of your latter posts it suddenly occurred to me that the weight of your stove isn't your only problem. You are going to be carrying a heck of a lot of weight of firewood up three flights of stairs, and that could get old quickly.
Can you install a dumbwaiter, or an outside hoist like they use in Holland to take furniture to the upper floors? If you could arrange a hoist at the side of your deck and get firewood up to there that way, life would be simpler....

 

[rideau]

You sound like a politician. Lighten up, it's okay to be fanatical about something you are "incredibly satisfied" with. Just don't let it cloud your judgement.

That's amusing. I'm on to another thread.

 

[firecracker_77]

That is actually what I was getting at. I could put the same, or less, amount of wood in the 30 and get a longer burn time of usable heat than compared to the Heritage.

Why you always picking on that Heritage? I love the old girl even if she doesn't have the biggest firebox.

 

[firecracker_77]

Well, some of us do go to work for 8-9 hours and then we commute for another hour or two per day. Most of us easily burn up 12 hours between stepping out of the door and stepping back in. The last thing I want to do right before I leave and as soon as I return home is to restart a cold stove, that's called being a slave to your heater. Once you get the right stove installed, you can reload once or twice per day at leisure.

Burn times are number one for those of us that heat 100% with wood and are unable to babysit a stove all day while rocking in a chair knitting.

A casual burner can afford to have some pretty crazy priorities. Things like only top loaders, only red stoves, only ash pans, etc. can matter way more when the function of the stove as a heater is not so important.

I work about 14 hours a day, but my stove is right there with me keeping me company...the only reason I can use a Heritage with a 2.3 foot box. Otherwise, I'd be getting a Blaze King or other cat stove.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Why you always picking on that Heritage? I love the old girl even if she doesn't have the biggest firebox.

It's a good stove. It's my house that is an unforgiving bastard. The Heritage at my in-laws illustrates exactly what I am battling against as their house allows for the stove to heat their entire home.

 

[Machria]

Machria,
We've all been concentrating on helping you choose a good stove for your situation. Rereading some of your latter posts it suddenly occurred to me that the weight of your stove isn't your only problem. You are going to be carrying a heck of a lot of weight of firewood up three flights of stairs, and that could get old quickly.
Can you install a dumbwaiter, or an outside hoist like they use in Holland to take furniture to the upper floors? If you could arrange a hoist at the side of your deck and get firewood up to there that way, life would be simpler....

Funny you bring that up.... been dragging wood up here for years, and for years have said "I'm going to install a lift to the deck". Well, now that I will likely be burning alot more often, it's going to happen. I'm going to get a hoist, much like the one you can buy fo the front of a truck, and put a bracket on the top of my deck sticking out about 2 or 3 feet, so I can pull up a load of wood to the deck. Already on it, thanks!!

 

[Machria]

PH owners are not fanatic.

Well, I'd say they are, BUT, the BK owners are even more fanatical about the BK's, and the Jotuls are right behind them. So the PH's are a distant 3rd in the fanatics category!

 

[Machria]

Ok, in planning the install I just noticed the PH says in the install manual "Not appoved for an alcove install...". So, I was going to remove the corner wall from the white down which is 6'+ high (73"). I was going to leave the top of the corner wall up, and face it with stone, and face the bottom of it with stone. The pipe was going to go strait up and into that sofit/corner wall. From the corner to the edge of the wall is 38". About 1/4 of the stove (5 or 6") would be under the wall, the rest is forward of the wall or outside of it. Would this be called an "Alcove", or can I do this? OR, do I need to take the entire corner wall down?

Here's a drawing....

 

[rideau]

1) It looks to me as if more than 4 or 5 inches is under and/or behind the wall, since you show the entire 6 in pipe behind the wall....
2) Be safe...send an accurate diagram to Woodstock and ask them. Be sure to give accurate
elevation as well as overhead measurements.
I suspect you are OK because there is good air flow, but don't know what the height restriction is over the stovetop....you might have to do something to the bottom of the wall that sits over the stove, for instance. Woodstock will gladly help you, so call them, and e-mail the details.

 

[Machria]

1) It looks to me as if more than 4 or 5 inches is under and/or behind the wall, since you show the entire 6 in pipe behind the wall....

Your right, just checked in the drawing and it is under by 8 7/8" (or 9" basically).

2) Be safe...send an accurate diagram to Woodstock and ask them. Be sure to give accurate
elevation as well as overhead measurements.
I suspect you are OK because there is good air flow, but don't know what the height restriction is over the stovetop....you might have to do something to the bottom of the wall that sits over the stove, for instance. Woodstock will gladly help you, so call them, and e-mail the details.

Already emailed them the info.... just thought I'd also ask the experts here as well.

 

[begreen]

With the current plan I'd be concerned about the wood header going across the top of the stove and the proximity of the flue connector to that header and wall. The connector needs a minimum of 6" for double-wall, but I am much more comfortable with doubling that in an enclosed heat trap that the current design appears to create above the stove. Don't underestimate the heat this stove can put out.

Personally, I would open up the corner completely, then rock face it if desired. It will simplify the installation and eliminate many safety concerns. Most importantly, the stove will heat better.

Note that the current hearth pad design appears to be shy by about 4 inches in front unless there is an ashlip according to Woodstock's manual.

 

[rideau]

Begreen is right, I wasn't thinking. That stovepipe is way too close to the adjacent wall. You need 6 inches clearance to combustibles. Since the wall starts at a six foot height, you could angle the pipe back with a 45 degree likely (I haven't done the math but stove top in only about 35 inches so you have about 3 feet to work with and should be able to easily take it back far enough) until it is more than 6 inches back, then angle it straight again.....and if there is a concern about too much heat build up in behind the elevated wall, you could vent it at the top......if you really want to hide the pipe and keep the wall there.
I simply painted my pipe the same color as my stove and it looks fine in the living room. Radiates a small amount of additional heat into the room, which is not unwelcome.
If you do keep the wall, and do put vents at the top, and still find that warm air rises and is trapped in that area, then a small fan pointed at the area, pushing colder room air into the corner, should cause circulation of the warm air out the top vents and into the room.....

 

[Machria]

Note that the current hearth pad design appears to be shy by about 4 inches in front unless there is an ashlip according to Woodstock's manual.

Yes, ordered the ash lip. Thanks.

I knew I would have to angle the pipe back a bit to get it away from the front of the inside of the wall. I've been contemplating removing the entire wall as well. Two things have been holding me from doing that: 1. The other side of the room to the right has two sliding doors to a small deck, which are using the same angle, so this wall kinda of brings the look together... 2. There is a bathroom below this floor, and there is a 3 or 4" vent pipe going up through this wall from the bathroom below. I will need to hide/bury this PVC vent pipe somehow. But I will need to do that anyway since the bottom portion will be opned either way...

Startin to sound like I should just open the entire thing up.... hmmmm....

 

[Machria]

Here is an example of almost the exact same install I want to do... the only difference is I don't have the side walls jutting out at all.....

 

[Waulie]

I sure don't think what you are trying to do counts as an alcove. That said, there should be a minimum ceiling height. I just scanned the manual and didn't see it, but you might want to look closer. I'm sure Woodstock will let you know if it's OK.

 

[Machria]

I sure don't think what you are trying to do counts as an alcove. That said, there should be a minimum ceiling height. I just scanned the manual and didn't see it, but you might want to look closer. I'm sure Woodstock will let you know if it's OK.

Just had an installer over to quote replacing the chimney, do the stone work and set the stove. Very reputable guy, does nothing but stove installs. He said "it's definitely not an alcove install, it's a corner install" and I should be fine. He also said the double wall stainless pipe that would be inside the wall on the top part, has a clearence of only 2 inches. So he would set the pipe in the wall with proper clearences, and then make the stove pipe meat it at the entrance into the wall.

I sent the drawing and pic to woodstock to see what they think. Waiting for their answer.

Oh, and PS- The installer thinks he can get the stove up the stairs with his stair climbing hand-truck.

 

[begreen]

Here is an example of almost the exact same install I want to do... the only difference is I don't have the side walls jutting out at all.....

This picture helps. Without an elevation drawing it was impossible to see where the transition to class A was occurring.

Still, this is not the only difference. The big difference is that the stove in the pic is a Hearthstone Mansfield which has an unusual stovetop to alcove ceiling clearance of 36". This is exceptionally low. That said, if Woodstock gives you their written blessing to do this installation with the PH, you're good to go.

 

[rideau]

I agree with Begreen. My concern would be the amount of heat coming off hte top of the PH....if it is trapped behind that wall you will be putting over the top of the stove, it may get pretty warm in there. Again, I'd be concerned about the lower face of the wall getting too hot, unless there is some protection on it. I'm sure Woodstock will have answers to all this for you.
Didn't realize the installer would switch from stove to chimney pipe as soon as the pipe went behind that wall-expected it as it went through the ceiling. Chimney pipe clearance is different than stove pipe clearance. My chimney pipe is enclosed by a accordian looking steel outer liner, and is at least 10 inches in diameter overall. Don't know if that 10 inch assembly needs another two inches, or if the assembly provides the 2 inches required. I have ICC pipe.

 

[Machria]

. Again, I'd be concerned about the lower face of the wall getting too hot, unless there is some protection on it.

I would be putting durarock and a stone finish (thin stone...) on the lower face of the wall above the stove.

 

[Machria]

Woodstock replied my plan looks fine and would not be considered an "Alcove" install, as did my installer. She said if the clearance above it was 30" or less, then I would need to put a shield up, but I'm ok at 36". it's only 8 or 9" that is actually "under" the wall anyway, much of the stove will be forward of the wall.

Ripping out on Friday, fun fun fun!

 

[begreen]

Sounds like you are good to go. Good luck!

PS: Consider making the bottom lid with Durock and sloping it toward the interior of the room so that it is less of a heat trap.