Insert not heating room

[MikeI73]

Hi experts, I am new to using wood stoves and am hoping you can help me figure out what I'm doing wrong (or if my expectations are wrong). Long story short, my stove burns hot but the room it's in stays cool, and the stove isn't heating the rest of the level, let alone the rest of the house. I was hoping to rely less on gas to heat, but that is not proving to be the case.
I have an Enviro Boston 1700 insert, rated at 74000 BTU. It is connected to a newly installed 5.5 inch, 35-foot stainless liner (uninsulated) through an interior chimney. I am burning seasoned (2+ years split) locust and maple. The fire burns very hot (I don't have a thermometer to measure it but sitting within 2 feet of the stove it is so hot my eyes water!). It is in a 16'x24' room on the first floor of my house. It is an old home of masonry construction (clay block sandwiched between interior plaster and exterior stucco). Each of the 3 stories of my home is about 1700 sq ft. Floor plan is fairly open with wide doorways from room to room and a wide open staircase to the 2nd floor. Ceilings are 10 feet tall. I feed the stove with 3-5 logs every 3-5 hours and clean out ash every 3-4 days so I have a bed of ash and coals that ranges from 1 to 3 inches deep between cleanings. Once the fire is going, I close the air intake down to about 25% to get a nice slow flame with good secondary combustion.
My problem is that the room in which the stove is installed only stays between 65 and 68 degrees Fahrenheit when 15F to 35F outside, with the help of 2 steam radiators in the room. My thermostat to control the boiler is on the 2nd floor and is set between 64 and 67F depending on time of day. Boiler runs about 7 hours per day when below 30F outside. I run the fan on the Boston almost constantly, plus have a heat-powered fan on the top ledge of the stove. I have recently started using a box fan in a cold corner of the room to blow air toward the stove, which has helped raise the room temp about 1 degree on average vs without the fan. I am also using a small fan in the adjacent foyer to help move some of that warm air up the stairs.
I feel like I should be roasting in this room, and that the heat should carry throughout at least the first and possibly second floors of my home. What am I doing wrong? I've been in other wood-heated homes where you'd sweat in a t-shirt, yet my setup is producing lots of light bit little heat.
Am I expecting too much from the BTUs for my square footage? Any ideas to help keep the house more toasty with wood and with less reliance on gas?

 

[DAKSY]

How old is your home?
How well is it insulated?
Is there a block-off plate in the damper area?
Have you checked the moisture content of your wood?

 

[MikeI73]

Thanks for getting back to me, good questions. the home is 110 years old, it doesn't have fiberglass insulation in the walls. The walls are 8 in thick and all masonry. The house seems to retain heat fairly well. The windows are mostly original single pane with good full-frame wooden storms.
I just split and tested a couple logs and they read between 13.5% and 16.5%.
I do not have a block-off at the top, and am thinking maybe I'm just losing heat up the chimney since 85% of the surface area of the stove is behind the decorative surround of the stove. Do you think a block-off (or lack thereof) would make that big of a difference?

 

[moresnow]

Sounds like a huge heat sink with questionable, if any insulation and old school single pane windows. Stone, block/brick, concrete walls eat heat output like crazy. Research block off plate here and get one installed to start with.
The wood you test should be up to room temp prior to re-splitting and testing. Not sure if that's how you are testing?
Post a few pics of the stove install.

 

[Gearhead660]

Thanks for getting back to me, good questions. the home is 110 years old, it doesn't have fiberglass insulation in the walls. The walls are 8 in thick and all masonry. The house seems to retain heat fairly well. The windows are mostly original single pane with good full-frame wooden storms.
I just split and tested a couple logs and they read between 13.5% and 16.5%.
I do not have a block-off at the top, and am thinking maybe I'm just losing heat up the chimney since 85% of the surface area of the stove is behind the decorative surround of the stove. Do you think a block-off (or lack thereof) would make that big of a difference?

Inserts in my opinion need a block off plate or else you are loosing heat up the chimney. I noticed a big difference after installing one.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I've been in other wood-heated homes where you'd sweat in a t-shirt, yet my setup is producing lots of light bit little heat.

Were those other homes heated with an Insert? Also with no insulation it will be very difficult to heat with any type of stove ,that stone wall sucking out the heat constantly. The r value of 8" of stone is somewhere between 1 and 2. About 90 % less than it should be.

 

[mellow]

I would install a block off plate and insulate the fireplace, I bet you are using quite a bit of btu's to the masonry.

 

[jatoxico]

The fire burns very hot (I don't have a thermometer to measure it but sitting within 2 feet of the stove it is so hot my eyes water!).

the home is 110 years old, it doesn't have fiberglass insulation in the walls. The walls are 8 in thick and all masonry.

Adding a block off plate is good advice but from what you said this sounds more like a house problem than a stove problem.

 

[Bad LP]

You could try opening a couple of windows.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

Thanks for getting back to me, good questions. the home is 110 years old, it doesn't have fiberglass insulation in the walls. The walls are 8 in thick and all masonry. The house seems to retain heat fairly well. The windows are mostly original single pane with good full-frame wooden storms.
I just split and tested a couple logs and they read between 13.5% and 16.5%.
I do not have a block-off at the top, and am thinking maybe I'm just losing heat up the chimney since 85% of the surface area of the stove is behind the decorative surround of the stove. Do you think a block-off (or lack thereof) would make that big of a difference?

Yes, big difference.

 

[begreen]

Adding a block off plate is good advice but from what you said this sounds more like a house problem than a stove problem.

^^^This^^^ The Boston 1700 is an excellent heater. It sounds like mostly heatloss. That and the fact that one stove is not going to heat 5100 sq ft! My guess is that a lot of the heat is convecting out of the room to the rest of the house and still more through the stone walls. Have someone do an IR scan on the exterior with a FLIR. It should show the heat losses quite graphically.

 

[Dix]

Enviro Boston 1700 insert

2.5 cubic feet firebox, correct?

I feed the stove with 3-5 logs every 3-5 hours

You need to let that puppy cycle. With a 2.5 CF box, you can load it for a longer burn time / more heat output.

(I don't have a thermometer to measure it but sitting within 2 feet of the stove it is so hot my eyes water!)

A magnetic thermometer attached over the upper left hand corner of the door (if it will fit, I looked at the manual), will give you a decent reading, adding 100 - 200 degrees.

Most assuredly, insulation issues in the home are also an issue.

Welcome to the forums

 

[NoGoodAtScreenNames]

Like others have said, a block off plate with some insulation on top will help. I’ve been burning 24/7 due to being home during quarantine doing two loads a day. If you are only getting 3-5 hours you are not loading enough. Load it up to to the top of the wall brick try not to put wood directly on the burn tubes. For measuring temps use a probe from Auber or use an IR gun pointed through the air outlet.

BTW when you do the block off plate don’t tighten the screws that hold the top or side panels. Let gravity hold them so you can taken them off later without any tools.

 

[MikeI73]

Thanks everyone for the quick and helpful responses. Definitely a consensus that a block-off is in order. I will buy the insulation and some sheet metal this week. Some other updates:
1) I pulled the stove about 6 inches forward (into the room) to look behind it to plan out the blockoff. Keeping it there the room does feel warmer. So that gives me hope that a block-off will help.
2) this evening I covered up a big exterior french door in that room with 2 mil plastic. The plastic is bowing into the room so those windows and doors are draftier than I thought. Room temp is currently 69F (28F outside temp) so a slight improvement. I will cover up the other windows tomorrow and see how much better it gets.
3) I might be wrong about the construction of the home. I do have electrical outlets in the exterior walls so maybe there is wood framing there instead of or in addition to clay block (I was thinking that based in the construction of the garage, which definitely is clay block with stucco). Regardless, probably not insulated well due to age, and lots of big 110-year old windows.
4) some photos of the install as requested.

I'll post an update after installing the blockoff, with hopefully good news. This coming weekend is the coldest weather so far this winter with single-digit/subzero overnight lows.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

You've gotten good advice about a block-off plate and insulating the fireplace.

It's great that you've discovered (and covered) a leaky door. I know that installing interior window inserts and foam sealants in outlets helped reduce air infiltration in our house. I was going to suggest that you try to close off the insert room as best you can and see what sort of temperatures you see. It sounds as if heat may very well be heading to other parts of the house, and as Begreen points out, no insert is going to heat 5,100 sq. ft.

Keep in mind also that when stove manufacturers publish square footage guidelines, they are assuming a standard 8 ft ceiling in a moderate climate. Your ten foot ceilings add the equivalent of another 1275 sq. ft. to your home's already high square footage viewed that way. It really may be that your expectations are not reasonable, given the size and construction of your house.

We live in a large home with high ceilings in a very different climate from yours (Texas), and we heat partially with an Enviro Kodiak 1700. Our house has three gas furnaces. The insert allows us to avoid using one entirely, to use a second much less, and it probably cuts down on the third, but it's not so obvious. Our gas bills dropped considerably when the stove was installed. We occasionally see temperatures in the 20's, often the 30's and 40's, but we get warmer during the day (it was in the 70's earlier this week, and we didn't use the stove, of course). If our heat flowed equally to all parts of our house, we'd feel much less of it, I'm sure. It might be useful to invest in an infrared temperature gun not only to check your stove temperatures, but to assess where the warm air is in your house.

Do you have ceiling fans that can move air down from ceilings?

One last thing I noticed was that in your picture of the fire in your stove, the glass looks very cloudy. I couldn't get the best view, so I may not be seeing it correctly, but it makes me think that you may have some issues with some of your wood being underseasoned. You said it was two year split locust and maple, which sounds like it should be great, but do you have a moisture meter reading from a fresh split at room temperature just to be sure?

 

[Gearhead660]

Thanks everyone for the quick and helpful responses. Definitely a consensus that a block-off is in order. I will buy the insulation and some sheet metal this week. Some other updates:
1) I pulled the stove about 6 inches forward (into the room) to look behind it to plan out the blockoff. Keeping it there the room does feel warmer. So that gives me hope that a block-off will help.
2) this evening I covered up a big exterior french door in that room with 2 mil plastic. The plastic is bowing into the room so those windows and doors are draftier than I thought. Room temp is currently 69F (28F outside temp) so a slight improvement. I will cover up the other windows tomorrow and see how much better it gets.
3) I might be wrong about the construction of the home. I do have electrical outlets in the exterior walls so maybe there is wood framing there instead of or in addition to clay block (I was thinking that based in the construction of the garage, which definitely is clay block with stucco). Regardless, probably not insulated well due to age, and lots of big 110-year old windows.
4) some photos of the install as requested.

I'll post an update after installing the blockoff, with hopefully good news. This coming weekend is the coldest weather so far this winter with single-digit/subzero overnight lows.

Alot of heat going up that chimney. Once you get a block off plate installed, try running without the surround. May not look the best but I notice more heat without it.

 

[shortys7777]

Came here to say block off plate. Even shoving insulation as far up the cavity as possibly by hand is going to help. I did this then cut my chimney damper to fit around the flue pipe. While not perfect it heats my entire house 1,450 sq feet to the point the furthest room in the house is 68-70. My living room gets very hot sometimes. As stated load that stuff up. I pack mine in almost to the tubes. You will see better heat just doing these two things in the room with stove.

 

[NoGoodAtScreenNames]

Alot of heat going up that chimney. Once you get a block off plate installed, try running without the surround. May not look the best but I notice more heat without it.

Respectfully disagree. The Boston has a convective jacket so just running the fan does a lot and you need the surround to hold the casing for the fan. When I run without the fan in the late stages a lot of heat comes out the top because of the block off plate.

But most important, the Boston is a nice looking insert. When I take the surround off to do maintenance it looks like a wet dog shivering in the cold. If you want an ugly box in your fireplace get a Blaze King. Just kidding - I’m just bitter that my stove got cancelled and taking it out on BK.

 

[mellow]

After looking at your pictures I will say again, Insulate your fireplace along with the block off plate. Keep the heat in the fireplace so your insert can spit the heat out through the fans. See the link in my signature.

 

[brenndatomu]

Is the liner appliance adapter seated in the stove? Sure doesn't look like it...looks to me like that connection needs a 15-30* stainless elbow... https://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/fixed-elbow-for-flexible-liners.php

 

[Gearhead660]

Respectfully disagree. The Boston has a convective jacket so just running the fan does a lot and you need the surround to hold the casing for the fan. When I run without the fan in the late stages a lot of heat comes out the top because of the block off plate.

But most important, the Boston is a nice looking insert. When I take the surround off to do maintenance it looks like a wet dog shivering in the cold. If you want an ugly box in your fireplace get a Blaze King. Just kidding - I’m just bitter that my stove got cancelled and taking it out on BK.

Guess not all inserts are made the same. I was referring to the trim/faceplate that covers the gap between the stove and fireplace. Were you thinking the same?

 

[MMH]

I’ll tag on a smidge here, I think a block off plate won’t hurt however as others said there is another component which is the home; 110 yr old go through and seal up what you can, if an option mak3 it more energy efficient etc, but as others said masonry etc sucks a lot of heat, and the home is 5100 sqft...that’s a lot of heating to do in an old drafty home with 1 stove. Just my 2 cents.

 

[mcdougy]

Agreed, the beauty of old homes come with a few snags. Winter being a real part of it. The old timers must have just toughed it out with lots of clothing and the slippers on. Its a lot harder sell to us modern humans who have learnt the push of buttons and flick of switches makes life "normal" Not wanting to discourage but if its as described construction, 68 degrees might be considered considered balmy .on some winter days. The more changes you make to the house the more heat you will receive as stated. Blocknoff plate just makes sense, tearing open walls to stick in some roxul may not??

 

[bholler]

Is the liner appliance adapter seated in the stove? Sure doesn't look like it...looks to me like that connection needs a 15-30* stainless elbow... https://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/fixed-elbow-for-flexible-liners.php
View attachment 273030

Yeah that is one of the install issues I see

 

[NoGoodAtScreenNames]

Guess not all inserts are made the same. I was referring to the trim/faceplate that covers the gap between the stove and fireplace. Were you thinking the same?

Yeah. The side panels, including the one that covers the fan are screwed into the back surround. Without that a kid or critter can easily access the squirrel cage of the fan. You could remove it but I would unplug the fan. It will be safe then. Ugly. But safe.