Job creation from a 1%er

[Jags]

Good for Boener. I wish I could put myself in his position. I'm not one to disparage the winning team...

He is not supposed to be a team. He is supposed to represent the peoples interests. The numbers are hard to nail down, but it appears that 70+ % of Americans want the min. wage to be increased.

 

[razerface]

He is not supposed to be a team. He is supposed to represent the peoples interests. The numbers are hard to nail down, but it appears that 70+ % of Americans want the min. wage to be increased.

where did you find that?

 

[Ashful]

... it appears that 70+ % of Americans want the min. wage to be increased.

That's a surprising stat. I don't even think 70% of the people on this forum want the minimum wage increased.

There's a reason we have representatives, rather than public voting on law. We'd be in a real mess if the majority ruled. Thankfully, very few of the majority consistently vote.

 

[ironpony]

Wow, still going in circles. This is what it must be like to be a politician.

 

[Ashful]

Wow, still going in circles. This is what it must be like to be a politician.

Yeah... I just stick my head in to stir the pot every few days, when I'm waiting on my computers to crunch some numbers.

 

[Jags]

There's a reason we have representatives, rather than public voting on law.

This isn't a case of majority wins. These numbers exceed the requirement for a super majority to change the constitution. It is not trivial.

 

[Jags]

where did you find that?

Where can I quote from that you will believe? Reviewing many polls from all sorts of places state on average between 70-73%.

 

[Ashful]

Where can I quote from that you will believe?

(ducking and running...)

 

[Jags]

Exactly my point.

 

[razerface]

I am going to watch this fox news and see what the fuss is all about. What channel is it on? Do you need cable?

 

[Grisu]

C'mon guys, this ain't rocket science. Supply and demand. If you have a skill for which there's demand, and supply is limited, then you pay. Farm workers aren't all without skill, but there's an infinite supply of guys who will take the job of the current lot, should they protest for higher wages. Likewise for landscapers, trash haulers, and just about any job that can be worked at some minimum level right off the street. I suspect most people want it that way... or are you the rare person hoping your emergency neurosurgeon is making farm laborer wages?

The supply is there and won't change (At least I hope - death panels anyone? ) so why is demand missing? (And please don't claim that there are enough skill jobs out there to get most unemployed/low-wage earners a job. Not to mention that this would still not explain how overall wages would increase then. Please see my previous post, points 3 and 4.)
Btw. Yes, I am the rare person that hopes the neurosurgeon would make farm laborer wages but my farmworker would earn $100,000. Do I assume all MDs will drop their scalpels and go pick lettuce in the field or mop floors? No. Most people dislike hard, manual labor and would not even do it if it was compensated fairly. (Would be an interesting poll question: "What kind of job would you like to do when all jobs pay exactly the same per hour?" Would we really have a sudden shortage in MDs? Maybe we would finally get rid off most lawyers and finance guys.)

There you have it. Folks seem to be unhappy with the bed they've made.

As if your environment has nothing to do with it. And if skills is everything how come we don't pay monkeys or cats the big bucks? (broken link removed)

 

[stoveguy2esw]

wonder what a loaf of bread would cost if everyone made 100K a year?

 

[Cynnergy]

i was wondering where you were,,,do you live in canada? Do you use canada's health system? We listen to news reports of huge delays in getting care thru the health system there. What have you experienced?


We are pretty far off track of this thread.....

At the expense of being further off track, I do live in Canada. I haven't had to use the health care system all that much, although I will say that having to pay for birth control is expensive (it's free in the UK, which is the only other system I have real experience with and I like that better!). We don't actually have a universal system (dental and optometry isn't covered, and you can buy insurance for things like private beds if you have to stay in hospital, chiropracters,etc).

Basically if you have a life-threatening emergency, you move to the front of the line and get treated ASAP. E.g. my uncle had a quadruple bypass within a day of an unusual heart monitor readout during a routine health check for his trucker job. I think it cost him a total of $25 for the ambulance ride. He's still alive and kicking 15 years later.

If it's not an emergency, you move to the back of the line. E.g. my sister had to wait 6 months for an appointment with a specialist to deal with her heartburn that wouldn't respond to any of the usual meds.

The difference between the UK and the Cdn system is that if my sister were in the UK, she could opt to go private and pay to be seen by a private specialist sooner. In Canada that's illegal because of the universality of access.

There are pros and cons to both systems but they both beat the $400/month my brother-in-law was paying in the US before my other sister got a job where both of their healthcare was covered. IMHO.

 

[Grisu]

ask some old coal miners how that worked out. Owned by the company. I have family who came out of Harlen county.

As if the current minimum wage workers are doing any better. My point is that money only has value because you can buy stuff with it. Don't believe me? Take the money out of your monopoly game and try to go shopping with it. Real money, zero value.

nope,,,not true. I can make all the stuff I want,,,but as I retire,,,,i better have saved some money, which will determine my standard of living. There is no doubt about that statement as i watch people who did not save money try to live.

Me, me, me; 5 times in one sentence. It is really sad that there are people who cannot look beyond their own self-interest. I was talking of "we" as in "our country" or "our society". You are just trying to get the biggest piece of the cake, I try to bake a larger cake so that everyone gets to eat more.
And what are those people are trying to buy? Current productive output which is (among others) determined by the money spent by our parent's generation on infrastructure and education. Maybe we should just take you and your family and all your material possessions (including money) and drop you off on a remote island. Let's see how much good your money does you there.

Most of what we "produce" is consumable, and will not last into the future as something we need for a standard of living. That's why they call us "consumers". Consumables,,,,are here and gone. That word "consumables" is what kills your above theory.

And what determines the production of those consumables? Or are they just falling from the sky?

 

[Grisu]

wonder what a loaf of bread would cost if everyone made 100K a year?

Maybe the equivalent of the real amount of labor time that is required to make one? But you are right, what would happen is that prices would rise aka inflation. Thus, unemployment and low wages are used by the guys with money to keep inflation low so their wealth does not lose value (purchasing power).

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Take the money out of your monopoly game and try to go shopping with it. Real money, zero value.

real money? from a board game? youre kidding right?

 

[Grisu]

real money? from a board game? youre kidding right?

Hyman Minsky:"Everyone can create money; the problem is to get it accepted."

So what distinguishes monopoly money from US-$?

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Hyman Minsky:"Everyone can create money; the problem is to get it accepted."

So what distinguishes monopoly money from US-$?

well, possibly the fact that its government backed currency, do you think Hasbro is going to redeem your monopoly money for actual cash? if this was the case people would sit home on their computers and just print off whatever they want to call money and expect to spend it. just aint going to happen.

 

[Jags]

Bitcoins

 

[Ashful]

unemployment and low wages are used by the guys with money to keep inflation low so their wealth does not lose value (purchasing power).

Only if they're holding cash dollars. If you're holding real assets, then inflation is your friend.

 

[razerface]

As if the current minimum wage workers are doing any better. My point is that money only has value because you can buy stuff with it. Don't believe me? Take the money out of your monopoly game and try to go shopping with it. Real money, zero value.



Me, me, me; 5 times in one sentence. It is really sad that there are people who cannot look beyond their own self-interest.

well,,,are you,,,you,,,,you,,, going to save for my retirement? There I go again, worrying about myself.(taking responsibility)

Just as a point,,,"me" was in the sentence zero times.

The easiest way to hide something from the general public, is to say it in correct english, and put it in paragraph form.

 

[razerface]

So what distinguishes monopoly money from US-$?

Beware of someone offering to pay you in monoploy money or you will learn quickly!

 

[Ashful]

The supply is there and won't change... so why is demand missing?

It's not missing. The supply is simply greater than the demand. We only eat so much produce.

 

[Jags]

In all fairness - Just read one from The Wall Street Journal at 63% that want the min wage hike. The lowest I have seen so far.

 

[razerface]

In all fairness - Just read one from The Wall Street Journal at 63% that want the min wage hike. The lowest I have seen so far.

Here is one showing 57%
http://management.fortune.cnn.com/2014/03/10/minimum-wage-increase/
I saw a couple at 71, and the low 60's

The famous Fox News is at 66%