What is the remedy to keep this stove from over firing?Is it about the gaskets?They all seem pretty good,would the gaskets be the cause?Thanks
jotul firelight 12 over firing
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Check around your stove with a smoke stick or an incense stick or a cigarette, while it's got a good fire going.
If smoke gets drawn into the stove in an area other than the primary air intake, there's your trouble spot.
If smoke gets drawn into the stove in an area other than the primary air intake, there's your trouble spot.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Yeah, nothing unique about this stove, other than it being a typical cast iron stove with cemented joints all 'round. All three doors (ash pan, front, lid) have a high probability of being the problem, as all three have their own flaws:
1. Ash pan door, wide but not tall, puts a ton of stress on that hinge. Make sure hinge is solid, and that door is landing on gasket when closed.
2. Front doors, the double door is tricky, particularly the gasket between them. It should be 1/4" braided (not woven) gasket around the perimeter of both, and 3/16" braided (online manual has a typo, here) between the doors. There is always likelihood of leakage at the top corner of either door, or the top edge between the doors, since the latch is at the bottom.
3. Ash door, this gasket must be 1/4" braided (not woven), and perfectly installed, since you're only relying on gravity and the weight of the door for a good seal.
So, I'd remove all of the inner panels (both sides and rear), and do the bright light trick first. Try the smoke / incense from outside, and dollar bill on ash and front doors, as well. If that fails, start pulling and replacing gaskets, starting with ash door.
BTW... what do you classify as "over fire"? How long have you been running this stove, and has performance recently changed?
1. Ash pan door, wide but not tall, puts a ton of stress on that hinge. Make sure hinge is solid, and that door is landing on gasket when closed.
2. Front doors, the double door is tricky, particularly the gasket between them. It should be 1/4" braided (not woven) gasket around the perimeter of both, and 3/16" braided (online manual has a typo, here) between the doors. There is always likelihood of leakage at the top corner of either door, or the top edge between the doors, since the latch is at the bottom.
3. Ash door, this gasket must be 1/4" braided (not woven), and perfectly installed, since you're only relying on gravity and the weight of the door for a good seal.
So, I'd remove all of the inner panels (both sides and rear), and do the bright light trick first. Try the smoke / incense from outside, and dollar bill on ash and front doors, as well. If that fails, start pulling and replacing gaskets, starting with ash door.
BTW... what do you classify as "over fire"? How long have you been running this stove, and has performance recently changed?
It was glowing red hot at the back of the fire box lower ends,could not reduce intake, with it dampered, to slow it enough..nervous hour or two,.It was cold ,and as our only source of heat,I loaded it late at nite! Thank you for your assistance, and will check these things ,prior to going to play tugboat!
Running it 3 years,and it seems to be burning clean ,mornings ,the top door is light ash color..seems pretty good.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
I've had it glow in the center back of the stove, right at the catalytic combustor, a few times. I believe this is a design flaw, as the catalytic combustor is half the size of any comparable stove on the market, and I believe it's just too small to handle the fuel produced by a 3 cu.ft. box full of wood.
However, I've never had any other part of the stove leak, and always found the stove to be very controllable. So, if you're seeing the firebox (not just the area directly behind the combustor) glow, then I think we can assume there's an air leak somewhere. Perhaps someone more experienced than me can say where it might be, given where it's glowing (wouldn't the hot spot normally be close to the leak?), but I'd be going thru the checklist I already posted. The ash door is easy to check, as are the main doors. The lid can also be checked with a dollar bill, although that's more of a judgement call. I do know many use too much cement when installing their gaskets, which could cause a leak at the lid gasket. Have you changed any gaskets or other hardware this season, which might be a good place to start looking?
However, I've never had any other part of the stove leak, and always found the stove to be very controllable. So, if you're seeing the firebox (not just the area directly behind the combustor) glow, then I think we can assume there's an air leak somewhere. Perhaps someone more experienced than me can say where it might be, given where it's glowing (wouldn't the hot spot normally be close to the leak?), but I'd be going thru the checklist I already posted. The ash door is easy to check, as are the main doors. The lid can also be checked with a dollar bill, although that's more of a judgement call. I do know many use too much cement when installing their gaskets, which could cause a leak at the lid gasket. Have you changed any gaskets or other hardware this season, which might be a good place to start looking?
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Actually, I've taken apart 20+ year old Firelights, and that gasket is usually perfect unless someone before monkeyed with taking the top off. With the stove assembled, there's really nothing that can happen to it. It's a very cool design feature.
There are gaskets that could leak, but my money is on the three sets of door gaskets, not this one. I've seen more than one Firelight with the top load door gasket glued in wrong. It should be glued to the stove (with minimal cement), and not to the top-load door.
Hi ashful, are there only two side bolts on the top?I plan on all gaskets,do you have a suggestion on the extent to go..thanks
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Yep. Just the pushrod keeper (two screws), and the two big bolts you'll find at either side of the top, if you stick your head in the firebox and look up.
Most of this stove is cemented, not gasketed. I'm honestly not one to ask how far to go, as I'm thoroughly through with rebuilding 30 year old stoves. They're too easy to just replace with something newer and better, to justify the headache of rebuilding, IMO.
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Most of this stove is cemented, not gasketed. I'm honestly not one to ask how far to go, as I'm thoroughly through with rebuilding 30 year old stoves. They're too easy to just replace with something newer and better, to justify the headache of rebuilding, IMO.
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Ashful at one time was joful and had a firelight 12 museum in his house with operating several at the same time, what he says about it isn't worth rebuilding them has a lot of truth to it, he tried his hardest to heat with them and keep them going and in the end he was pulling his hair out and upgraded to new stoves, he has been much less grumpy around here since then 
As it being your sole heating appliance, I would put that stove aside and use it as a backup for something new, heck, even an Englander 30nc would give you less troubles and give you plenty of heat and they can be had for $600-$800 brand new.
As it being your sole heating appliance, I would put that stove aside and use it as a backup for something new, heck, even an Englander 30nc would give you less troubles and give you plenty of heat and they can be had for $600-$800 brand new.
afternoon Ashful,am doing the cat chamber and a new cat,also the gaskets,am having a time of removing the inner back plate.I removed the top and gasket is goog one bolt wes loose,which might of had a lio to do with my inital over heating last year,putting some money into this .Saw your comment about just buying a new stove,the scott in me if doing battle on that front.I know you are not too keen on a cat in these,but im stubborn,and will try one any way,are the steel ones any good,found both ,ceramic and steel,thank you for your 2 cents,Brian
kennyp2339
Minister of Fire
I read a post from ashful saying to get to the inner back plate you need to pull the top out, being careful not to damage the bypass plates, then the back plate will lift right out, look it up
Do I need to take a Jotul 12 apart to install the interior burn plate?
Ashful
Minister of Fire
My memory on cat's in the Jotul 12:
1. Original Corning OEM cat seemed to hold up okay. Never had any issue with them, other than being old and depleted.
2. Condar SteelCats (diesel foil, ca.2013) did not survive. They got hot enough to distort, which caused the small passages to close off. They actually burned thru the side walls at the welds that hold them together, as well. Condar reported many others were having the same problem in their downdraft cat stoves (Jotul 12's and VC's).
3. Condar ceramic cats worked well, except the expanding gasket they install between the ceramic element and steel can would expand a little, and this damaged my refractory cat chamber and cover. That set of refractory parts cost $515 + s/h, as of last purchase, so this was not acceptable.
4. Firecat combustor was the one that really took off in both my stoves, going over 2000 F in each. The metal can completely melted off both. I blamed the cat, at the time, but do wonder now if there was some other damage causing the cat to go nuclear. The odd thing is that one was run in a stove that had just previously run a Condar cat, and the other was in a freshly-rebuilt stove (new refractory). Both stoves were subsequently run on old OEM cat's again, with no issues.
So, the big question then is... what the hell can you use? You can't buy the original OEM Corning cat assembly.
Some have purchased Condar ceramic cat's, and simply replaced the expanding gasket material with something else. Some used gasket cement for this, which I suspect will result in a fractured ceramic (CTE mismatch). I never did this myself, but I'd be packing the gap with regular fiberglass gasket rope, if I were to go this route.
My solution was to go on ebay and buy up every old OEM Corning catalytic combustor I could find. I ended up finding three good ones, over the course of a few months, and I was set. They were old, and maybe somewhat depleted, but they worked.
1. Original Corning OEM cat seemed to hold up okay. Never had any issue with them, other than being old and depleted.
2. Condar SteelCats (diesel foil, ca.2013) did not survive. They got hot enough to distort, which caused the small passages to close off. They actually burned thru the side walls at the welds that hold them together, as well. Condar reported many others were having the same problem in their downdraft cat stoves (Jotul 12's and VC's).
3. Condar ceramic cats worked well, except the expanding gasket they install between the ceramic element and steel can would expand a little, and this damaged my refractory cat chamber and cover. That set of refractory parts cost $515 + s/h, as of last purchase, so this was not acceptable.
4. Firecat combustor was the one that really took off in both my stoves, going over 2000 F in each. The metal can completely melted off both. I blamed the cat, at the time, but do wonder now if there was some other damage causing the cat to go nuclear. The odd thing is that one was run in a stove that had just previously run a Condar cat, and the other was in a freshly-rebuilt stove (new refractory). Both stoves were subsequently run on old OEM cat's again, with no issues.
So, the big question then is... what the hell can you use? You can't buy the original OEM Corning cat assembly.
Some have purchased Condar ceramic cat's, and simply replaced the expanding gasket material with something else. Some used gasket cement for this, which I suspect will result in a fractured ceramic (CTE mismatch). I never did this myself, but I'd be packing the gap with regular fiberglass gasket rope, if I were to go this route.
My solution was to go on ebay and buy up every old OEM Corning catalytic combustor I could find. I ended up finding three good ones, over the course of a few months, and I was set. They were old, and maybe somewhat depleted, but they worked.
I have found some ceramic ones with no bands but just slightly under sized ,would they work?
My rear plate in front of the cat chamber will not come out,it is loose,but gets jammed on the foot peddle chamber and the damper arm metal enclosure on the top of the plate.,ideas?
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Yeah, you pretty much have to pull the lid off the stove. Don't worry, it's very easy on/off. Procedure posted here, many times.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
You may find this helpful:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/yikes-1035f-on-outside-of-stove.140222/page-4#post-1897367
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/yikes-1035f-on-outside-of-stove.140222/page-4#post-1897367
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Was your damper frame installed over inner fire back? Should be under it, from my memory, not over it. I never had to remove damper frame to pull inner fireback, as you can see in those photos.
Fire back is loose ,seems to be of angle,hits on the damper /footpeddle channel at an angle ,won't come clear to remove, damper frame Har to take our and reinstall?
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