Looking for Wood Insert- Tax Credit Qualified

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Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
Hello, I am looking for a wood insert that meets the 75% HHV and thus qualifies for the tax credit. I had the Drolet 1800i in mind until i discovered it only hits 69% on the HHV scale. 1800i can be had for $2149. Trying not to break the bank, but not sure what all is available. Prefer to stay non-catalyst if possible.
Any suggestions or will the qualified models be cost prohibitive?
 

jalmondale

Member
Dec 16, 2021
140
NY
You might find this database helpful:

It looks like Travis Industries has two hybrid inserts that qualify, which will give you the flame quality of a non-cat. Some of the others might be inserts as well - unfortunately, it doesn't look like you can filter by that (I searched for Type = Wood Stove and HHV >= 75, setting number of records per page to 'all')
 

abisen

New Member
Nov 14, 2021
11
PNW
I am in the same situation. So far there are only 3 options (2 viable).

Blaze King (princess, asford & sirocco)
Kuma (cascade le)
Hearthstone (clydesdale)

The one from Hearthstone is “coming soon” for last 1 year. Also Lopi does not make Hybrid inserts anymore.
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
3,548
SE North Carolina
I decided a DIY install of the 1800i was enough cheaper than than any of the qualifying inserts and tax credits and I haven’t done my taxes yet to see if I would even get the full credit. (It was a second stove that only sees occasional use). BK Princess was my choice. I can you you if I had a BK downstairs my wood consumption would be a lot more as I would have kept it running on low. Instead of letting it out out for days/weeks at a time.
 
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begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
96,376
South Puget Sound, WA
Yes, there comes a point where the 26% savings is still more than the cost of a different stove or that one can not really use the 26% credit. Remember, it's not a refund.
 
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BrianVA

Burning Hunk
Oct 28, 2020
109
Central VA
You might find this database helpful:

It looks like Travis Industries has two hybrid inserts that qualify, which will give you the flame quality of a non-cat. Some of the others might be inserts as well - unfortunately, it doesn't look like you can filter by that (I searched for Type = Wood Stove and HHV >= 75, setting number of records per page to 'all')
According to their website, the Lopi Evergreen qualifies at 77.1% HHV, but none of the others do. Also, all of the Lopi inserts are noncat, they discontinued their hybrid inserts starting with the 2020 models.
 

abisen

New Member
Nov 14, 2021
11
PNW
According to their website, the Lopi Evergreen qualifies at 77.1% HHV, but none of the others do. Also, all of the Lopi inserts are noncat, they discontinued their hybrid inserts starting with the 2020 models.
Their Evergreen series are for stoves not inserts if I am not mistaken.
 

abisen

New Member
Nov 14, 2021
11
PNW
Yes, there comes a point where the 26% savings is still more than the cost of a different stove or that one can not really use the 26% credit. Remember, it's not a refund.
The credit matters if you are in the process of converting your traditional fireplace with an insert. I got quotes last month and they were $7.5K for Lopi Large, Liner, Electrical and Labor.

I can see the credits not being lucrative for replacing the insert with a new one.
 

Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
I got "ballpark" quote from local blaze king seller today. $3600 for BK princess, $850 for liner, $850 for install. Assuming 26% credit ($5300 * .74) , net cost around $3922.
Can get drolet 1800i trio pack for $2150. Assuming same $850 for install, net cost around $3000. Can anyone convince me the BK is worth the additional cost? I will admit, the longer but times asserted by BK does have me second-guessing. Thoughts?
 

abisen

New Member
Nov 14, 2021
11
PNW
I got "ballpark" quote from local blaze king seller today. $3600 for BK princess, $850 for liner, $850 for install. Assuming 26% credit ($5300 * .74) , net cost around $3922.
Can get drolet 1800i trio pack for $2150. Assuming same $850 for install, net cost around $3000. Can anyone convince me the BK is worth the additional cost? I will admit, the longer but times asserted by BK does have me second-guessing. Thoughts?
Does $2150 includes liner? If not then Drolet is $3850.
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
3,548
SE North Carolina
I got "ballpark" quote from local blaze king seller today. $3600 for BK princess, $850 for liner, $850 for install. Assuming 26% credit ($5300 * .74) , net cost around $3922.
Can get drolet 1800i trio pack for $2150. Assuming same $850 for install, net cost around $3000. Can anyone convince me the BK is worth the additional cost? I will admit, the longer but times asserted by BK does have me second-guessing. Thoughts?
Totally worth it if you are heating 100% with wood. Supplementing my heatpump the tube stove is great. Heatpump works on the warmers days. Do you want to monitor a cat? I think objectively the BK is a better stove. 1000$ better probably but not double that. Spending 1000$ on insulation can get some meaning results winter and summer
 

Russn77

New Member
Jan 20, 2021
71
North Central Ohio
We are happy with our Kuma insert, which is 26% credit eligible. It's a catalyst stove though, but for us it hasn't been a problem. I don't see it as an issue really. As Begreen said, remember, its not a refund. Its a tax credit that lowers your tax liability. I just did my taxes and the credit didn't affect me.
 

Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
We are happy with our Kuma insert, which is 26% credit eligible. It's a catalyst stove though, but for us it hasn't been a problem. I don't see it as an issue really. As Begreen said, remember, its not a refund. Its a tax credit that lowers your tax liability. I just did my taxes and the credit didn't affect me.
Without getting too personal, you did not have enough taxes to offset the credit? I read it can be a "carry-forward" credit meaning if you can't use this tax season, you can use next year.
 

Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
Totally worth it if you are heating 100% with wood. Supplementing my heatpump the tube stove is great. Heatpump works on the warmers days. Do you want to monitor a cat? I think objectively the BK is a better stove. 1000$ better probably but not double that. Spending 1000$ on insulation can get some meaning results winter and summer
What kind of burn times do you get? From the time i leave for work until i get home, can run10-11 hours sometimes. I am drawn to BK's long run time. I currently have Drolet Heat Commander Furnace. It may be draft issues, but i am lucky to get 5-6 hours burn on that. If the tube stove's burn time would last while i am gone, I would definitely burn 100% wood.
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
3,548
SE North Carolina
What kind of burn times do you get? From the time i leave for work until i get home, can run10-11 hours sometimes. I am drawn to BK's long run time. I currently have Drolet Heat Commander Furnace. It may be draft issues, but i am lucky to get 5-6 hours burn on that. If the tube stove's burn time would last while i am gone, I would definitely burn 100% wood.
I bet I could do 8 an hour reload Schedule. As a second stove in the basement that we don’t spend a lot of time in I really haven’t run it 24 hours straight. Loaded it up good once and had coals 18 hours later. Burn time is subjective and real depends on the heat I need. my work schedule is super flexible. I scrounge all my wood. Nothing is uniform. I burn a lot of pine. Come this time of year I’m getting over the novelty of wood heat.
 
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RockyMtnGriz

Burning Hunk
Apr 19, 2019
187
SW Montana
What kind of burn times do you get? From the time i leave for work until i get home, can run10-11 hours sometimes. I am drawn to BK's long run time. I currently have Drolet Heat Commander Furnace. It may be draft issues, but i am lucky to get 5-6 hours burn on that. If the tube stove's burn time would last while i am gone, I would definitely burn 100% wood.
It probably doesn't fit into your plan, but the Kuuma furnace will do 12 hour loads easy on my crappy lodgepole pine. They're expensive, but no liner, probably no install (diy), and no wood chips and such in your living room. Get the credit and sell the Drolet. Just spitballin.
 
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Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
Totally worth it if you are heating 100% with wood. Supplementing my heatpump the tube stove is great. Heatpump works on the warmers days. Do you want to monitor a cat? I think objectively the BK is a better stove. 1000$ better probably but not double that. Spending 1000$ on insulation can get some meaning results winter and summer
I think i decided on the drolet. Trying to order, do i need the optional 1/2" insulation wrap for the 6" liner?
 

Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
Need Help Please... I decided to go with the DROLET 1800i insert. If i order the 35' trio pack that comes with the 6" 35' Vortex flexible stainless steel liner, do i need to also buy the 1/2" insulation wrap? Any other options needed?
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
3,548
SE North Carolina
I think i decided on the drolet. Trying to order, do i need the optional 1/2" insulation wrap for the 6" liner?
Unless you are sure chimney meets code you need insulation. Code says minimum 2” clearance from brick to any combustibles. Ie framing roof sheeting ect. (1” for exterior chimney). And I think code call for 1” insulation.

I got my insulation from Amazon. It was fulfilled by Rockford chimney.

Edit…
Other items. I have 24’ and I needed a damper. Blockoff plate. A pulling cone if your flue has significant bends or offsets.
 

Carl_Bunyon

New Member
Feb 8, 2021
23
Missouri
Unless you are sure chimney meets code you need insulation. Code says minimum 2” clearance from brick to any combustibles. Ie framing roof sheeting ect. (1” for exterior chimney). And I think code call for 1” insulation.

I got my insulation from Amazon. It was fulfilled by Rockford chimney.

Edit…
Other items. I have 24’ and I needed a damper. Blockoff plate. A pulling cone if your flue has significant bends or offsets.
I plan to buy 30 degree elbow and the liner connection device. My only offeset will be to get the liner thur the old fire damper door of fire box. My overall height is between 22-25'. How will i know if a damper is needed? How can you access damper control in flue pipe in an insert scenario?
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
3,548
SE North Carolina
I removed the entire metal damper frame and damper. I had lots of room to get it all out in one piece. It made hooking liner to insert very easy.

I decided that I didn’t want the surround on my insert so the damper in the appliance adapter is still accessible. Other posts document adding a longer rod to the damper and drilling a hole in the surround.

How to know if you need one. My stove top temps on a not full load were 750 degrees with air full closed. Way to much flame in the box with air shut off. I like to see most of the flame at the top (secondary combustion) with the air full closed. The actual answer is to measure draft while stove is burning on high. I can’t remember I’d draft measurement is listed in the manual or not.