Looks like the Oslo is getting a cat

KJamesJR

Feeling the Heat
Jan 8, 2018
353
New Hampshire
Took a trip to the Jøtul site to explore their solutions for the new 2020 EPA regulations. Looks like the Oslo is getting an upgrade in the form of a passive catalytic converter. Seems they’re still going the “user friendly” route by eliminating the bypass. I wonder how cold starts are going to treat that cat if you can’t bypass it until operation temp. They’re calling it “fusion technology”.

Overall seems the design, weight and assuming mass are nearly equal. Not sure how they’re able to justify the 2300sqft over the old 2000sqft and burn times up an additional hour, from 8 hours to 9 whilst having an equal BTU rating.

Future Oslo owners will either be convinced these are the best things since sliced bread, or wishing they’d bought the tube stove when they had the chance.

Thoughts?
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
16,835
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
Took a trip to the Jøtul site to explore their solutions for the new 2020 EPA regulations. Looks like the Oslo is getting an upgrade in the form of a passive catalytic converter. Seems they’re still going the “user friendly” route by eliminating the bypass. I wonder how cold starts are going to treat that cat if you can’t bypass it until operation temp. They’re calling it “fusion technology”.

Overall seems the design, weight and assuming mass are nearly equal. Not sure how they’re able to justify the 2300sqft over the old 2000sqft and burn times up an additional hour, from 8 hours to 9 whilst having an equal BTU rating.

Future Oslo owners will either be convinced these are the best things since sliced bread, or wishing they’d bought the tube stove when they had the chance.

Thoughts?
I believe that your last sentence is what we’re all thinking about all of these “new” stoves.
 

KJamesJR

Feeling the Heat
Jan 8, 2018
353
New Hampshire
You’ll have to forgive me. After doing a google search in hopes I’d find something pertaining to efficiency on the V3, because that figure is not yet listed in the technical documentation on the Jøtul website... I found this topic has already been discussed here in the forums.

Being as it’s already 2019 perhaps jotulguy can indulge us further.

Regardless, I’m still skeptical so let the discussion continue!
 

EatenByLimestone

Minister of Fire
Jul 12, 2006
7,263
Schenectady, NY
Hmmm, is this bar in Florida? And maybe a 6 month trip?

That's one way to deal with winter!
 
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SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
Increased burn times and output could be attributed to less heat going up the flue as basically nothing has any chance to escape between a traditional reburn and the cat.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
16,835
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
Increased burn times and output could be attributed to less heat going up the flue as basically nothing has any chance to escape between a traditional reburn and the cat.
Until that cat fails of course and the average operator doesn’t notice. Good hybrid designs, maybe this one too, do a pretty decent job. Band aid “add-a-cat” solutions might just last long enough to past the test.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
81,123
South Puget Sound, WA
Until that cat fails of course and the average operator doesn’t notice. Good hybrid designs, maybe this one too, do a pretty decent job. Band aid “add-a-cat” solutions might just last long enough to past the test.
True with any cat stove, old or new. Poor maintenance is a key issue. FWIW, it's very unlikely that one of the world's largest stove mfgs. would take a bandaid approach.
 
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Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
16,835
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
True with any cat stove, old or new. Poor maintenance is a key issue. FWIW, it's very unlikely that one of the world's largest stove mfgs. would take a bandaid approach.
Agree. However, I am not as impressed with brand names as many folks are. VC is a great example. I don’t want to own an Audi or bmw either. Some of the best stove designs hav come from small companies driven by a desire to design great stoves instead of an epa mandate.

What is great is that these manufacturers are trying some new and wild things that might just work. Hey, if I can just skip the whole bypass thing on my bk that would be great! I remember when I bought my first noncat without a bypass and thought it was crazy but it works fine and is simpler.
 

SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
I'm sure Jotul has spent a lot of time and money developing this stove, but time will tell if it's as good as they claim. I for one welcome our EPA overlords!
 

SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
Agree. However, I am not as impressed with brand names as many folks are. VC is a great example. I don’t want to own an Audi or bmw either. Some of the best stove designs hav come from small companies driven by a desire to design great stoves instead of an epa mandate.

What is great is that these manufacturers are trying some new and wild things that might just work. Hey, if I can just skip the whole bypass thing on my bk that would be great! I remember when I bought my first noncat without a bypass and thought it was crazy but it works fine and is simpler.
Listen, the EPA has pretty much forced every single innovation in energy use. Cars became insanely efficient, much more powerful, and better built now after EPA regulations. Certainly there are differences between manufacturers and such, just like wood stoves. Sure, there are shed companies like Ariel that build truly envelope pushing products, but they are not the industry at large. Things have only gotten better with the EPA forcing change.

I feel like this planet has been made filthy, but it's only gotten cleaner since the EPA came around. Currently it's been gutted and left for dead, but I'm sure some enterprising young politicians will reinvigorate it. I'm not old enough to know what it was like PRE-EPA, but it wasn't pleasant from what I've been told. You can hope some small companies push the larger ones around, but I'll live in reality where it takes a lot of power to make anything happen.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
16,835
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
What if, the folks buying this jotul don’t even want a cat stove? Aren’t interested in doing the work associated with a cat for the sake of slightly lower emissions or that extra hour of supposed burn time. Or, like so many operators, just want to put wood in and burn.

How many of these newly cat infused designs will run pretty dang good with a dead cat? If they do run well with a dead cat, I would expect the majority to be run that way for the majority of their lives.
 
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SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
What if, the folks buying this jotul don’t even want a cat stove? Aren’t interested in doing the work associated with a cat for the sake of slightly lower emissions or that extra hour of supposed burn time. Or, like so many operators, just want to put wood in and burn.

How many of these newly cat infused designs will run pretty dang good with a dead cat? If they do run well with a dead cat, I would expect the majority to be run that way for the majority of their lives.
Then it's the same thing in the end so it doesn't matter. It's an effort to improve things.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
81,123
South Puget Sound, WA
Ride a few miles in traffic behind a pre-EPA car or truck and you will be convinced the good ole days, weren't always so good.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
16,835
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
Listen, the EPA has pretty much forced every single innovation in energy use. Cars became insanely efficient, much more powerful, and better built now after EPA regulations. Certainly there are differences between manufacturers and such, just like wood stoves. Sure, there are shed companies like Ariel that build truly envelope pushing products, but they are not the industry at large. Things have only gotten better with the EPA forcing change.

I feel like this planet has been made filthy, but it's only gotten cleaner since the EPA came around. Currently it's been gutted and left for dead, but I'm sure some enterprising young politicians will reinvigorate it. I'm not old enough to know what it was like PRE-EPA, but it wasn't pleasant from what I've been told. You can hope some small companies push the larger ones around, but I'll live in reality where it takes a lot of power to make anything happen.
I have benefited a lot from the epa mandates too and have no problem with this new lower level of emissions. The problem I am watching for is how companies accomplish the required low rates.

I think you misunderstood my position about the epa and got all worked up! Starting out a post with “listen” is not necessary.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
16,835
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
Ride a few miles in traffic behind a pre-EPA car or truck and you will be convinced the good ole days, weren't always so good.
All I have to do is pass an old car in the oncoming lane and I can smell that pollution. Even old cars in excellent condition. It’s pretty amazing how much stealthier the new ones are. I’m not sure that what I’m smelling is necessary bad but it seems logical that no smell is better.
 
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begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
81,123
South Puget Sound, WA
All I have to do is pass an old car in the oncoming lane and I can smell that pollution. Even old cars in excellent condition. It’s pretty amazing how much stealthier the new ones are. I’m not sure that what I’m smelling is necessary bad but it seems logical that no smell is better.
Yeah, it gags me now. Funny to recall this was the norm in the 60s. I think you are smelling the volatiles in unburnt fuel. Here's a look at the country in the "good old days" prior to the EPA.
https://www.citylab.com/environment/2017/03/five-reasons-to-love-the-epa-before-it-disappears/518199/
 
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SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
I have benefited a lot from the epa mandates too and have no problem with this new lower level of emissions. The problem I am watching for is how companies accomplish the required low rates.

I think you misunderstood my position about the epa and got all worked up! Starting out a post with “listen” is not necessary.
You right. I just get frustrated sometimes by folks that think everything the EPA does is bad.
 
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bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
20,589
central pa
What if, the folks buying this jotul don’t even want a cat stove? Aren’t interested in doing the work associated with a cat for the sake of slightly lower emissions or that extra hour of supposed burn time. Or, like so many operators, just want to put wood in and burn.

How many of these newly cat infused designs will run pretty dang good with a dead cat? If they do run well with a dead cat, I would expect the majority to be run that way for the majority of their lives.
As are many current cat stoves. The last bk we worked on hasn't had a cat for the past decade. When I said something about it not being there he said yeah that fell apart years ago and I didn't see a reason to replace it.
 
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SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
As are many current cat stoves. The last bk we worked on hasn't had a cat for the past decade. When I said something about it not being there he said yeah that fell apart years ago and I didn't see a reason to replace it.
Wouldn't heating ability and burn times suffer immensely?
 
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bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
20,589
central pa
Wouldn't heating ability and burn times suffer immensely?
Yes absolutly. But those of us on this website are not typical of normal woodburners. To many people as long as the wood burns and the stove gets hot everything is working fantastic.
 
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SpaceBus

Minister of Fire
Nov 18, 2018
3,592
Downeast Maine
I believe more suffering on a fully cat stove like a bk than on a hybrid or whatever they’re going to call these noncat plus a cat stoves being introduced now.
I imagine the loss of a cat won't hamper the hybrid stoves much, unless it was a primarily cat stove before. The BK Bholler mentioned seems like it would only be able to operate about 50% capacity for heat and time.