Need to Get Longer Than 4hr Burn Times out of my Englander 30!!!

[BurnIt13]

Hello everyone! You've coached me through installing the Englander 30 in the spring, you've coached me through burning better fires in the fall.....now its time to get some better burn times!

Just so we're on the same page...
- Englander 30
- 6ft double wall stove pipe
- 16ft double wall chimney pipe

- My wood is red oak, white oak, and ash
- The wood is in the high teens to low 20's on the moisture meter when split down the middle.
- Some of the much larger pieces are around 25-26% in the middle.

Here goes my methodology for starting a fire from in a cold stove.
I put 3 splits N/S in the firebox. I then put a quarter of a super cedar between each split. I then put 3 splits E/W over the 3 N/S splits. I will then put some small kindling on top of that.

I light a couple of sheets of newspaper on top of the kindling to prime the chimney and then I light the super cedars. With the door cracked it takes about 5 minutes for the fire to get going. I then close the door and leave the air control open for another 10-15 minutes. Usually by this time the flue temps (Probe type) are 800ish and the stove is 400ish.

I'll gradually close it down to about 25-50% over the next minute or so depending on how lively the fire is. About ten minutes later I will adjust again....and then again as needed. The air control usually settles out between 5-15% depending on the draft. The stove will cruise around 550 and the flue will hang out around 600.

Okay.....with 6 average sized splits I'm only getting about 4-5 hours of burn time. After this time it takes significant effort to get another fire going (paper, kindling, etc). So I basically have a 4-5 hour window before my good coals are gone. I usually have an active fire for 2 hours, then a big pile of coals with lazy flames for another hour.

I keep seeing quotes on here like I put three splits on the coals before I went to bed at 10, and at 7am had plenty of coals left to throw some more wood on there! How can I get to that point? I realize that my wood is not ideal, but my technique has got to be off. Any suggestions? Not that I don't mind playing with fire but starting 2-3 fires from scratch everyday is getting tiring!

Thanks!

 

[Agent]

If you are going for longer burn times, you'll have to use larger splits - which is unfortunate for you, as those are your high moisture ones.
When I toss in 3-4 splits for overnight, they are usually 1/4 or 1/3 of a 16-18" log.
Also, I'm finding that coals is KEY. If I don't have 2-4" of live coals before, I might not have much left over when I wake up.
Other than that, your methods are pretty spot on with what I'd expect for some good burns.

 

[BurnIt13]

So you would need a deep layer of coals before you put the bigger splits on there? This makes sense because I've put some bigger splits on there before I went to bed and woke up to a smoldered carcass of a split. My guess is that the remaining coals burnt down and the bigger splits couldn't keep themselves going. Sound right?

Now if I could just find a way to get a better coal layer. Since I'm starting from scratch each time I'm not building up a good coal bed. Keep the suggestions coming!

 

[BrowningBAR]

I keep seeing quotes on here like I put three splits on the coals before I went to bed at 10, and at 7am had plenty of coals left to throw some more wood on there! How can I get to that point? I realize that my wood is not ideal, but my technique has got to be off. Any suggestions? Not that I don't mind playing with fire but starting 2-3 fires from scratch everyday is getting tiring!

Thanks!

1. I do not see any threads like this.

2. reload sooner after a cold start so you aren't cold starting again.

3. On reload add more than six splits. That firebox can hold a lot more than 6 medium size splits.

 

[oldspark]

I keep seeing quotes on here like I put three splits on the coals before I went to bed at 10, and at 7am had plenty of coals left to throw some more wood on there! How can I get to that point? I realize that my wood is not ideal, but my technique has got to be off. Any suggestions? Not that I don't mind playing with fire but starting 2-3 fires from scratch everyday is getting tiring!

Thanks!

1. I do not see any threads like this.

2. reload sooner after a cold start so you aren't cold starting again.

3. On reload add more than six splits. That firebox can hold a lot more than 6 medium size splits.

:lol: There was just a post that stated that, not sure if I can find it, stacking the splits like lincoln logs on start up aint helping matters any, too much air going through the wood.

 

[firefighterjake]

1) Load 'er up . . . from the pics of other Englander users they tend to pack things in . . . generally leaving an inch or two at the top of the firebox free.
2) Put a few smaller splits on the coals . . . and put one or two big boys in the back of the firebox -- a large round or split.
3) Use your good stuff . . . you never mention what you're burning, but for a long burn this is where you want the dense wood like black locust, osage, oak, sugar maple. etc.
4) Make sure you have an inch or so of ash in the firebox base . . . this will help preserve the coals you have

 

[BrowningBAR]

I keep seeing quotes on here like I put three splits on the coals before I went to bed at 10, and at 7am had plenty of coals left to throw some more wood on there! How can I get to that point? I realize that my wood is not ideal, but my technique has got to be off. Any suggestions? Not that I don't mind playing with fire but starting 2-3 fires from scratch everyday is getting tiring!

Thanks!

1. I do not see any threads like this.

2. reload sooner after a cold start so you aren't cold starting again.

3. On reload add more than six splits. That firebox can hold a lot more than 6 medium size splits.

:lol: There was just a post that stated that, not sure if I can find it, stacking the splits like lincoln logs on start up aint helping matters any, too much air going through the wood.

So, someone put three splits into a 30 and got a 9 hour burn out of it?

 

[BurnIt13]

I keep seeing quotes on here like I put three splits on the coals before I went to bed at 10, and at 7am had plenty of coals left to throw some more wood on there! How can I get to that point? I realize that my wood is not ideal, but my technique has got to be off. Any suggestions? Not that I don't mind playing with fire but starting 2-3 fires from scratch everyday is getting tiring!

Thanks!

1. I do not see any threads like this.

2. reload sooner after a cold start so you aren't cold starting again.

3. On reload add more than six splits. That firebox can hold a lot more than 6 medium size splits.

Well I was kind of exagerating a bit on my comment, but thats the general idea The toughest part is during the day. We get up early for work and don't come home for about 10 hours later so the stove is ice coal by the time I get home.

Here is a question....is it best to criss-cross the wood like I described above or to put all the splits N/S?? When I criss cross them it takes up more space but leaves more room for air to flow. Having all of the splits N/S might choke things down no? Thanks!

 

[BurnIt13]

Hello everyone!
- My wood is red oak, white oak, and ash
- The wood is in the high teens to low 20's on the moisture meter when split down the middle.
- Some of the much larger pieces are around 25-26% in the middle.

 

[BrowningBAR]

I keep seeing quotes on here like I put three splits on the coals before I went to bed at 10, and at 7am had plenty of coals left to throw some more wood on there! How can I get to that point? I realize that my wood is not ideal, but my technique has got to be off. Any suggestions? Not that I don't mind playing with fire but starting 2-3 fires from scratch everyday is getting tiring!

Thanks!

1. I do not see any threads like this.

2. reload sooner after a cold start so you aren't cold starting again.

3. On reload add more than six splits. That firebox can hold a lot more than 6 medium size splits.

Well I was kind of exagerating a bit on my comment, but thats the general idea The toughest part is during the day. We get up early for work and don't come home for about 10 hours later so the stove is ice coal by the time I get home.

Here is a question....is it best to criss-cross the wood like I described above or to put all the splits N/S?? When I criss cross them it takes up more space but leaves more room for air to flow. Having all of the splits N/S might choke things down no? Thanks!

You are not going to get a 9 hour burn on three splits from a 30.

Don't get cute with loading the stove. You aren't building a fort. You have 3.5 cu ft of firebox. Use it. Get your cold start going, once the fire is established and charred pack that firebox full. You should get a 10 hour burn with the 30 with plenty of coals for a restart.

 

[oldspark]

The three splits and coals in the morning statement might have been a cat stove but some where there is a post saying that.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Hello everyone!
- My wood is red oak, white oak, and ash
- The wood is in the high teens to low 20's on the moisture meter when split down the middle.
- Some of the much larger pieces are around 25-26% in the middle.

All of that is burnable. 25-26% will burn and is a lot closer to dry than it is wet.

 

[oldspark]

Criss crossing the wood is not a receipe for long burn times.

 

[BrowningBAR]

The three splits and coals in the morning statement might have been a cat stove but some where there is a post saying that.

Ah, a cat stove is a different monster. But, I will not get a 9 hour burn from my Cat Encore with three splits.

 

[BurnIt13]

Don't get cute with loading the stove. You aren't building a fort. You have 3.5 cu ft of firebox. Use it. Get your cold start going, once the fire is established and charred pack that firebox full. You should get a 10 hour burn with the 30 with plenty of coals for a restart.

Thank you. I'll try this tonight. When I get home I'll get a fire going and pack it full around 9pm. I usually get the next fire going around 5:30-6am, we'll see what I'm left with.

The only thing that might put a damper on this is my not-so-ideal wood. It isn't as dry as it should be but it is what it is....

 

[oldspark]

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/85495/
He had a large bed of coals.

 

[BrowningBAR]

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/85495/

I'll be damned if he can get that to happen consistently. Unless these were three monster splits.

I had the occasional 8 hour burn from the Intrepid, which probably holds the the equivalent of three splits on a full size stove like that Jotul. Doesn't mean I could ever count on it doing that.

 

[Hogwildz]

Use larger splits, and pack that biach full!
Can only go so far on 1/2 a tank.

 

[pen]

You are not going to get a 9 hour burn on three splits from a 30.

9 hour burn, no. But I had coals left in the stove from the overnight burn this morning. Put 2 med-large with one med on top of that at 5:30 this morning. When I left the house at 6:30 stove top had been settled in at about 525 for 1/2 hour or so. When I get home at 5 tonight, I'll still have coals to light back off of.

pen

 

[BrowningBAR]

You are not going to get a 9 hour burn on three splits from a 30.

9 hour burn, no. But I had coals left in the stove from the overnight burn this morning. Put 2 med-large with one med on top of that at 5:30 this morning. When I left the house at 6:30 stove top had been settled in at about 525 for 1/2 hour or so. When I get home at 5 tonight, I'll still have coals to light back off of.

pen

You can not count on getting enough coals to relight 12 hours latter on three medium split. It confuses new posters when they see this.

 

[pen]

You are not going to get a 9 hour burn on three splits from a 30.

9 hour burn, no. But I had coals left in the stove from the overnight burn this morning. Put 2 med-large with one med on top of that at 5:30 this morning. When I left the house at 6:30 stove top had been settled in at about 525 for 1/2 hour or so. When I get home at 5 tonight, I'll still have coals to light back off of.

pen

You can not count on getting enough coals to relight 12 hours latter on three medium split. It confuses new posters when they see this.

Sorry for sharing my experiences in actually running a 30 Bar. I'll defer to your expertise from here on out regarding the unit.

If the guy want's explanation on what I do or have seen happen, then I'd be happy to give it.

If you question what I have happen with my stove or the conditions it took place in then just ask me, don't pollute this guys thread by using it to call my accounts into question without even asking me about it.


pen

 

[pen]

Don't get cute with loading the stove. You aren't building a fort. You have 3.5 cu ft of firebox. Use it. Get your cold start going, once the fire is established and charred pack that firebox full. You should get a 10 hour burn with the 30 with plenty of coals for a restart.

Thank you. I'll try this tonight. When I get home I'll get a fire going and pack it full around 9pm. I usually get the next fire going around 5:30-6am, we'll see what I'm left with.

The only thing that might put a damper on this is my not-so-ideal wood. It isn't as dry as it should be but it is what it is....

How far down are you closing the air control once the fire is "cruising?"

Are you leaving much ash in the bottom of the stove or are you cleaning it right out?

Are you looking to get good heat from the stove for 9 hours or just looking for coals to reload on?

pen

 

[SlyFerret]

It doesn't take many coals to relight without a match or firestarter, so keep that in mind.

I last loaded my 30 about 12 hours ago with 4 splits. I have enough coals to relight, but I'm not getting any usable heat from my stove right now. My house is coasting, coming back down to ~70 before I reload.

The weather here is too mild to keep this beast of a stove going all the time.

If you want usable heat for that long, you are going to have to pack your stove full, and carefully adjust the air so that you burn as slow as you can while still maintaining stable secondaries.

-SF

 

[Todd]

Maybe try loading those first splits on the bottom E/W then lay the rest on top N/S. This may keep that dog house air from blowing though to the back of the fire box igniting everything at once and give you a more controlled front to back burn?

 

[BrotherBart]

99% of my night burns in the 30 are three split burns. Sometimes four. I split my wood specifically for that purpose. Slabs. Each standing on edge is about as high as the brick retainers. I load it with three or four, however many allow me to leave an inch of air space between'em, char'em for a while with the air open and then start moving the air down as the stove top comes up. Around 550 I have the spring tip even with the ash lip and get up to a 250 to 300 degree stove with plenty of coals to restart. Nine to ten hours later. If I let the coals go I am getting mellow heat for another couple of hours or so.

For daytime fires when I am here it is the same drill, just smaller splits but three of them in the same arrangement. Do it again at four pm and coals are there at nine for starting all over again with the night load.

Kinda boring actually.