replacing old factory insert Q's

[Norton in the North]

We have an older factory insert that we would like to replace and are exploring our options.

It is a central fireplace with access from both sides, living room/dining room. It is about 25-30 years old and is NOT efficient at all. It is a fireplace that can be accessed from either side, although we have one side covered with the factory provided metal facing rather than having it open as that side would normally just be covered with the metal curtains.

Having the fire open to the room draws air in from the seams between the logs of our home, especially in the corners. We plan on having our log home chinked but as it is quite pricey, we were hoping to replace the fireplace and do the chinking next year or the year after.

I have a couple of questions. Keep in mind we will have a professional installer, I am just looking for more information before we turn to the professionals.

Can you put a wood insert inside the old factory insert? The insert passed a WETT inspection two years ago and has room to fit a smaller woodstove insert.

Can you remove the factory insert as well as the bricks in front of the legs on the front and back of the insert and put in a proper woodstove using the same flue? I am assuming that the insert does not hold any of the chimney stack load.

Can you remove even more of the fireplace surround to increase the area around the woodstove? (if that's the option that we go with) It is rather large, the base is 4 by 7 and the stack to the chimney is skewed to the right.

Anyone know of any links that might show me images or videos of a similar project? (the last option)

 

[Norton in the North]

I forgot to mention that the stack skews to the right because we are in a log home so it has to skew from the central fireplace location to the right of the highest log beam. Also, the insert part of the fireplace sits more towards the left of the structure, about 1.5 feet to the left of the insert and 2.5 of masonry to the right.

 

[Grisu]

Here is your old thread with the pictures of your fireplace: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/resurfacing-fireplace.126705/

Since it looks like there are no combustible materials in the structure, I don't see a reason why you could not put an insert in there. Not sure if I get your second question; what kind of "legs" are you talking about? For the other questions you need a certified mason to asses the structure and see what is load-bearing and what is not. I's possible he/she may need to remove at least some of the stucco to see how it has been built.

 

[Norton in the North]

it's an insert but from the images that I saw from the old owner of his installation and it shows that the insert stood on attached legs that raised it up. The bottom blocks were placed, the insert placed within the blocks, then the bricks fitted around the unit.

I have a few images of the build as well to provide to the mason, but of course I can't remember where I put them to scan and show on here right now. You can also see in through the venting on the upper part of the structure to see how the bricks are laid right up against the insert. The front and back, we would need to remove the stucco but that's the plan anyway as the stucco in that section is all loose.

 

[begreen]

Yes, you can put an insert in. You could put an expanded metal grille on the backside to allow some heat to escape on that side too or you could brick it up. Since the last post there is a new, efficient double-sided zc fireplace (Supreme Duet) on the market that is made in Canada. You might want to check it out for fit.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/supreme-vision-2-sided-contemporary-stove.129094/

 

[Grisu]

it's an insert but from the images that I saw from the old owner of his installation and it shows that the insert stood on attached legs that raised it up. The bottom blocks were placed, the insert placed within the blocks, then the bricks fitted around the unit.

I have a few images of the build as well to provide to the mason, but of course I can't remember where I put them to scan and show on here right now. You can also see in through the venting on the upper part of the structure to see how the bricks are laid right up against the insert. The front and back, we would need to remove the stucco but that's the plan anyway as the stucco in that section is all loose.

Those pictures will certainly help the mason in assessing what's possible. How much do you actually like this whole setup? Since you are thinking of having some masonry work done, plus putting an insert in and refinishing the whole structure I am wondering whether tearing it down and replacing it with a free standing stove will not be much more practical but also pretty close in cost. It may be worthwhile getting quotes for both options.

 

[Norton in the North]

I do plan on having quotes done for installing a new insert as is, woodstove within the stack and removal of the chimney and putting in a standalone woodstove. The last is the option that I would like to go with but until my hubby sees numbers, he has his mind set on the insert over anything.

We do vent our furnace through the same stack, and adding on to our current older model furnace so we can vent it out of the side of the house is not an option that we are wanting to explore right now.

The grille on the backside of the insert is a great idea and definitely an option that we will look in to. I didn't want to lose the heat on that side of the fireplace, that's why I was looking at the full woodstove option. I also like the idea of having the top accessible for cooking and having water on to keep the air hydrated. I really like how our current fireplace is set up because the furnace takes advantage of the heat coming off the insert in to the bricks, and the vents run through the bricks on the right and left of the insert and pick up heat from the fireplace as well as the gas furnace. That is actually why we have such a huge central fireplace.

if anyone were to hazard a guess, how much do you think it would cost, or time do you think it would take (so I can get quotes via email or phone), to remove the fireplace and have a much smaller stack put in for venting the furnace and woodstove?

It really would open up a lot more area for kitchen cupboards or an island too

 

[begreen]

Is it legal for a furnace to share the stack in BC? It is not in most US jurisdictions.

Strike that, I went to the old one and see that the gas furnace flue has a separate chimney pipe from the fireplace. It's confusing having two threads on the same topic.