Steel Vs Ceramic Cat.

[Dmitry]

Is it worth upgrading to steel cat? it's $300 vs $380 difference in price.
Large FPX Hybrid-Fire insert.

 

[begreen]

Not necessarily. Word is that the steel cats fire off quicker but some complain they clog with ash easier. Lifespan seems to be a bit better with the ceramic too. Highbeam has tried both and by last report is back with ceramic.

 

[ohlongarm]

Is it worth upgrading to steel cat? it's $300 vs $380 difference in price.
Large FPX Hybrid-Fire insert.

Don't do it I fell into that a few years back, worked great at first but repeatedly clogged and after one season was useless. The ceramic I replaced it with still works perfectly.

 

[Highbeam]

Yep, zero real world benefit to steel and plenty of real world drawbacks. Even if price was the same I would go ceramic.

 

[Rob_Red]

My hearthstone came with a steel and I’m thinking of installing a ceramic unit mostly because I have a theory it will clog with fly ash less easily.

Would love to hear from someone in the industry if this would be a problem

 

[Highbeam]

Note that not all catalysts are available in both ceramic and steel. You might be stuck with steel. More likely to plug up, bigger draft restriction.

I think a lot of the real reason for the popularity of steel among new manufacturers is that the steel cats are very difficult to physically damage and they look like new for a longer time giving the customer less reason to complain or call in warranty for their “broken” catalyst.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

I purchased a steel cat last year. I got it thinking that it would be more durable than the ceramic one. I used it for a week and took it out. I felt like the steel cat lit off well be it seemed to stall easier then the ceramic version. I like to error on the side of the clean chimney so I pulled it as I am in cat mode alot.. I kept it.. as a back up.. I got the ceramitec one.. think is called steel cat..

 

[Highbeam]

Good companies full of smart employees are using steel cats for new stoves so I think they are functional and better for their business. As an end user, our priorities are different and this ceramic vs. steel decision is made with different priorities.

 

[jetsam]

I like steel better. Lower light off temp, immune to the kind of thermal shock problems that wood stoves run into, will withstand being pulled and cleaned any number of times.

On the negative side, smaller cells plug more easily, and may require more frequent cleaning.

If you pay someone else to maintain your stove, ceramic is going to be much cheaper even if you have to replace it more often, because paying someone $50 or $100 to run a shop vac for 2 minutes adds up fast.

Having used both, I would say that while I have a preference for steel, the real world difference between them is pretty small.

 

[Rob_Red]

Love hearing real world perspectives, my hearthstone is the first Cat stove I have operated so it’s hard to have any reference as to what’s “normal”

 

[Dmitry]

The problem with my ceramic cat is that it gets crumbled after 2-3 years in the middle, where fire almost hits it at the beginning of the cycle due to the FPX hybrid design. This is a common problem for this stove. Never had a problem with clogging up, though. I was hoping steel cat might withstand more against direct flame.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

The problem with my ceramic cat is that it gets crumbled after 2-3 years in the middle, where fire almost hits it at the beginning of the cycle due to the FPX hybrid design. This is a common problem for this stove. Never had a problem with clogging up, though. I was hoping steel cat might withstand more against direct flame.

Try the steel cat.. You may like it. Its not like its a ton of cash. I replace my cat like every other year.. My cat also starts to crumble. I save alot of money heating with wood, and even if I didnt save a dime Id still try the steel cat and putter with my stove and equipment because... the heat is that good.. yo... Never been this this warm and comfortable. All those people in the world heating with electric, gas and oil furnace can keep contributing to big oils profits... those jokers have no idea what there missing..

 

[begreen]

Try the steel cat.. You may like it. Its not like its a ton of cash. I replace my cat like every other year.. My cat also starts to crumble. I save alot of money heating with wood, and even if I didnt save a dime Id still try the steel cat and putter with my stove and equipment because... the heat is that good.. yo... Never been this this warm and comfortable. All those people in the world heating with electric, gas and oil furnace can keep contributing to big oils profits... those jokers have no idea what there missing..

Over 12 yrs that we've had our stove, a $200 cat every other year would really add up. That would be 3/4s of what we paid for the stove. So far all it's needed has been less than $50 worth of gaskets.

 

[stoveliker]

It is a lot of money, every other year. But most folks don't burn 15 cords or so in 2 years - which is I think the lifetime of an average cat. So either the user burns much much more than average, or the cat is being abused if it needs replacement so soon, or it's being replaced before it's needed.

 

[Dmitry]

So, now the question is when is the time to put new one in. . I all post it in a separate thread

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Over 12 yrs that we've had our stove, a $200 cat every other year would really add up. That would be 3/4s of what we paid for the stove. So far all it's needed has been less than $50 worth of gaskets.

at this point the stove has paid for itself, Im waaayyyy ahead in the game and my house is warmer then its ever been... Im not sweating the cost of the cat every other year.. in the grand scheme of things the cost is insignificant. all of my wood is free. All the machines I own as well as the dump trucks and trailers.. Im saving thousands per year .. Ill trade 2500 to 3K in oil a year for a hundred dollar cat any day of the week.. People look at things differently.. you add up the cost of parts vs the cost of the stove and that works for you.. I look at what my stove saves me vs what i put into it.. I know what I got when I purchased this stove.. a great looking stove that will need some maintenance. and Im ok with that, the cost of maintenance is nothing compared to the savings.. Over 10 years the stove would have saved me roughly 25k on the low end.. and lets just say I put 3k in to the stove over that time period on the high end.. worst case.. im still 22k ahead in 10 years.. Im happy with those numbers..

 

[begreen]

It is a lot of money, every other year. But most folks don't burn 15 cords or so in 2 years - which is I think the lifetime of an average cat.

It's not the number of cords of wood, but the hours on the cat. A decent one is good for 10-12,000 hrs, so someone heating 24/7 for 6-7 months of the year is going to go through cats quicker than someone burning 4 months of the year.

 

[bholler]

at this point the stove has paid for itself, Im waaayyyy ahead in the game and my house is warmer then its ever been... Im not sweating the cost of the cat every other year.. in the grand scheme of things the cost is insignificant. all of my wood is free. All the machines I own as well as the dump trucks and trailers.. Im saving thousands per year .. Ill trade 2500 to 3K in oil a year for a hundred dollar cat any day of the week.. People look at things differently.. you add up the cost of parts vs the cost of the stove and that works for you.. I look at what my stove saves me vs what i put into it.. I know what I got when I purchased this stove.. a great looking stove that will need some maintenance. and Im ok with that, the cost of maintenance is nothing compared to the savings.. Over 10 years the stove would have saved me roughly 25k on the low end.. and lets just say I put 3k in to the stove over that time period on the high end.. worst case.. im still 22k ahead in 10 years.. Im happy with those numbers..

But you could have also saved the $1000 you have spent on cats ontop of your savings in oil.

I agree for many of us the cost of cats is not a big deal. But I have customers to whom it absolutely is. They aren't burning wood to save some money they are burning wood because they can't afford to heat any other way.

 

[Dmitry]

at this point the stove has paid for itself, Im waaayyyy ahead in the game and my house is warmer then its ever been... Im not sweating the cost of the cat every other year.. in the grand scheme of things the cost is insignificant. all of my wood is free. All the machines I own as well as the dump trucks and trailers.. Im saving thousands per year .. Ill trade 2500 to 3K in oil a year for a hundred dollar cat any day of the week.. People look at things differently.. you add up the cost of parts vs the cost of the stove and that works for you.. I look at what my stove saves me vs what i put into it.. I know what I got when I purchased this stove.. a great looking stove that will need some maintenance. and Im ok with that, the cost of maintenance is nothing compared to the savings.. Over 10 years the stove would have saved me roughly 25k on the low end.. and lets just say I put 3k in to the stove over that time period on the high end.. worst case.. im still 22k ahead in 10 years.. Im happy with those numbers..

$ 380 is a lot for the cat. But I just paid $800 for my 3 cars insurance for 6 months. When you compare to this, the cat price is justified. At least you see some real outcome. Oh yeah, freaking taxes is even better example. I pay $ 600 a month for the roads that not cleaned and schools that none of my grown children ever went to.

 

[stoveliker]

It's not the number of cords of wood, but the hours on the cat. A decent one is good for 10-12,000 hrs, so someone heating 24/7 for 6-7 months of the year is going to go through cats quicker than someone burning 4 months of the year.

Of course. The point is that he either burns way more than average (and more cords equates to more hours because the burn speed cannot be dialed up indefinitely), or he is wasting money. Regardless of whether he still comes out ahead, waste is waste.

 

[Highbeam]

It is a lot of money, every other year. But most folks don't burn 15 cords or so in 2 years - which is I think the lifetime of an average cat. So either the user burns much much more than average, or the cat is being abused if it needs replacement so soon, or it's being replaced before it's needed.

Not true. The only rating system is hours of cat active time, not years, not cords. I also change the cats every two years. Would be happy with more years but it’s obvious when they die. They just wear out when you have a long burn season and use your stove full time.

 

[Highbeam]

Over 12 yrs that we've had our stove, a $200 cat every other year would really add up. That would be 3/4s of what we paid for the stove. So far all it's needed has been less than $50 worth of gaskets.

The flip side of that is the value of wood saved. I conservatively save one full cord per year compared to my previous noncat in the same house. The value of that cord far exceeds the cost of cats, more than double!

You have the rare user that doesn’t save any wood with the switch to cat stove but you also have the rare user that gets 10 years from his catalyst.

Even in your PE, how much have you paid for wood over those 12 years of part time burning?

 

[bholler]

The flip side of that is the value of wood saved. I conservatively save one full cord per year compared to my previous noncat in the same house. The value of that cord far exceeds the cost of cats, more than double!

You have the rare user that doesn’t save any wood with the switch to cat stove but you also have the rare user that gets 10 years from his catalyst.

Even in your PE, how much have you paid for wood over those 12 years of part time burning?

I really don't think it is rare that a person going from a good noncat to a good cat uses about the same wood.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Of course. The point is that he either burns way more than average (and more cords equates to more hours because the burn speed cannot be dialed up indefinitely), or he is wasting money. Regardless of whether he still comes out ahead, waste is waste.

There is no waste. Im not throwing out perfectly good cats. As stated above after a couple years the cat starts to crumble. cells break out performance isn't good. Im burning 24/7 and heat from mid october through March with occasional fires into April and May. If the cats broken and deteriorated and is struggling to operate and needing to be replaced, how is that waste..

After the performance of the cat gets very low its time for it to be replaced. It gets replaced for a number of reasons. The first being that Im not going to chance having creosote build up inside my stove pipe. The other is the actual stove performance itself. Having the stove run the way it should and give off the heat it should, especially at night when the air is turned down. The stove doesn't operate as it should when the cat stalls. The cat helps heat the stove pipe keeping draft up.
Its ok... some people get 5 years out of there cat, thats great for them I couldn't be happier for those people. I dont and really couldn't care less. Im fine with every other year..

 

[Woodsplitter67]

But you could have also saved the $1000 you have spent on cats ontop of your savings in oil.

I agree for many of us the cost of cats is not a big deal. But I have customers to whom it absolutely is. They aren't burning wood to save some money they are burning wood because they can't afford to heat any other way.

It is sad that here in America some people struggle to make ends meet. I hear what your saying. on that.