Stove pipe clearance question

[michaelthomas]

I hava had 2 certified sweeps come out and give me quotes and ideas about installing a class A chimney through the roof. Conflicting information between the 2 of them and now I am confused. I have the englander 30 that I will be installing and we looked at the book and plotted out where the chimney, stove pipe, and stove would realistically be able to be placed. The first guy read the manual and measured from the clearences recommended in there. The second guy said that the manual doesn't matter because "the state of Maine requires that the stove pipe be no closer than 18" from a combustible surface". I asked about using double wall and he said that Maine doesn't care whether or not it is single or double wall, it can't be any closer than 18". I don't have the state and local regs, but could this be possible? Any other areas have any odd clearance issues associated with installs? If this is correct, why would anyone in Maine ever purchase a rear heat shield? Everyone would need to have room for a 54" hearth to clear the 18" from pipe and 18" from front? Both guys were experienced and seemed competent, however I liked the first guys answers better

 

[Hanko]

go with what the manual states, and check with your insurance co. At least you got somebody to come look at yours.

 

[stoveguy13]

i cant tell you 100% but the second guy sounds like a real mess and i would never let him in my house again the likely hood that doublewall pipe does not allow you to reduces clearence is not very likely and the state of maine would not follow the manufactures guidelines is not very likely either.

 

[Dave_1]

Hi Michael,

See tables #1 & #2 at

(broken link removed to http://www.gorham-me.org/Public_Documents/GorhamME_Fire/S006D1D1B.6/woodstoves.pdf)

& note the info is from the "Fire Marshall" in Augusta, Me. (page #1)

Since the clearance of a double wall pipe is NOT spelled out therein it would behove you to contact your local "Fire Marshall" & ask him about double wall before discounting sweep #2's remarks.

Good luck with it.

 

[webbie]

I would install as per manual and listing on the double wall pipe. I agree that the guy who said this cannot be done may be full of it.

Last time I heard, a state cannot make up their own mechanical code (in general). They accept the authorities (like UL).

This will all be confirmed if you get a building permit, as they will review your docs and approve the install as specified.

That particular doc contains generic guidelines copied from NFPA, and addresses "stove pipe". Double wall interior is "listed chimney connector", and not stove pipe...they are talking about single wall pipe.

 

[jdurando]

I am a contractor and in my experience the code books usually consider the local municipality to be the “authority having jurisdiction” and both the code book and your municipality will usually refer to the manufactures instillation instructions, when it comes to issues of clearance. However they do have the authority to overrule just about anything. Of course that doesn’t matter much if you are not getting permits.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

as john d states ,local codes can supercede manual in some cases. howeevr nfpa211 is recognized in all 50 states for the most part only local codes in municipalities tend to supercede. note in the chart #1 provided in the link form the augusta maine fire marshal states clearances for UNLISTED units , then states to use clearances provided for listed, flue pipe clearanvces are also addressed in nfpa 211. as for the 30 nc our poster is installing , best thing i can tell you to do is call me at my office and i'll pull out the code book and give you chapter and verse as to why you can install as described in the manual , you can then present this to your code official, heck have him call me , i'll quote to him as well.number is 800-245-6489 ask for me by name please i handle this situation when it arises personally

 

[Dave_1]

Hi there stoveguy,

Thanks for looking into this. I’m sure all of us would appreciate your posting what you learn, because as you can see by the following link the code book is not cheap even when it is out of date:

(broken link removed to http://www.nfpa.org/catalog/category.asp?category_name=Codes+and+Standards&Page=1&src=catalog)

(For some unknown reason, clicking on the above link results in a failure link. So after the word catgory insert %5 over the above link & insert it into your browser & it will take you the code book which is on sale, $1,144.80.)

Thus the problem with most not complying to code, unless forced to. If the book was public then the homeowner would be more inclined to correctly install, even if there was no controlling authority to make him in the county/city where he lived.

Thanks much,

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Hi there stoveguy,

Thanks for looking into this. I’m sure all of us would appreciate your posting what you learn, because as you can see by the following link the code book is not cheap even when it is out of date:

(broken link removed to http://www.nfpa.org/catalog/category.asp?category_name=Codes+and+Standards&Page=1&src=catalog)

(For some unknown reason, clicking on the above link results in a failure link. So cut & paste the above link & insert it into your browser & it will take you the code book which is on sale, $1,144.80.)

Thus the problem with most not complying to code, unless forced to. If the book was public then the homeowner would be more inclined to correctly install, even if there was no controlling authority to make him in the county/city where he lived.

Thanks much,

try this link instead, you may read the code book , but you cannot copy it , you can order a copy of it for about 40 bucks, this is the same book i referrence at work. you need to agree to terms (which tells you not to copy it) and then at the bottom click on "Open NFPA 211: Standard for Chimneys, Fireplaces, Vents, and Solid Fuel-Burning Appliances, 2006 Edition .


"you can then look it up chapter and verse, let me know if you want me to give you the listings by paragraph so you will have the proper parts to quote.

(broken link removed to http://www.nfpa.org/freecodes/free_access_agreement.asp?id=21106)

 

[Dave_1]

Mike,

Thanks much!

 

[michaelthomas]

I called the Scarborough Code Officer and he requires a $20 permit, and inspection of the structure, plan, and all manufacturers technical specs. The City code reads that the installation shall follow the manufacturers recommendations. So if double wall pipe says it can be 8" from an unprotected surface and I have the product and it's documentation here the code guy will pass it. That makes a-lot more sense to me than a blanket code that negates the manufacturers recommendations. Thank You for your guidance and thank you Mike for the invitation to call you.