Upgrading (Homemade?) System

[SayWhen]

...been lurking for a while. Finally took the plunge and joined. Glad to share in the wealth of knowledge here.

This post brings two main questions:
1. What is this?
2. How can I upgrade?

A little background here. We live back in the mountains on the state line of Tennessee and North Carolina at an elevation of around 2,300 ft. It is not out of the ordinary to see temps dip below 0 for 5-10 nights out of the year here oddly enough. Our house is a 1,300 sq ft rancher built in 1971, insulated fairly well with new windows going in this fall. Eventually would like to rely solely on wood for heat as we have been blessed with a plentiful wood supply.

Now, the current setup. 33"w x 24"h x 24"d fireplace with 1/4" steel plates welded in to make a box, and ~8" clay lined exterior chimney (about 15-20 ft). The fireplace has 2 240v heat pump style blowers with two separate intakes on the hearth. Two outlet vents above the fireplace allows the air to be blown into the living room. Here is where things get a little different. The vents above the fireplace can be closed, causing the air to be forced through the duct work in the basement. Each room in the house has 1 vent in the floor connected to the fireplace. Also in the basement is a giant ash dump directly under the fireplace.

My chief complaint from this set up is the same as most...too much heat up the chimney and too much wood being burned. It's borderline amazing how fast you can blow through wood.

The obvious answer is to throw in an insert and stainless liner and call it a day. However, given the setup, is there any way to capitalize on the HVAC style system hooked up to it, or will an insert alone be enough to cover 1,300 sq ft.? Also, do you bother with cutting out the old steel plates (not knowing what is behind it) for extra space or leave it be?

...got a few ideas, but I'd like to see what the general consensus is before I start hitting on specific models.

Thanks in advance for the help...and for the knowledge already gained from this site.

Here are a few pics for reference. The wife covered the intake vents with decorations after we quit burning this spring.

 

[quotejso]

does that grate suck air form in front of the firepalce?

 

[bholler]

Put a ninsert in there and forget about all that other crap. And no don't cut out anything unless absolutely necessary to fit the insert

 

[Grisu]

or will an insert alone be enough to cover 1,300 sq ft.?

Heat-wise: Yes. A larger medium insert (~2.5 cu ft) installed with a block-off plate and fed dry wood should easily heat 1300 sqft in your climate. The question is: Can you move the heat around your home? Can you post a rough sketch of your floorplan?

And I would think about closing off those ducts maybe by stuffing some Roxul insulation in them.

 

[SayWhen]

does that grate suck air form in front of the firepalce?

I think it is supposed to, but I have never had any luck with it. It must be stopped up somewhere, but I'm not sure where the other end of it is.

The question is: Can you move the heat around your home? Can you post a rough sketch of your floorplan?

And I would think about closing off those ducts maybe by stuffing some Roxul insulation in them.

I don't think moving the heat around will be too big of a problem. If I can get this set up hot enough, it seems to spread decently. I'll have to sketch out a floor plan when I make it to a computer. Every fan but one has a ceiling fan and all the ceilings are 8 ft.

Would I be able to use the existing duct work with an insert to move heat around? Or should I just scratch that thought?

 

[SayWhen]

Below is a rough sketch of the floor plan. Every room has ceiling fans except the bedroom with the bath attached...we usually shut the door to that bedroom anyway as its a guest room.

Moving the heat hasn't been too big of an issue in the past..just not enough heat in the first place.

Leaning towards a Jotul 550...but the BK Princess insert is starting to look attractive. School me.

 

[begreen]

The Jotul is nice looking but there are more powerful inserts out there. If the BK will fit it could be a good choice. In non-cat take a look at the Enviro Venice or Boston 1700 for comparison. The Hampton HI300 is also popular along with the Hearthstone Clydesdale.

 

[jatoxico]

I have the 550 and its a well built unit but... You can get 5-6 hr burns out of it but not much more. The firebox is an odd shape which makes it tough to pack full and is essentially an E/W loader only. If you can live with something that extends onto the hearth I would go for that. Better heating and will still heat at least some w/o a fan. Will also give more options for loading firebox. For your climate something that can go "low and slow" would be an advantage.

The Jotul 550 heats my heat fairly large house nicely when running, but if you are really after overnight burns you should look elsewhere.

 

[SayWhen]

The Jotul is nice looking but there are more powerful inserts out there. If the BK will fit it could be a good choice. In non-cat take a look at the Enviro Venice or Boston 1700 for comparison. The Hampton HI300 is also popular along with the Hearthstone Clydesdale.

From what I have read the 550 seems like it would be adequate for heat output in my situation, but I'd rather have more wiggle room and not need it as to need more heat and not have it. I'll have to look at those models. Seems like the Princess will fit, but I'll have to double check.

I have the 550 and its a well built unit but... You can get 5-6 hr burns out of it but not much more. The firebox is an odd shape which makes it tough to pack full and is essentially an E/W loader only. If you can live with something that extends onto the hearth I would go for that. Better heating and will still heat at least some w/o a fan. Will also give more options for loading firebox. For your climate something that can go "low and slow" would be an advantage.

The Jotul 550 heats my heat fairly large house nicely when running, but if you are really after overnight burns you should look elsewhere.

5-6 hours only? I would have figured it would have been a little better. Every stove is a hotrod on paper though. I work 12 hr shifts so I'd love to have something that would at least have a few coals left once I got home...enough not to have to do a cold start.

Any other good options in the cat department to compete with BK?

 

[begreen]

Buck makes cat inserts too.

 

[SayWhen]

Already had been in touch with a dealer about the 550...he quoted me $3175 tax and all out the door. That's with the blower and surround.

Fair deal, or a little high?

What's a ballpark price on the BK Princess?

 

[Grisu]

Before jumping on the 550 I would do a thorough forum search. I remember quite a few people here that were underwhelmed with its performance. You don't even need to go the cat route. The Enviro 1700 will be a solid choice or an Osburn 2000 or Regency i2400 to name just a few larger medium inserts. Those will even bit a bit cheaper than the Jotul.

 

[SayWhen]

Before jumping on the 550 I would do a thorough forum search. I remember quite a few people here that were underwhelmed with its performance. You don't even need to go the cat route. The Enviro 1700 will be a solid choice or an Osburn 2000 or Regency i2400 to name just a few larger medium inserts. Those will even bit a bit cheaper than the Jotul.

I'll have to do some more digging then looks like. I would rather stay away from a cat setup if possible just for simplicity sake.

If I were to find a model that had an 8" outlet, would it be acceptable to do a direct connect to the existing clay liner? It is in good shape and is 8". Obviously you'd have more heat soak than a stainless liner, but not sure how much.

 

[Grisu]

The only insert that I know of that uses an 8" flue and would not be oversized for your home is the Buck 80 ZC. According to code you should be ok with a direct connect but clarify with your local building inspector. However, your draft will probably suffer and the chimney will likely accumulate more creosote especially as it is an exterior chimney. And at your elevation and only 15 to 20 ft of chimney you are already close to the minimum specs anyway. I am pretty sure you will get much better performance with an insulated 6" liner.