Vermont Castings Defiant Encore 2190 Flue Collar question

[Justin325]

I have a Vermont Castings Encore 2190 that seems to be hard to control when fully loaded.
It can get very hot and uses up a full load in about 5-6 hours

Burning well seasoned oak that is stored in a covered wood shed.

My questions is: Should the Flue Collar to vertical flue pipe be sealed? As seen in the pics I can see flames through the crack and I hear whistling when the stove is not in Catalytic mode. I did an incense smoke test and I did notice that this area does suck in smoke when the fire is going.

I replaced the catalyst last year and this helped, but I feel like I should be getting longer burns that can be controled to be less hot.
I don't notice any smoke leaks (getting sucked in) around the door seal or the top load seal.

Any other place I should look?

Thanks!
Justin

 

[begreen]

That gap can be sealed with some flat stove gasket, but it may not change the short burn time. How tall is the flue system on this stove?

 

[gthomas785]

Also check the window gaskets as well as the ash pan. They can loosen over time and be a culprit for letting in excess air.
A leak in the flue system won't cause the issue you described, if anything it would decrease the draft and slow down the fire. But I don't think a gap that size would be anything to worry about.

 

[Justin325]

How tall is the flue system on this stove?

There is one more story above this room and both floors have 8' ceilings.

 

[begreen]

Yes, could be door gaskets wearing down, or the combustor package breaking down too.

Is this a model 2550? How did the refractory assembly look when the cat was replaced? Is the secondary air probe in good shape?

 

[Justin325]

Also check the window gaskets as well as the ash pan. They can loosen over time and be a culprit for letting in excess air.
A leak in the flue system won't cause the issue you described, if anything it would decrease the draft and slow down the fire. But I don't think a gap that size would be anything to worry about.

The fact that I can see flames through this (when NOT in catalytic mode) and not when IN catalytic mode has me thinking it could be the damper seal. I do have to fiddle with the damper lever a bit to get it to stay shut... almost like I need to slam the damper closed or else it will fall back open. I'll have to tear it down tomorrow and take a look at things.

 

[begreen]

That makes sense. With the bypass open, the flame path is direct to the flue.

There is one more story above this room and both floors have 8' ceilings.

Is there an attic too? How tall is the chimney once it exits the roof?

 

[Justin325]

Is this a model 2550? How did the refractory assembly look when the cat was replaced? Is the secondary air probe in good shape?

This is a 2190. The refractory didn't look too bad when I replaced the cat, it wasn't pretty, but all in one piece.

Where is the secondary air probe?
I'm new to woodstoves, but very mechanically inclined and love to learn how things work.

 

[Justin325]

Is there an attic too? How tall is the chimney once it exits the roof?

Here is a rough pic. Sorry I don't have measurments. I probably should get these measurements for future knowledge.

 

[begreen]

Ah, the green color made me think of the 2550. The Defiant Encore 2190 had the secondary probe, but I don't remember where it is.

The chimney looks to be around 24-25' tall.

 

[begreen]

What species of wood is being burned and how thick are the splits?

 

[Justin325]

What species of wood is being burned and how thick are the splits?

All oak. split 1.5 years ago. Stored outside in covered shed. Pieces are about the size of (2) 2x4's stacked 16"-18" long

 

[begreen]

Looks like the secondary probe is on the rear left side when viewing the stove from the front. It is linked to a damper below it.

If the door and ashpan gaskets are sealing well, then next, make sure the thermostatic air control is closing.

All oak. split 1.5 years ago. Stored outside in covered shed. Pieces are about the size of (2) 2x4's stacked 16"-18" long

The wood sounds good.

 

[Justin325]

make sure the thermostatic air control is closing.

Lol. It was crusted open

I think I’m still going to check the damper seal but the thermostatic air control may have been the culprit.

 

[begreen]

That looks like the secondary air flap. The secondary air probe may need replacing if it sticks open. If it's never been replaced, then this is a good time to do it.

The thermostatic primary air control flapper is down below this, underneath the stove.

@defiant3 any other thoughts?

 

[gthomas785]

Is this one of the stoves that has the primary air intake on the back corner? there's a ball chain that lifts up a flap and you should be able to hear it "clink" shut when you turn it down.

 

[Justin325]

Is this one of the stoves that has the primary air intake on the back corner? there's a ball chain that lifts up a flap and you should be able to hear it "clink" shut when you turn it down.

I think this is the part that moves when I adjust the air intake.

 

[Defiant 3]

Thomas, no. Older V.C. stoves had those. Justin325 that's it, primary air flapper thingy. I would look closely at the ash pan door to be sure it's closing securely and seals all the way around. Encores are notorious for ash pan door issues. Also tap the glass panes. If they rattle at all, regasket them . Another classic Encore problem area

 

[Justin325]

Excellent help here everyone!

I just filled it up half way and closed the flue damper and turned the air intake all the way down. The griddle temp creeped up just above 700 and I couldn’t get it to go down.

Definitely still getting air in somewhere

 

[baerjo]

I'm fighting a very similar issue, but my adapter pipe is on the outside of the flue collar, installed incorrectly. I would definitely seal that sucker as a first easy step. For me, I get to wait for the installer company.

 

[30WCF]

Could you still see the flames through the collar with the bypass closed again after tinkering with the internals?

 

[Loueze]

Well, I had a 1980 model and had trouble controlling the fire.
I bought a brand new 4,800 dollar one and have the same problem.
Brand new.
I can’t put more than 3 logs in it because it gets too hot .
Now , I get to do all the tests and things that your excellent staff has suggested.
I almost want to put a smoke bomb in it and light it with the “damper” shut and see if the smoke comes out

 

[begreen]

Well, I had a 1980 model and had trouble controlling the fire.
I bought a brand new 4,800 dollar one and have the same problem.
Brand new.
I can’t put more than 3 logs in it because it gets too hot .
Now , I get to do all the tests and things that your excellent staff has suggested.
I almost want to put a smoke bomb in it and light it with the “damper” shut and see if the smoke comes out

Welcome back. What is too hot? Is the stove getting too hot or the house? If the stove, what temperature are you seeing and where is it being read?

 

[Loueze]

The stove gets to 600 pretty fast and nothing I do will slow it down .
I have a thermometer on the top right behind the griddle and another one about 15” from the top of the stove on the single wall pipe going up
I tried turning the air down (right hand lever toward the back, cat engaged , I’ve run one of these for years )And there is no visible change in the flames .
The “glass” gets black if I leave it turned down .
I got a three split fire burning at 10:30 , go to bed and when I check it at 3am , it’s burned completely out .
No coals nothing .
I bought the same model because I thought the roller latches and statements of quality and the fact that I’m hooked on top load and the glass front .
I just love the way this stove looks .
It just doesn’t work right .
Got to have a leak and I have to find it .
I bought a new one because I got tired of putting new gaskets in the old one .
Dang .

 

[begreen]

Does this setup still have a 2+ story flue which goes from 6" to 8"?