What size stove for Alaska?

[stokedalaska]

I've decided to upgrade to a more modern and efficient wood stove from the older Jotul model I have now. I've decided to go with non-catalytic steel stove. The best price around seems to be the Englander (Summers Heat); any comments on this brand versus other similar ones? (I've seen Kodiak/enviro and Regency brands up here that are similar but much more expensive.)

Now the main question, what size should I get? I have a 1000 square foot 2-story home; because it's located in Alaska and I'd like to be able to use it for full heating needs in winter, I think I should go with a higher rating than 1000 square feet. The bigger model does not cost much more but is it less efficient or less clean-burning to use a stove that is sized too big? Also concerned that 1.8 might be a bit small for firebox size on the smaller model.

Here are the basics on the two models:

50-SNC13:
Heats 1800 square feet
60,000 BTU
1.8 cu ft firebox

50-SNC30 (the bigger one):
Heats 2200 square feet
75,000 BTU
3.5 cu ft firebox

 

[EatenByLimestone]

I'd tend to go bigger, but lets ask a few questions first.

Is this going to be your only heat? How well insulated is your home? How long are you expecting it to be able to burn without having to reload it? Is the floorplan of your house arranged for easy heat transfer to other parts of the house?


Which model Jotul are you replacing? Were you happy with this stove?

 

[zzr7ky]

I would not consider the smaller one because the small firebox pretty well dooms the dream of overnight burning. Softer woods also argue for a larger firebox.

I think you'll be very happy with the larger unit.

I really enjoy AK from Homer to Manley Hot Spring!

ATB,
Mike

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Welcome to the forum stokedalaska.


You'll get lots of answers on your question but hopefully BoggyDave from Anchorage and Northof60 from the Yukon will chime in here as they will know more about your climate first hand. For sure, the climate is cold during winter. lol There have been others from Alaska get on the forum from time to time also; mostly with questions.

 

[stokedalaska]

Thanks for all your replies!

Some answers for EatenByLimestone -

The old Jotul is a combifire #4 (looks kinda like an Easter Island statue). I believe it is 60,000 BTU which has proven to be plenty of heat. I measured the firebox and it's about 2.5. Seems like a good size, which makes me hesitant to go down to 1.5, but maybe the better efficiency of the smaller newer stove would make that a wash. Yes, I've been happy with it but look forward to more efficiency, hopefully burning less wood with longer burns, and also some better aesthetics (like a glass window and room on the top surface to set a pot).

Overnight burns would be nice, but I do have a "Monitor" kerosene heater that I could run at low thermostat overnight. This might be a better option if the overnight thing is the only big driver to a bigger firebox.

As far as floorplan and heat movement, no problems there. The downstairs is open and the staircase to upstairs is pretty open too. Upstairs is usually several degrees cooler, which I think is ideal. I've never felt a need for any kind of fan. The house is well insulated (but not super).

Other than spending a bit more on the larger stove, how likely is it that it might be too hot? We can have some pretty cool & rainy spells through the summer here in Alaska and it's nice to run a fire on those days. Is there a big loss of efficiency in burning a bigger stove at a lower rate than it can handle?

 

[zzr7ky]

Hi -

With a bigger stove in modest heating weather I just kick the stove off so it will hit the anticipated need. Like lighting a decent fire late on the evening before if cold/windy weather is predicted. It does it's thing and goes out unless/until it's needed again. It's also a good opportunity to use softwood, savin gbetter hard stuff for colder weather.

I wish I went one size up. It is a common refrain.

Maybe some NC30 user can chime in: How many square feet, What type of house, how far North?

 

[summit]

In alaska?! get the bigger one.

 

[begreen]

I would go with the larger stove, but in soapstone or the big Alderlea for a softer, convective heat overnight. We had a similar situation this winter with folks in Wyoming and a leaky 900+ sq ft house. They felt the 30NC was too hot in close quarters. It's a good heater, but a strong radiator.

 

[John_M]

stokedalaska, Welcome to the forum.

Do you have 1,000 sq. ft. or 500 sq.ft. on each floor of your two story, well insulated house? If you have 2,000 total sq. ft. to heat I would recommend a large size stove. A medium size stove might be indicated if you have a total of 1,000 sq. ft. to heat. Most of your fire wood might be spruce, pine or birch.

I will assume you live in the Anchorage/Girdwood area. If so, your winters will be mostly dark with no solar gain through the windows. Without insulated window coverings you will suffer much heat loss through even well constructed double or triple glazed windows. Periodic temperatures can be about -20 °F with strong winds for short stretches of the winter. Again, in this situation a large firebox would be indicated.

Considering your original post and my few comments the PE Spectrum (1.97 cu. ft and 72,000 btu) would be a good heater for a home with a total of 1,000 (+/-) sq. ft. to heat, even with cathedral ceilings (cabin in Girdwood). However, if your home is in the 2,000 sq. ft. range I would strongly suggest a stove with a 2.5 cu. ft. or larger firebox and rated with a total output of 90,000 +/- btu. Because I am familiar with only the PE line of steel stoves I would recommend their Summit model for your installation if heating a 2,000 sq. ft. home in that climate.

Others might have strong recommendations about the benefits of cast iron vs. steel vs. soapstone, etc. Still others will have suggestions about whether you would benefit with a stove using catalytic converter technology. I do not have enough info. to comment about these choices.

Best wishes, and good luck with your final choice.

John_M

 

[EatenByLimestone]

I like the idea behind the old combi stoves. All of that surface area inside (and out) pulls the available heat out of the fire. I suspect that they may be a good deal more efficient than the average stove of their era.

I'd go with at least the same size firebox. If you go smaller, I think you would get a shorter burn. It may still fulfill your needs because the efficiency allows you to extract a bit more heat per charge, but there just isn't as much fuel in the box to support a long burn. The only thing that pops out in my mind is the old stove would store heat in the cast iron and slowly radiate it out, increasing the time that the stove was physically heating the house. A steel stove like the ones you mention will put out the heat, then cool off somewhat rapidly.

The 30 is a heavy mofo, I wouldn't want to try to get it back up my basement stairs, but I don't think it weighs anything like the combi does. Much of the weight is also in the firebrick which is designed to reflect heat back into the fire and not hold it like most thermal mass (but it also has about 400lbs of steel). The baffle in the top is a ceramic board which care has to be given to so it doesn't break. I would imagine the true firebox size is around 3 cu ft since you can't load right up to it. When I load mine up, I fill the back of the fire box as high as I can. My splits are 16-18" long as they were cut for the small Century listed in my signature. Off this load I can burn at a rate that heats my stovetop to an average of 700 degrees for around 8 hours. The 30 will take 20" splits straight in, and I have placed splits over 24" long diagonally. It can hold a good amount of wood and I have not filled the stove to the brim yet.

You may want to look at cast iron because it will have more of the same characteristics that you are used to with the combi.

Matt

 

[stokedalaska]

Thanks again for all the info, and to clarify, my house is a total of 1000 square feet (2 stories with a 20 x 28 footprint; all 8 foot ceilings). What I'm hearing and suspected is that I may not be very happy with a smaller firebox.

A question I'm still not clear on... do I stand to lose anything by getting the larger stove? if I were to get the larger stove but just not load it up fullythe majority of the times that I don't need to (daytime and shoulder seasons, but probably still fuller than the smaller stove) , do I lose anything (like efficiency or more creosote) versus getting the smaller stove and usually running it at full? I would imagine I could still burn a smaller but still hot fire and it would run pretty much like the smaller stove?

Yup, firewood here is mostly birch and spruce. Limestone has a good point about the feel of the cast iron stoves - kind of worth reconsidering, though I was sold on the price and look of the steel.

 

[begreen]

The Alderlea is a hybrid of steel and castiron. In a small place it has the soft heat of a soapstone, but the long burn times you are looking for. A mid-sized T5 is keeping a family warm on the Bering Sea, it should work ok for you if you are on coastal south central AK, near Juneau or Sitka. It will run well during the normal winter coastal temps in the 30s, but can provide the extra punch when needed. I would not get the big Alderlea, (T6) unless you are living on the interior or the place is pretty leaky. If the latter is the case, caulking and some insulation are going to give you more comfort over the long haul.

 

[ControlFreak]

You have more flexibility with the larger stove.

You can always put less wood in the larger stove and get similar behavior as with the smaller stove.

You'll never put more wood into the smaller stove than the firebox allows, so you're limited by that.

Go with the larger stove.

 

[begreen]

Always and never are absolutes and nothing is absolute with wood burning. You can always go to the grocery store in a Mack truck, but it is not always the best plan.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Nobody is going to fight you for that parking space or give you door dings if you drive the Mack....

 

[ControlFreak]

Always and never are absolutes and nothing is absolute with wood burning.

Oh my! That's an absolute statement!

I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just couldn't resist.

 

[begreen]

I absolutely knew I'd get it for that one.