Where does one begin?

[MTY]

Rough framing will be complete in the next few days. Windows are in, roof is on. I plan to insulate the heck out of it. I have good southern exposure and plenty of room.

I have the tools and ability to do the work myself. I have wired several houses in the past. I have no knowledge of solar or any idea of where to begin. Temp power is in the yard, but I have not begun to trench lines or wire the house.

Other than talking to the power company, what is the first step in putting in solar tied to the grid? They have a display in front of their offir, but I'd rather not sound like an idiot when I go to talk with them.

 

[maple1]

IMO that is the only first step.

What comes of that would then lead to the next steps.

For instance, they might require contractor installed, with the contractor to be selected from their list of approved ones - in which case a talk with a couple of said contractors would be the next step.

Sometimes it works out the best to go talk to the power company (or whoever in total dumbness, even if you have to play it hard.

 

[peakbagger]

First Step buy this book, https://www.dummies.com/store/produ...Dummies-2nd-Edition.productCd-0470596783.html there is free download of the first editions somewhere but I could not find it quickly.

Next step go to this site http://www.dsireusa.org/ and see what incentives are available and see if net metering is available. In some cases smaller utilities don't want solar on their system and have policies in place to discourage it. If you are one of those areas it makes things far less attractive.

Do both of these things before you talk to a salesmen. Be aware that many folks selling solar are commission based and could give a darn about what happens after you have signed a very complex legal document. In the vast majority of cases, if you cant pay for and own a system you are handing over much of the profits and taking on a lot of long term liabilities if you do creative financing like a lease. FYI , the 30% federal solar rebate is dropping to 28% next year. Some installers are hyping the end of the 30% as the "end of the rebate", don't be pressured as the 2% could easily be eaten up by rushing.

Next step determine if your local building inspector will allow a DIY installation and if you have to go the full code route. If you need to follow code its harder to DIY but not impossible. I have no commercial interest in this firm but they sell what looks to be a pretty complete code compliant kits https://www.altestore.com/store/solar-power-systems-c447/. If you have read the book you will have calculated your system size so this will get you a rough idea on system cost, but the ideal system will vary depending on incentives.

Ideally depending on your potential system size you may want the electrician to put in a main panel with extra bus capacity. They may have to install a 250 AMP bus panel with a 200 AMP main breaker if your system size is much over 5 KW. That saves having to do a line side tap which is far more expensive and potentially uglier. There is no need for an extra conduit to the utility pole, the solar ties into the main panel and feeds power into the panel, if you are using more power than generated the utility measures that on one channel of the meter and if you are generating more than you need they record it on second channel of the same meter. You most likely need a spare conduit through the wall from the location of the inverter or gateway to the outside of the house near the meter. You may need a rapid shut down switch mounted next to the meter. You may not depending on the type of system you install but spare conduit is always a nice thing to have.

You may want to run a metal conduit from where you plan to install the inverter or the gateway to the attic when you are doing the rough in so you don't have to run wiring outside the house. This have to be metal conduit, plastic is not acceptable.

Put a whole house surge suppression device on your main panel. This protects the house from surges from the power line. Solar inverters tend to be sensitive to outside surges. I recommend one of these https://www.altestore.com/store/enc...solar-surge-protection-device-300v-ac-p11543/

I have DIYs three arrays with a major rebuild of one of them. I have done all three completely solo with no help including rigging panels on the roof. Its not rocket science mostly plug and play especially if you are using commercial racking. 90% is grunt work following the manufacturers instructions , the 5% is where its worth working with an electrician as the tie into the panel requires some electrical knowledge. The biggest risk is working on the roof in the sun, its easy to get dehydrated and dizzy which is not a good combination while working on roof . I timed my work for early morning or evening so I didn't get scorched.

 

[Woodsplitter67]

Just as an FYI the electric company will not allow you to put in a system that is 110% more of your usage if you are in new construction and you do not have a Year's worth of electric bills you will be stuck with a smaller system.. and then be able to add on.. thats the way it is in NJ so id check on that

 

[peakbagger]

Every utility has very different rules, I would not use what works in NJ as any indication of what you can or can not do elsewhere. In my utilities sandbox I can hook up to 10 KW of panels even if I only use 1KW. Sound great until I look at the details on my net metering which limits my sales to once a year selling at a very low rate to the utility (far less than I buy the power back). I would much rather just use the utility as a "battery" and carry a surplus so I never have a power bill (5 years and counting) I personally use a minisplit to use up my surplus power mostly for shoulder season heating rather than selling my surplus back. In many other utilities you can not carry a credit for more than a year. That means at some predetermined month the utility resets your account to zero so any power stored up prior to the date is lost or maybe you get a credit at some low rate on your bill. Kind of sucks if that date lines up with January first and you have built up a surplus of power during summer to heat carry you through the winter. There are all sort of variations out there and unless you want to run for the legislature and change the rules you need to understand solar enough to ask the right questions of your local utility because that's the only utility rules that counts.

Once you know the incentives and the local rules, then you design a system that gets you the most rebates and makes sure you don't end up selling power for cheap. With me I am far better off putting in excess panels and using it for heating and cooling while someone stuck with a one year reset is probably going to put in smaller system. NH also had $2,500 maximum local rebate for up to 4 KW so a lot of 4KW systems went in as it was the least out of pocket.

SRECS also factor in, some states like Mass had very generous SREC rates up to $300 a MWhr. In that situation putting as many panels that would fit on the roof made a lot of sense. I get $20 at best these days for one so my checks aren't worth much.

In VT they give extra rebates for Vermont produced equipment. For awhile they were paying a premium for all solar power produced and then the homeowner could buy back what they actually needed to run the house at a lower rate.

The folks in CA have to deal with tiered rates and all sort of rules plus the state has now made solar mandatory on new residential housing.

I wish it was standardized but it isn't so that where need to do your homework.

 

[begreen]

Yes, incentives vary a lot from state to state. In WA state some cap out at the total size of the array.

 

[MTY]

Over my lifetime, I bought most of my groceries with money made trouble shooting complex electronic problems.

We have a 400 amp service in the house we are living in . The meter and two mains sit in the yard. The house was 100 amp service before I started the remodel.

When the electrical inspector showed up prior to heat up and cut over he told me that when he first came out he was certain a homeowner would not be able to complete the job. He was surprised that I had not hired a contractor.

I think the first step is the dummies book, and then a trip to the poco.

At the new place, even if they require me to hire someone to do the tie in, I should be able to dig the trenches, mount the arrays in the yard and set the meter base in the yard. I am going to wire the house myself.

The poco is a co-op and they promote both solar and wind. I'll have to see how it pencils out.

 

[MTY]

I forgot to mention that at the new place my power bill is about $31 per month and has been for the last year. About $3.00 is usage and the rest fees. This is temp service to the yard for constuction. I hope the poco would be smart enough to realize once the house is hooked up, usage will rise.

 

[peakbagger]

Sounds like you have the skills and probably smart enough to go into the code book. I have to assume a low level of skills when I answer a post so I go can into a bit more detail now that I know you have skills.

If you are doing a ground mount and have a good solar exposure, with no shading from 9 to 3 minimum (preferably longer) then I would recommend a string array, String arrays are less popular with volume oriented pros because they are not as plug and play and more difficult to do Rapid Shutdown (a new code requirement). Rapid shutdown is not required for ground arrays so you can go with central inverter. A string inverter requires a bit more calculations but its the lower overall cost. Depending on the array size you can get a Inverter with multiple MPPT circuits so you can have the inverter track 2 or more strings in the array separately to deal with snow or shading. You also can buy an inverter that has a Secure Power Supply (SPS) which is a limited amperage 15 amp circuit that operates when the sun is out and the grid is down. Normally the least cost is one inverter sized for all the strings but if you want a bit more backup power then you may want to go with two inverters equipped with SPS. I think SMA is the only company offering it. A string inverter also saves you a bit on cabling as you can run smaller gauge wires as the string voltage is higher than 240 VAC if you use microinverters.. Optimizers sit in between microinverters and string inverters, they are better for shading issues but less costly and potentially more reliable than micro inverters. Solaredge is the big optimizer company and is talking about offering the ability to hook up a battery and run separate from the grid but i dont think they actually have product. Microinverter systems are as close to plug and play as you can get but the trade off is more costly and potentially less reliable as the electronics are out on the back of a very hot or cold panel. .

If you have the real estate stick with fixed mount arrays. If you want get creative and help out with snow buildup, tiltable arrays are great but its hard to get an engineered system. Speaking of snow, get the arrays up off the ground and make sure you have space to clean the snow off that builds up at the front edge of the array. Some folks mount panels in a landscape orientation and leave gaps between each horizontal panel. The snow slides off somewhat easier and it reduces snow buildup at the lower edge of the panel. Do yourself a favor and just do one long row instead of multiple rows due to shading.

 

[MTY]

Thanks for the info. Now I have something to think about. I have plenty of room, good exposure, the area is rated for a 40 pound snow load and it would probably be easier to incorporate this in the build rather than to try and add it later.

Money is the main constraint. I have not skimped on quality, and that is more costly than contractor spec home standards.

The roof is sheated with 3/4 plywood and covered with metal. Every seam is sealed with mastic. I am not mounting an array up there.

 

[peakbagger]

Yes you will pay a bit of a premium over what a contractor does buying in bulk but if you are willing to roll the dice and hassle of buying overstock or bankruptcy panels you can save some money. The joke with the vast majority of panels is that even though they may come with a long term guarantee that collecting anything in the long run is slim to none. Sunpower is an exception but they will not sell DIY, LG has long term presence in the market and has honored their long term warranty but even big names like ARCO, Shell, Sharp, GE and Siemens just buy a panel company and then sell any warranty issues to another company when they decide to get out of the business. There can be long term material degradation but in the majority of the situations as long as the panels are not dead out of the box they work long term. Canadian Solar panels are contrary to the name built in China but they have a third party guarantee backed by an insurance company. Its likely if you have long term issue you will get something but realize panel sizes and configurations change every few years so if one panel goes bad or is damaged they probably dont have spare panel. The one concession is to consider is buying a spare panel or two and stash it in safe place. I have two arrays made up with panels from bankruptcy auctions and my original array was bought new long ago when panels were very expensive. The only guarantee issue is an inverter that most likely got zapped by a utility issue.I think I would have saved it if I had high quality surge suppressors on my wiring and have subsequently installed high quality Midnight Solar SPDs.

SunElectronics in Miami Florida is the king of overstock panels. Just be careful as they sell used panels on occasion. This is disclosed in their ads but you need to look for it. If you get them on the phone they appear to be salesmen on commission so be careful they dont bait and switch you. They use the terms A ad B panels. There is no industry definition between A panel and B panel. Generally and A panel is new manufacturer stock standard grade. B panels usually have visual defects but also could be rejects. On occasion they may buy rejects from a name brand and slap there own guarantee on them which is basically if its dead out of the box and you are willing to pay to ship them back at great expense they will ship you another one if they still have one.

Used panels do not get the 30% federal tax credit. Note shipping is not cheap so factor it in and plan on buying pallet quantities as they tend to be packed better.

One other issue is sizing string inverters, I believe in oversizing an inverter so that its rated a bit more than the panel output. Most installers undersize them so that the rated panel wattage exceeds the capacity of the inverter. This means on occasion that the inverter has to "clip" the input and limit output which means the inverter is running 100%. I prefer to have them run a bit under rated nameplate especially as during the right conditions in winter with snow on the ground that my panels can exceed their rated output. This is also an issue with microinverters and optimizers they rate them for 10 to20% excess panel wattage and assume clipping does not happen often.

 

[Where2]

Although I have purchased through Sun Electronics, my last DIY pallet of panels came out of Renvu. If you sign up on their email list, they will send you the "weekly specials". My last purchase (a year ago) was a 5.6kW setup including microinverters for $0.69/W. (prices have continued to fall since this...) Freight shipping from socal to south florida was ~$450. Be sure to get the insurance no matter who you go with, freight shippers can be harsh on palletized cargo.

40 lbs snow load is easy. My wife and I have a property with 100 lbs per square foot ground snow load that we want to install a PV array on... (Northern Maine) Rather than load more weight on the roof and potentially obstruct snow sliding off the metal roof, I'm pretty sure I'm going ground mount to maximize my PV potential, since no facet of any of my roofs (garage, barn or house) is facing directly south, and none of my roofs are particularly steep to help with "automatic snow removal"...

 

[wilsoncm1]

The roof is sheated with 3/4 plywood and covered with metal. Every seam is sealed with mastic. I am not mounting an array up there.

Standing seam metal? If so, there are racking systems that do not penetrate the roof. They clamp at the seams. Look into it, if you have that style.
Roof mounts are MUCH cheaper than ground mounts.