Looks like those big spiky thorns had a purpose.
https://bygl.osu.edu/node/959#.WkxRMfeg5eY
https://bygl.osu.edu/node/959#.WkxRMfeg5eY
Why are honey locusts so hostile?
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Woody5506
Minister of Fire
Firefighter938
Feeling the Heat
It's interesting that their defense systems are still in place for so long after the threat is gone.
FaithfulWoodsman
Minister of Fire
Their "defense system" is just happen stance. It wasn't specifically developed to to defend against threats. Its because of these characteristics that it survived. Survival of the fittest!
It appears to have evolved this defense mechanism because it was the favorite food of certain megafauna that are no longer on the planet. This would make sense, particularly if the seed pods attracted these beasts. It's an interesting study though the genetics of which are above my pay grade.
https://permies.com/t/16353/Black-Honey-Locust-trees-thorns
I just ordered 100 of the thornless variety (amongst 500 other trees). They say a few will have thorns. Hopefully when they start seeding they stay seedless.
Hopefully i don't have a problem on my hands in 20 years. I actually at first wanted to plant black locust but most of the bare root stock is sold out everywhere by now. I am starting a hedge of trees along about 1800 feet of road frontage. Honey Locust, Silver Maple, Black Cherry, Osage Orange, Black Walnut (probably a grove on it's own), some other stuff too, but I picked those for good quality firewood and fast growth. Silver Maple because I think it's such a nice looking tree.
Sawset
Minister of Fire
In the desert regions like near Phoenix, just about everything will either poke, stab, hook, poison, or bite. Honey locust would fit right in. Down there, one thing I can't figure out is how soft skinned things like white tail deer and coyotes can even survive at all amongst all the deadly plants and other animals around. Funny they don't just get burried in cling on cholla or barrel cactus fish hooks.
Edit:
Read the article. Mastadons? Hmm. Evolutionary defenses to Gomphotheres of the order Proboscidea. I'll never look at a tree with thorns the same again. The connections implied were very interesting.
Edit:
Read the article. Mastadons? Hmm. Evolutionary defenses to Gomphotheres of the order Proboscidea. I'll never look at a tree with thorns the same again. The connections implied were very interesting.
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FaithfulWoodsman
Minister of Fire
Interesting .......no. Troubling.........yes if you cling to the theory of evolutionary process. A theory that doesnt even follow its own discipline's method for discovering and explaining natural phenomena. If evolutionary process was valid or legitimate the thorns would shown signs of diminishment, not show prolific reoccurrence in genetically strained trees.
Reading the articles the authors indicate that there may be secondary benefits from the thorns that help them persist.
All I know is that I am clearing them out of my land, and will eliminate everyone. People say they are good burning, but for me it's not worth the hassle.
They are also nitrogen fixers. They make all other trees and plants around them grow better. I wish I had even one on my acreage.
BG, have you ever seen the thorns on these trees, the trunk is literally covered in 3" long spikes. Nasty to deal with.
Yes, sounds nasty. Fortunately I haven't encountered a forest of these trees. I have read of folks cutting a couple rings around the trunk and injecting herbicide into the lower ring. After 2-3 years the bark and thorns fall off.
Firefighter938
Feeling the Heat
If you use the top of your bar the thorns will get thrown away from you. The thorns are generally just on the trunk. It works out well. I have cut several and it is well worth it, imho.
Buddy of mine has piles of these on his ground along the river bottom. He runs a ring around the bottom as mentioned. Leaves them stand 2-3 years and then processes them after the thorns have dropped. He's been doing it this way for years. Works well for him. Still tough on anything rubber wheeled getting the stuff out of the woods!
I have burned lots of the thornless variety and Black and Honey Locust. The thornless variety wood is not similar at all to the Black or Honey Locust. It still burns okay but does not have the BTU's or burn time of the thorny versions. I don't know how that variety got that way. The thornless offspring in my area do not have thorns on them btw. Kevin
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