Woodstock soapstone - are they as good as everyone says?

  • Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.

    We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.

    We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
  • Hope everyone has a wonderful and warm Thanksgiving!
  • Super Cedar firestarters 30% discount Use code Hearth2024 Click here
Status
Not open for further replies.

sailor61

Burning Hunk
Hearth Supporter
Nov 28, 2006
124
Warwick, RI
here's the deal - had an old Vt Castings Vigilant and was very pleased with it. Something went wrong in the wall (ruled accidental and unknown by fire dept and insurance co) behind the stove and the house burned. Looking to replace the stove and not real impressed witht he current Vt Castings stuff. The Hearthstone Heritage looks interesting but there seem to be mixed reviews on it. AHve begun giving serious consideration to the Woodstock Fireview, seems as if the reviews are all outstanding of both the stove and the company. Do they pay people to log on and heap praise on their products or are they as good as everyone says they are?

Issues that have me still uncertain about going with a Woodstock;

No dealers - having to go direct to factory
Only the side door opens - how difficult is it to clean out?
NOt sure about the catalytic issue?
Can they possibly be as great as everyone makes them out to be?

Thanks for whatever feedback you have to offer
 
Woodstock is probably one of the highest rated companies, this is probably going to be interesting because there are many Woodstock fans in this forum. Hearthstone is also well known and many people swear by Hearthstone on these forums as well.

My advice, is personally pick the one that you like the looks of better and make sure soapstone is for you. If you plan to come home to a cold house and want to quickly heat it, soapstone isn't for you. I find them more difficult to get started when cold, so they don't do as well as non-soapstone units in spring & fall but when you start burning constantly soapstone really shines because reloads are awesome! Just make sure, you understand they don't heat as fast but rather spread the heat out over longer periods of time. When I light a fire in my soapstone insert, it's about 1 - 2 hours when I feel warm air and about 3 hours before I really start feeling the heat, but the heat is very even, it's very difficult to overheat the room it's located (that may be in part because of several factors), and I couldn't be happier because I love the even heat. When the fire is out, my particular unit will continue to heat for 1.5 - 2 hours. The Heritage or Fireview will probably be more like 3+ when the fire goes out. My basement though, where I want to heat it quickly because I don't use it often and when I do I want it heated fast... I want a non-soapstone one down there. By the way, I think Woodstock has the edge compared to Hearthstone in my opinion for service and quality. Hearthstone puts out a lot of stoves and I think things can slip through the cracks more easily with that scenario. I've only contacted Hearthstone, and others on this forum have as well and they've always been pleasant to me, and others from what I've seen. Also, have no fear about Woodstock being only an online company. If you want to visit them, they'll be more than happy to see you. They don't get those reviews, or get the following of members on here if they weren't as good as people say :) As for the cat vs. non, do you have an exterior chimney? And, as for side-loading... I'll leave that to someone else.
 
sailor61 said:
here's the deal - had an old Vt Castings Vigilant and was very pleased with it. Something went wrong in the wall (ruled accidental and unknown by fire dept and insurance co) behind the stove and the house burned. Looking to replace the stove and not real impressed witht he current Vt Castings stuff. The Hearthstone Heritage looks interesting but there seem to be mixed reviews on it. AHve begun giving serious consideration to the Woodstock Fireview, seems as if the reviews are all outstanding of both the stove and the company. Do they pay people to log on and heap praise on their products or are they as good as everyone says they are?

Issues that have me still uncertain about going with a Woodstock;

No dealers - having to go direct to factory
Only the side door opens - how difficult is it to clean out?
NOt sure about the catalytic issue?
Can they possibly be as great as everyone makes them out to be?

Thanks for whatever feedback you have to offer

I've owned a Fireview for about a year now and I'm VERY pleased with it. Of course, this is my first woodstove, so I really can't compare it to anything else.

The factory is about an hour drive from me, so I went on the tour and that really helped me decide on which stove to buy. They are very well built. And the folks at Woodstock are very friendly and helpful before and after the sale. I couldn't be happier with the stove and the service.

Now about the side door. I don't find it inconvenient while loading or removing ashes. What I do find a little inconvenient is cleaning the glass. If the glass was on a swing-out door, it would be much easier to clean. But this is nitpicking really. Compared to all the plusses, this is a small matter.

Regarding the cat, at first I thought I'd have to kinda babysit it, but it's really not that way. No problems with running a cat for me. I know others don't like them, but I have no problem with a cat.

I'm a VERY picky person so when I recommend a product, you know it meets a VERY high standard. And, I can heartily recommend this stove. It exceeds my standard, and believe me, that's saying a lot.
 
Soapstone stoves are sweet period. Woodstock makes a fine product, so does hearthstone. If you willing to wait for the stove to warm up, and dont expect fast heat. Soapstone is for you.
Cons:
Slow warm up.
Stone is more fragile then cast iron

Pros:
Nice, steady, even heat
Long cool down times, the stove will stay hot for hours after the firebox is exausted.

Stone stoves dont tend to blast you out of a room, there surface tems are lower and more steady, so you can buy larger then you need and get away with it.
 
Dylan said:
MountainStoveGuy said:
Cons:
Slow warm up.
Stone is more fragile then cast iron

You can add that soapstone scratches easily, and more permanently.
Also, that the stone is porous and therefore, subject to staining.

You talk like there made out of compressed talcum power !? :lol:
 
Dylan said:
MountainStoveGuy said:
Cons:
Slow warm up.
Stone is more fragile then cast iron

You can add that soapstone scratches easily, and more permanently.
Also, that the stone is porous and therefore, subject to staining.

This may be true, there are severl things i left out im sure.
Soapstone scratches, but it also fixes easy with steel wool.
And it can stain, but i dont make a habit of cooking bacon and eggs on the woodstove. I use a enameled pot (inside and out) for water, and it doenst rust. But if it did stain, you buff it out with a abrasive. There is no question about it that you have to be more carefull with what you put on top of your soapstone stove, but i think the heating properties of soapstone outway the staining and scratching properties...
 
sailor61 said:
here's the deal - had an old Vt Castings Vigilant and was very pleased with it. Something went wrong in the wall (ruled accidental and unknown by fire dept and insurance co) behind the stove and the house burned. Looking to replace the stove and not real impressed witht he current Vt Castings stuff. The Hearthstone Heritage looks interesting but there seem to be mixed reviews on it. AHve begun giving serious consideration to the Woodstock Fireview, seems as if the reviews are all outstanding of both the stove and the company. Do they pay people to log on and heap praise on their products or are they as good as everyone says they are?

Issues that have me still uncertain about going with a Woodstock;

No dealers - having to go direct to factory
Only the side door opens - how difficult is it to clean out?
NOt sure about the catalytic issue?
Can they possibly be as great as everyone makes them out to be?

Thanks for whatever feedback you have to offer

I've had my Fireview since last Feb. Love it. Everything Woodstock claims about the stove is true. I have burned many other stoves and this stove is by far the best. This is the first cat stove I have owned, and found it is very easy to operate and maintain. As long as you burn dry wood and follow the stove manual you won't have any cat issues. Cats still have a bad rap at some dealers. I was looking around a new stove shop the other day, and the owner said they don't even make cat stoves anymore, the new technology is better. Of course I had to set him straight! He had no idea.

The side door is better than front door loading in my opinion. Only gripe I have about the door is, it's kind of small, and I wish it had a different door handle, but I'm use to it.

I wish they had local dealers, so I could of seen the stove in person before sale, but they do offer a 6 month for any reason, money back guarantee. Woodstock has very friendly knowledgeable people to help and answer your questions.

Some people say they aren't very good for spring/fall burning. They don't come up to temp quick enough. Well I can get my stove up to 500 degrees in 1 hour and it has no problem taking the chill off.

Did you ask for the free video and information packet? Check them out you won't be disapointed.
 
I agree that the door latch could use work, but I suppose that's a small complaint. I just like stoves where you don't need to wear a gaunlet glove to open the door.

Todd, or anyone else with a woodstock. Is it a huge pain to reach into the stove to clean the glass? Or is the glass cleaning needed so infrequently that it really isn't an issue?
 
I guess I'm not sure what some folks call "fast" either. I've only had my insert burning a few days now, but start up doesn't seem to be an issue.

After the building inspector signed off on my install this morning, I lit a fire (working from home today :-)). The blowers came on within a half hour, and I shut them a half hour after that. One hour from the match, and the room was up from 65 to 70 and comfortable. That's without building a particularly big fire nor closing off any doors upstairs to keep the heat down in the main living area.

This is a soapstone lined Hearthstone Clydesdale...


-Dan
 
Hmm... I have the same Clydesdale. Within 20 minutes from a cold start I have full secondary burn, flames looping up and around the baffle, and I slow down the air. Within an hour I have 500F temps BUT only on the top, not the sides or bottom which isn't enough surface area to take the chill out or quickly start heating. After 1 1/2 hours the fans kick on, the sides have reached around 200F which is only warm air out the top. After 3 hours, the sides and bottom have caught up and I'm getting some serious heat which... is not a fast warm up nor fast enough to take the chilll out. After the fires out, only the sides & bottom have any heat storage from the soapstone, and it releases it for the next 1.5-2 hours afterward.

What's the temperature of the sides & bottom after an hour, two hours, and three? I know T&B you have an insert like me and that's not possible hopefully those with soapstone stoves can do the experiment. I have no problem getting the top or flue up to temp real fast nor the secondary burn, it's the sides & bottom. I also think it makes sense, a couple hours to charge the sides & bottom, a couple hours to decharge, my wood use is good, and it's not like I'm not getting a lot of heat, every fire raises my 1400 sq ft house by 8F. We'll see how that holds up when the real cold hits but as it stands now, I don't light a fire until my house drops to 64F so I don't overdo it on the heating.
 
I can try and do that - next time I start from cold and have a few hours of waking downtime . that is an unlikely combination right now!

Want to tell me more about where and how you are measuring? I have a infrared/laser pointer one that I can aim just about anywhere for surface temps...


Since you're also getting a fast burn and a good coal bed, I doubt there will be all that much difference in our stove temp profiles... Certainly there is a difference in our units for the blower setpoint. I wonder if that is adjustable, or if that thermostat is easily replaceable.... ?

One thing I did already measure was the blower output temp when they kicked on around the 30 minute mark... pointing the thermometer into the blower output showed a surface temp of 150. The air temp was probably only 90 or so... felt warm, but not "hot" right away. But an extra hour of blower circulation - even starting with just "warm" air - would make a big difference in the comfort in the room.
 
I am watching this thread with interest. I looked at the Clydesdale with a lot of interest. Budgeted based on the price of one.

As to the subject line question, if everybody says they are then I figure they are. If everyone says it, that means there aren't any unhappy Woodstock campers out there. Quality stove and a rep for good customer service.

On the start-up thing I do not see how having a few soapstone bricks in the insert instead of firebrick is going to slow down start up heat a heck of a lot. There is heat bouncing around a lot of stuff that ain't soapstone in the Clydesdale and the Morgan. In fact I looked at those stoves and saw a soapstone stove company that realized they had to somehow grab a piece of that huge market for inserts. So they put some bricks in a cast stove.

<ducking under the desk now>
 
A ton of people will chime in on this... I obviously have one based on photo - very satisfied. I don't say that about a lot of purchases in life.

Rhonemas hit the nail on the head in that you don't want to use them to take the chill off a room for a couple hours - it's overkill and much more $ than you should spend for that. But if you're interested in 24x7 burning, they are among your best options. They hold heat and coals a ridiculously long time - we go 12 hours regularly, and occasionally over 15 hours. After 12-15 hours, it's still typically in the 150-250 range with enough coals for a restart without kindling or effort.

I agonized over cat vs. non-cat as well when I was shopping. Being a chemical engineer, I decided that I could probably figure out how to use a catalyst correctly and I thought the concept was technically sound - I will never go non-cat after owning a cat and using a few non-cats. I can also tell you you don't need to be a chem-e to use it :-) But for everyone who tells you that, you'll hear the opposite... net is both work for people when used correctly, and both cat and non-cat can work poorly when not used correctly.

As for durability, from what I hear on this forum, some VC cast iron units seemed to have serious problems with gasket failures and expensive rebuilds. I haven't noticed that with any of the stone stoves from any manufacturer - not sure if that is due to differences in thermal expansion or different sealing methods. I was going down the road of nice enamel VC until reading about many many $500+ rebuilds that people were doing.

The stone surface will scratch if you're rough on it - but you can buff it out with steel wool. Can't do that with a chip in enamel or a gouge in steel. That being said, we roast things in pots on our surface and use a steamer and none of those has left a mark. I haven't tried frying an egg on the stone as some claim you can...

Window cleaning would probably be harder than most due to andiron position, but I've never had soot on the glass of my stove - not really sure how to make it get dirty. I do burn good wood so maybe that is why; other stoves I've used were bad with soot problems and really annoyed me.

Side loading again is a love it or hate it issue. For us, it actually served a unique purpose - by not having a front door, we were able to have our wood floor come much closer to the front of the stove and still meet code - this made our retrofit install much less intrusive to the flow of the room. Once you have an operable door, you need 18" of protected floor in front or to side of it. For the same reason, side doors may not work in your install depending on where you would put it.

Finally, for ash removal with a Fireview - I would strongly recommend the Pilgrim brand ash pan that you'll see on their website. Just so happens that it lines up very neatly under the lip of the door so you don't drop anything on the floor. A Fireview will give you a larger firebox at the expense of an ash pan - their other models give you an ash pan but a little smaller firebox. Both are well regarded - depends on your preference. I shovel ours about once every two weeks this time of year; will get to once a week in dead of winter. I didn't believe that when Woodstock told me, but it's true. One thing I've also learned is you don't really want to be too careful cleaning it out - some ash left in there helps get fires going. So it's really quite easy - you're not trying to get things spotless inside there.

-Colin
 
Corie said:
I agree that the door latch could use work, but I suppose that's a small complaint. I just like stoves where you don't need to wear a gaunlet glove to open the door.

Todd, or anyone else with a woodstock. Is it a huge pain to reach into the stove to clean the glass? Or is the glass cleaning needed so infrequently that it really isn't an issue?

It is kind of a pain to clean the glass because of the andirons, but I have only been cleaning it maybe once a month so it's really no big deal. I never have brown soot anywhere, just some occasional white film in spots or a little fly ash.
 
Rhonemas said:
Hmm... I have the same Clydesdale. Within 20 minutes from a cold start I have full secondary burn, flames looping up and around the baffle, and I slow down the air. Within an hour I have 500F temps BUT only on the top, not the sides or bottom which isn't enough surface area to take the chill out or quickly start heating. After 1 1/2 hours the fans kick on, the sides have reached around 200F which is only warm air out the top. After 3 hours, the sides and bottom have caught up and I'm getting some serious heat which... is not a fast warm up nor fast enough to take the chilll out. After the fires out, only the sides & bottom have any heat storage from the soapstone, and it releases it for the next 1.5-2 hours afterward.

What's the temperature of the sides & bottom after an hour, two hours, and three? I know T&B you have an insert like me and that's not possible hopefully those with soapstone stoves can do the experiment. I have no problem getting the top or flue up to temp real fast nor the secondary burn, it's the sides & bottom. I also think it makes sense, a couple hours to charge the sides & bottom, a couple hours to decharge, my wood use is good, and it's not like I'm not getting a lot of heat, every fire raises my 1400 sq ft house by 8F. We'll see how that holds up when the real cold hits but as it stands now, I don't light a fire until my house drops to 64F so I don't overdo it on the heating.

For me, most of my heat is on top because that is where the cat is. On a cold start it does take A little longer for the sides and bottom to heat up. I think that is the same for any type of stove. But I also have the advantage of 4' of single wall stove pipe that generates quick heat.
 
BrotherBart no ducking necessary, we're on the same page. It doesn't make sense to me either, and I own it. Why does it buffer so much when I mean, come on it's not a true soapstone stove. I just have to go by Occam's razor which states: "All things being equal, the simplest solution tends to be the best one." After an hour from a cold start there's some serious heat going on. I'm getting great combustion as the secondary burn tubes are cherry red and I've got slow moving mostly blue flames that come up and slowly move heading across the secondary baffle, and sitting in front of the glass I can feel there's a lot of energy inside... but, where's the energy going? I've eliminated it's going out the flue, it's not transferring into the living area, the only place left I know of is storage. After the fires several glowing coals I'm getting a sh*t load of heat coming out the blowers for another hour and hot air for the next 1/2 - 2 hours so it's gotta be the storage. The cast iron you saw inside is mostly the secondary air & air wash preheating channels that run through the firebox. Those channels run along the bottom on the sides, loops around the back, and then over the top feeding them. There's not a lot of direct cast iron contact with the outside.

I'm curious to see how other Clydesdales do. Last year, I was the only one. Now, we number 4, yeah! I do renege on the idea Soapstone is hard to get fires started when cold. After fixing issues with my liner this year, extending the chimney 4 feet with an extend-a-flue, I've done it enough times now to conclude my liner was the problem with the startups, not the soapstone and, I still get the benefit on reloads of "poof" instant full fire. But, although I've reduced the warm-up times, and my start-ups when cold are cake it's still 1 1/2 hours before I start feeling warm air.
 
Kinda the experience, not as long a wait, that I am having with the Englander. The Sierra just had firebrick on the floor of the firebox. None in the back or sides. With the new stove I do notice longer warm up times because of the fire brick lining and it stays hot/warm longer when the fire dies down. So it is logical that the soapstone is doing the same thing, only better.
 
Hi,

I purchased the Woodstock Fireview solely on the basis of the reviews here and two folks that wrote to me on-line, giving alot of detailed info. concerning how they made the decision to purchase their stoves. A man who is doing some installation work at the house I am building now has owned the Palladian since 1997 and highly recommended the company and their product; he is in the process of purchasing another stove from Woodstock for a cabin he owns. I live in N. Ga., had it shipped to my builders' supply with no problems. My stove will be installed in approx. 4 weeks, so hopefully will be able to give some personal feedback after the first of the year.

Best wishes,

SG
 
The order for the Fireview is going in this week.........thanks for the input. Going with the lt grey finish on the paint and going to ask that they go for lighter colored stone. :-) I'll keep you posted as to how things work out.
 
Hi Everyone,
My first post here, but I've been heating with wood on and off since 1972 with a primitive Franklin type stove and a potbelly Bright Morning stove. I purchased a Woodstock Keystone in 1994 and I love it beyond belief. It first lived in my 900 sq.ft. home and heated it so much more pleasantly than the previous non-airtight polluter. It was large, inefficient, and when I cranked it it ran me out of the house. The Keystone is truly a softer heat, and my furniture can be closer without getting hot even when the stove is cranking. I wish I could buy one for my cabin in NC, but the prices have gone up at least $1000. If that was my full time home there would be no question. I have a 3 Bear stove in it now, and it does the job great but I'm sure it's polluting (is that true, even when there is no smoke?)
So that's the deal, I'm raving about anything Woodstock and trying to decide whether to upgrade the cabin's stove. And by the way, the guy at Woodstock said if I can't get a Woodstock he thinks Jotul is far superior to VC. He's seen the new VC's and is not impressed.
Thanks for all the great info! Burn on!

Mtnfyre
 
And p.s. on the glass...if you have the fires burning correctly the glass won't get dirty. Cleaning it requires the stove to be cool. The only difficulty is right around the andirons, but if you wear rubber gloves you can scoot the 0000 steel wool behind and it will look like new in a jiff. Much better glass than I saw in the Jotul or VC.

Mtnfyre
 
Status
Not open for further replies.