2017-18 Blaze King Performance Thread PART 2 (Everything BK)

webfish Posted By webfish, Nov 13, 2017 at 9:52 AM

  1. MissMac

    MissMac
    Member 2.
    NULL
    

    Dec 4, 2017
    113
    36
    Loc:
    NW Ontario
    Cold day in my neighbourhood today, with temps around -30*C without the windchill factored in. Just finished a load of jack pine that ran for 9.5 hrs, and kept my house at a nice 20*C. Could have stretched it out further, but had to crank it up to high for the last 2 hrs so that i can reload before bed. love it. can't wait to see what happens when i get into my birch next year!
     
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  2. kennyp2339

    kennyp2339
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Feb 16, 2014
    3,296
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    Loc:
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    The addiction has started, no turning back now, your turning into one of us.
     
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  3. Ashful

    Ashful
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    Mar 7, 2012
    11,131
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    Almost as fun as watching the kids on Christmas morning... remembering when you were once that excited.
     
  4. AlbergSteve

    AlbergSteve
    Member 2.
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    Dec 11, 2017
    52
    36
    Loc:
    Vancouver Island
    I don't trust anyone. If I want it done right, I do it myself.
    My first stove and install about 10 years ago cost me about $5k. I was working full time and then some and didn't have time to do it myself. The owner of the local dealer shows up for the estimate, we go over in great detail how the install is going to go, where the offsets go, how high, etc. I do all the layout, double check clearances, do all the required framing, cut all the holes, roof prep, all he has to do is show up, place the stove, install the pipe and go home.
    Two "skateboarders" show up with none of the right parts for the stove pipe or chimney, so back to the shop they go and will book another day when they have the parts. Week later, they start the install again and realize parts of the stove are missing/don't fit - three week to wait for another stove.
    Three weeks later they finally start again, I'm at work and my wife sends me a picture of the chimney install from the outside asking," Is this how it's supposed to look?". The picture shows the chimney out of plumb, with plumbers wrap/strap holding the chimney to the barge board, and the cap in line with the peak of the roof that was three feet away! And these are the experts.

    Fast forward ten years.

    A few months ago I went to the other dealer in town to sort out purchase/supply/install of a new stove. After about eight visits to chat about stoves and install, it was clear they weren't any more competent than the last jokers I had used. I still had to do all the roof prep - it's a single story with a flat roof, they still wanted $800 in labour to do the install! It took me 1 1/2 hours to complete and the hardest part was carrying four feet of insulated pipe up a ten foot ladder.

    The added cost of doing the install myself this time was getting the WETT inspection, $150 plus tax. I call a local sweep, he shows up and right off the bat tells me the pad doesn't extend far enough, it's too narrow, you can't cut the corners off on a corner install like that, it's too small....I had to get the BK hearth pad drawings out, take him by the hand to show and explain and convince him that yes, it actually does meet the requirements, in fact, it was bigger than required. Again, he's supposed to be the expert!

    I know this is a bit of a rant (my dear wife has to listen to them on a regular basis!), but after 25 years in the construction industry as a carpenter running jobs and supervising sub trades, it's not just the money I've saved by doing it myself, it's more important knowing that the job has been done right.
     
    Woody Stover, lsucet, jetsam and 7 others like this.
  5. Ashful

    Ashful
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Mar 7, 2012
    11,131
    4,815
    Loc:
    Philadelphia
    I had to laugh at that post, @AlbergSteve. We are cut from the same cloth. For most of my life, I’ve done all of my own work, from plumbing, to electrical, to carpentry. Now, I’m forced to hire out more than I’d like, and it’s almost always a story like this. My current fireplace was done 90% by me, but I hired a mason to do the pointing. Since he was already here, I had him lay the new brick tile on the floor, and that’s the one thing that’s caused me trouble in the entire build. It was the simplest part of that whole job, and the one thing that wasn’t done right.

    I’ve found balance now, I think. Anything above the gutters (roof work), I hire out. I also hire out all painting work, now that I have found a painter who is actually more OCD than me. This frees me up to do just about everything else, in maintaining this old joint.
     
  6. allan5oh

    allan5oh
    New Member 2.
    NULL
    

    Jan 19, 2016
    36
    6
    Loc:
    Winnipeg, MB
    It's my parents place and it's a "wood pro ts2500" non cat stove. Only 10" deep firebox so you can only get one good piece in there sideways at a time. Right now they're adding wood every 1.5-2 hours!
     
  7. AlbergSteve

    AlbergSteve
    Member 2.
    NULL
    

    Dec 11, 2017
    52
    36
    Loc:
    Vancouver Island
    ...I'm trying to find balance, it ain't easy! Finding OCD trades people is like finding a unicorn in the back yard, always a surprise. We've recently finished an eight month complete gut and reno on our place and the only trade that didn't need a babysitter was the electricians, they were outstanding.
     
    drz1050 likes this.
  8. shoot-straight

    shoot-straight
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Jan 5, 2012
    562
    151
    Loc:
    Kennedyville, MD
    I have one here- problem is they are literally double the price of everyone else.
     
  9. drz1050

    drz1050
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Sep 11, 2014
    755
    182
    Loc:
    Ballston Lake, NY
    Legit electricians tend to be OC type people. Old school plumbers as well. Those things aren't very forgiving.
     
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  10. AlbergSteve

    AlbergSteve
    Member 2.
    NULL
    

    Dec 11, 2017
    52
    36
    Loc:
    Vancouver Island
    Yep, I agree. Getting harder to find old school plumbers...
     
  11. drz1050

    drz1050
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Sep 11, 2014
    755
    182
    Loc:
    Ballston Lake, NY
    That's the truth... everyone just wants to use PEX and sharkbite fittings now for everything. While it has its uses, I still prefer copper for most runs.
     
  12. webby3650

    webby3650
    Master of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Sep 2, 2008
    8,494
    2,260
    Loc:
    Indiana
    Yes, old school indeed. Pex is fabulous stuff!
     
  13. Diabel

    Diabel
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Jan 11, 2008
    1,521
    162
    Loc:
    Ottawa, ON
    Webby, are you being sarcastic about this pex thing?
     
  14. jetsam

    jetsam
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Dec 12, 2015
    2,241
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    Loc:
    Long Island, NY
    Nobody who has done much plumbing would be sarcastic about pex. It IS great stuff.

    It's now been around for long enough for people to see that in addition to all its previously known virtues, it also has great durability.

    The crummy part of a pex+sharkbite repair is the sharkbite, not the pex.
     
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  15. Diabel

    Diabel
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    Jan 11, 2008
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    Loc:
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    Oh, I see.

    My plumber asked me yesterday if I want copper or pex in the new house...I said copper. Maybe I should have said pex
     
  16. Ashful

    Ashful
    Minister of Fire 2.
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    Mar 7, 2012
    11,131
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    Loc:
    Philadelphia
    I redid my whole house in copper in 2012. It will cost you, but my labor is free, and I’m one of those professionally trained “old school plumbers”.

    PEX is great stuff, for many reasons, but I still don’t want it in my house. Having watched several other systems come and go (anyone remember polybutylene?), there’s still some probability we’re just 20 years out from finding the problems with PEX. Im not going to subject my family to drinking water that’s been sitting in tubing that’s been leeching plasticizers and other possible carcinogens, when I can afford otherwise.

    Hopefully we’ll find my abundance of caution was unwarranted, but I’d rather not have my kids be the societal guinea pig, for this.

    Geez, running BKs must be too boring, for you guys to be off on a plumbing tangent in the BK thread.
     
  17. jetsam

    jetsam
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    Dec 12, 2015
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    Nothing wrong with copper pipe as long as it's sweated right and no ding dong uses it for an electrical ground system.
     
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  18. jetsam

    jetsam
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    Dec 12, 2015
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    I suppose that's possible. You could make a similar argument about copper, though- except that we know what the toxic element is.

    https://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/drinking/private/wells/disease/copper.html

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4030141/

    I'm not saying that you should run out and pull your copper piping this afternoon, but I also wouldn't consider it safer than the alternative.
     
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  19. Diabel

    Diabel
    Minister of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Jan 11, 2008
    1,521
    162
    Loc:
    Ottawa, ON
    Thanks everyone.

    The only reason I would go pex is because I believe it can withstand freeze better. I am worried about a slim possibility of power outages. I will have a propane backup fireplace (no electricity required) but still, I am trying to cover all basis.

    Standing water in plastic pipes.......yeah
     
  20. kf6hap

    kf6hap
    Feeling the Heat 2.
    NULL
    

    Jan 15, 2016
    481
    196
    Loc:
    Nevada City,Ca.
    Where I live, without water treatment copper pipe will make you sick and in rare cases kill you. Acidic water. Someday I will replace it all with PEX and all plastic fittings so I can throw away the softener and calcite tanks. The untreated water tastes great and makes the best coffee.

    Pex has been in Europe since 1972.
     
  21. Ashful

    Ashful
    Minister of Fire 2.
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    Mar 7, 2012
    11,131
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    From your first link:

    “All living organisms including humans need copper to survive; therefore, a trace amount of copper in our diet is necessary for good health. However, some forms of copper or excess amounts can also cause health problems.”

    Copper has been used around here for DW plumbing for over 130 years, being the standard for a number of those years, which has covered most of my lifetime. I’ve never heard of anyone around here having an issue with it, but understand that may be different in some rare parts of the country with adverse water conditions.

    I’ll take it over the unknown, any day.
     
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  22. jetsam

    jetsam
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    Dec 12, 2015
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    There's been a fair bit of discussion about the correlation between aluminum and copper intake and Alzheimer's. I don't think anyone has established causation in a meaningful way, but I would put copper pipe in the 'unknown' category. Lots of arguments for this in the second link. Not that I'm saying pex or pvc are necessarily any better for you, who knows. :p

    The CDC link does not distinguish between organic and inorganic copper (that's a difference in what the copper is bound to, not a difference in the copper itself). The CDC is also sticking to established fact, not hypothesizing where a relatively new epedimic may have come from.

    Without causation it's all speculation- anyone who says they know the answer at this point probably doesn't care to learn about the issue.
     
  23. begreen

    begreen
    Mooderator 2.
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    Staff Member

    Nov 18, 2005
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    Lead was used for plumbing for a couple thousands years before it was figured out to be harmful. It's where the plumb comes from in the word plumbing. (latin plumbum). And asbestos cement piping still exists in many street mains.
     
  24. AlbergSteve

    AlbergSteve
    Member 2.
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    Dec 11, 2017
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    Loc:
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    ...and there's still lead the water supply.

    From 2014...
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flint_water_crisis
     
  25. webby3650

    webby3650
    Master of Fire 2.
    NULL
    

    Sep 2, 2008
    8,494
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    Not at all. It’s fabulous to work with, not enough good can be said about it. Anyone who has worked with swollen/burst copper or cpvc would agree.
     

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