2017-18 Blaze King Performance Thread PART 2 (Everything BK)

[gunpowda]

I don't think smoldering wood is bad, I understand the efficiency. Should the cat drop out of active zone after being well into it once the t sat is dropped below 3 o clock? Should there be a def smoke smell?

I appreciate the input however everyone is concerned with my wood and commenting on that however this is a bk performance thread.

No I haven't tried the dollar bill on the bypass. It has been installed for only 3 weeks and I have been using it. This wasn't a cheap stove so not happy about having to test gaskets. I'm assuming I have to pull it out?

I am ok running it at 50% and above only however if it is a mechanical/product issue that doesn't allow me to get the slow and low burns that's a problem. I mentioned this earlier and everyone is focusing on wood. I came here to see if any other owners of this model are experiencing the same thing and it sounds like there could be a potential issue.

Back story:
Couldn't wait to buy my first wood stove after buying our first home. Went with an insert. Did TONS of research(on wood also)Everyone knows why I went with BK. Everyone knows what BKs cost. Dealer installed. I paid for the low and slow availability that I'm not able to get. Longest burn time is 6 hours with the cat staying in active , 8 hrs is longest burn with being able to restart the fire on coals so I can't use it during the day when going to work.

Again, love the stove - looks and how it burns 50% throttle and above(I did expect better burn times) but was hoping to have some more flexibility.

queation : is the advertised long burn time meaning cat stays active also during the duration?

 

[shoot-straight]

the stove must be out (cold) when you do the dollar bill test. let it go out. i would call the dealer. work with them on the issue. get them to check the gasket. i would ask them to check the draft as well. you bought it from them and they installed it. its on them. yes, you shouldnt need to fix something that is new, but your other option is for them to come and get it. i dont suggest you do that BTW.

you clearly keep getting your hackles up when someone even mentions your wood. that attitude isnt needed here. people here want to help you out. as others have said wet wood is the #1 problem that most have when switching to any modern stove. its also one of the easiest problems to diagnose and fix. so why not suggest you do it?

take a deep breath and just be patient. it takes time to figure out HOW to run a new stove, particularly a BK. yes, they are supposed to run for 30 hrs, end world hunger and create world peace, but every stove runs a bit differently in each house due to draft, wind, topography, tightness of house and yes, WOOD! I have had my freestanding ashford longer than almost anyone on here, and im still learning stuff.

 

[kf6hap]

Only a 6 hour burn time definitely indicates a problem-for sure. Stay here long enough and the problem will be resolved. Persistence is key. Sorry you are experiencing difficulty. You have some high powered help here.

Should there be a def smoke smell?

The hot gasses in the flue stack keep the stove interior in a negative pressure. Below a certain operating temperature the smell does come out as the "vacuum" ( negative pressure) becomes too weak to hold the smell in. A tiny amount of "smoke smell" is present at all rates of burn, at least in my set-up, not a problem though as the odor is miniscule. For my stove/installation set-up this temperature is very close to where the cat becomes inactive. You may smell "smoke smell" if you place your nose just above the stove but the real test is does it stink up the house?

 

[SuperJ]

Here are couple videos of some lower burns on my stove in another thread.
BK Ashford 25 (and Sirocco 25)

 

[Ashful]

The issue is The possibility of a mechanical problem with the bypass closing fully in the AF25. Everyone is commenting on wood.

It is likely you do have a problem with the bypass closing. Note Tegbert is having some of the same issues. However, this has nothing to do with the stove dropping out of active and the fire dying when you try to burn at any rate lower than 3. That is a separate issue, and wet wood is the culprit, 99 times out of 100. We see this literally dozens of times every year.

Not having any experience with this particular model, many of us can only address the wet wood issue, leaving the separate bypass issue to the few who have this newer model.

 

[Tegbert]

. However, this has nothing to do with the stove dropping out of active and the fire dying when you try to burn at any rate lower than 3. That is a separate issue, and wet wood is the culprit, 99 times out of 100.

I agree with you except if there is a sealing issue and draft is pulling the smoke through the bypass instead of the cat then the cat has less fuel to keep its temperatures up which in turn will cause it to go inactive sooner than it should.

When I did the test last night again with compressed logs I had the cat meter up about 3/4 of the way on a medium high setting with no visible smoke (that I could tell at night with a flashlight) but as soon as it was turned past halfway on a low to medium setting after the secondaries quit it would start smoking.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

 

[kennyp2339]

I agree with you except if there is a sealing issue and draft is pulling the smoke through the bypass instead of the cat then the cat has less fuel to keep its temperatures up which in turn will cause it to go inactive sooner than it should.

When I did the test last night again with compressed logs I had the cat meter up about 3/4 of the way on a medium high setting with no visible smoke (that I could tell at night with a flashlight) but as soon as it was turned past halfway on a low to medium setting after the secondaries quit it would start smoking.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

I know this is a brand new unit but what does the cat look like when cold? take the flame shield off and snap a pic.
There's a few extra things that can be checked when the dealer is there, obviously the gasket seal on the by-pass and door. The draft to make sure that you don't have an issue with initial low draft (the chimney is the engine that runs the stove) if low draft is the culprit then add an anchor kit to the top of your insulated liner and a 3ft section of class a pipe with a non restrictive cap. Have the dealer pull the t-stat assembly, make sure its greased, functioning correctly and calibrated to the control knob.
Not going to say anything about the firewood because you know about it already 10 times over at this point.
Personally I will be shocked if something was wrong with the stove itself but things do happen occasionally.

 

[Tegbert]

I know this is a brand new unit but what does the cat look like when cold? take the flame shield off and snap a pic.
There's a few extra things that can be checked when the dealer is there, obviously the gasket seal on the by-pass and door. The draft to make sure that you don't have an issue with initial low draft (the chimney is the engine that runs the stove) if low draft is the culprit then add an anchor kit to the top of your insulated liner and a 3ft section of class a pipe with a non restrictive cap. Have the dealer pull the t-stat assembly, make sure its greased, functioning correctly and calibrated to the control knob.
Not going to say anything about the firewood because you know about it already 10 times over at this point.
Personally I will be shocked if something was wrong with the stove itself but things do happen occasionally.

I will take a picture of the cat when I get home today.

Already have a transition anchor plate and 3ft of class a as my height just in the masonry wasn’t tall enough. I do have another 3ft section I could throw on top if need be.

Gasket seal on bypass after I originally pressed on it to get the bypass to close would still slide a note card through in some spots with no resistance. Door gasket I checked before the first fire and was good but can check again today.



Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

 

[Blazing]

I wonder how important the bypass gasket is in terms of burn time. Don't get me wrong I understand the function but mine is lacking at best when it comes to a tight fit. I'm sure my chimney would be cleaner if I replaced it but honestly I'm not pulling this thing out ever no way. I still get 24+ hour burns and I'm in the camp of smoke takes the path of least resistance. I guess with a good draft and a bad leak the smoke would choose the leak over the cat. Just talking out loud with my experience and stove.

 

[kf6hap]

I wonder how important the bypass gasket is in terms of burn time.

Hard to answer as it depends a lot on the leak size. My guess is a small amount of leakage could go unnoticed like driving with a low tire. One or two MPGs might not be missed.

 

[Blazing]

Hard to answer as it depends a lot on the leak size. My guess is a small amount of leakage could go unnoticed like driving with a low tire. One or two MPGs might not be missed.

Definitely agree. I'll be the one who tries to find a solution without pulling my insert. It won't be pulling the cat and trying to fish a new gasket in either.

 

[Tegbert]

Definitely agree. I'll be the one who tries to find a solution without pulling my insert. It won't be pulling the cat and trying to fish a new gasket in either.

All of it unbolts and comes out no need to fish it in there or remove the insert. I would have done this already but I don’t have enough gasket for the combustor right now.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

 

[BKVP]

All of it unbolts and comes out no need to fish it in there or remove the insert. I would have done this already but I don’t have enough gasket for the combustor right now.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

Don't either of you try to fix anything yet Please! PLEASE!! Both of you please contact me Monday at 509-522-2730. Between you two and me, we'll get this sorted out. I will need serial numbers for both units. They are on the Safety/EPA label. When you call, I can tell you how to reference the label.

Chris
A.K.A. BKVP

 

[Tegbert]

Ok so I tested 7 random pieces from all over my stacks and this was the highest reading the rest were all saying around 16.

And here is a cat picture for someone who asked.

Looks as though it’s sagging on the upper left side. And paper slides through it easy.

Tested door gasket and it is tight all over.

Question if anyone knows as far as support for class a transitioning from masonry. If I were to add 3ft to the top of the existing 3 ft how would you support it if I end up liking the performance of it if it comes down to it? So total of 6ft from the top of the masonry chimney.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

 

[shoot-straight]

Put simply, that cat does not look right at all.

 

[Highbeam]

Those new inserts use a weird bypass system that nobody here has much experience with. Even the old princess insert uses a bizarre cable arrangement. Please pardon the lack of help from members as we just don’t know.

Now really, a leak at the bypass is no big deal. Look at how much flow area the cat offers, it’s huge in comparison. Like way over 100 times more holes than any leak from the bypass gasket so even though we aren’t familiar with this new insert we all can be pretty sure that the bypass seal isn’t the problem.

Your burn times are too short. So your burn rate is too high. Why is that? Chris will help, please let us know how it goes.

 

[Blazing]

All of it unbolts and comes out no need to fish it in there or remove the insert. I would have done this already but I don’t have enough gasket for the combustor right now.


Lopi Rockport
Blaze King Ashford 25

Yeah not so much on mine but glad yours has the option.

 

[Poindexter]

Just fwiw @Ashful the sweet spot for my stove, my install, blah blah is 12-16% mc.

16-20% is burnable but less than ideal.

Single digit MCs are no fun ones.

 

[kennyp2339]

I normally load the princess N/S but this morning I had some 20" long pieces so I did it the old way E/W, and man I was just reminded how much it sucks lol, on a bed of hot ask it took so much longer to light off and when it did only the front piece took off, loading e/w literally takes an extra 15 - 20 min to char everything then loading n/s.

 

[kf6hap]

Further into the burn E-W loading can result in a log rolling into the glass. I agree, N-S (ends facing you) giver a much faster cat light off. More pounds of wood can be stuffed in too as the wood is cut to fit and you can't puzzle-piece smaller splits into the cracks with E-W. Finally, the glass gets cleaner during the reload charring as the wood is closer.

 

[gunpowda]

is the advertised long burn time meaning cat stays active during the entire duration?

 

[moresnow]

Hey Tegbert.

Hate to say anything but. Are you moisture checking your splits on a freshly split exposed surface? No good just pulling splits from the pile and checking the weathered surface. Likely this has been rehashed a time or 2 already but worth asking. Best of luck.

 

[Highbeam]

is the advertised long burn time meaning cat stays active during the entire duration?

Yes. Well, honestly I’ve never seen them specify but with a cat stove that’s how you measure burn time.

Even on my junk low btu pnw woods like alder and for I can get 24-30 hours with an active cat on my 12’ flue.

The guys with oak and taller stacks must really do well.

 

[gunpowda]

I don't see how I can get a 25 hour low burn with the ashford 25. I can't even get to 8 hours.

I would be content to get 12 hours which is less than half of the marketed 25 hr low burn capability.

 

[kennyp2339]

Further into the burn E-W loading can result in a log rolling into the glass. I agree, N-S (ends facing you) giver a much faster cat light off. More pounds of wood can be stuffed in too as the wood is cut to fit and you can't puzzle-piece smaller splits into the cracks with E-W. Finally, the glass gets cleaner during the reload charring as the wood is closer.

I’m not remotely worried about a log rolling into the glass, the glass is very strong and will not break, actually when loading N/S you are at a greater risk of breaking your glass if you have a longer piece that sticks out to far