Ashford 30.2 vs Princess

[Mynamesnotrick]

Hello,
I've narrowed my stove search down to either a princess or an Ashford 30.2. I've read a lot of threads and gotten some feedback, but I'm struggling to understand the specific advantages and disadvantages between these two stoves.

Location: Northern Vermont. Usually 2 weeks below 0 F, Usually 10-14 weeks around freezing.
Area heated: ~2400 sqf
Specie burned: mix of maple, cherry, and poplar. Some pine for kindling / fire starting
Volume burned: About 6 cord / year. Goal is to keep stove running all winter with few relights.
Biggest challenge: Cooking ourselves out in the shoulder season / having to light the stove more often.
Current Stove: Manchester 8362. Maintenance issues driving search. Stove is a good performer, but we're constantly tinkering with the firebox.
Heating: Stove is primary for highlighted areas except kitchen. House also has propane rinnais and a heat pump. We aren't SOL without the stove, but it's our main heat source.

My feeling from reading these forums is that the Princess is the better selling stove, and probably for a reason. While I think the Ashford could suit our needs a little better, I'm curious what people here think.
This was a quote from another thread, I'm wondering if others here agree. I asked for a follow up from this user on that thread

With good or better air seals and reasonable insulation blanket, I personally would be looking at either a BK Princess (very common 6 inch chimney pipe) or a BK King (less common 8 inch chimney pipe required) to minimize my oil bill. The Ashford 30 (we had a 30.0 in the old house) is 'prettier' than a Princess to many people, but the A30, when all is said and done, is a little bit smaller draught horse than a Princess. Think of an grass fed Clydesdale standing next to an oat fed Percheron. These are both, on a global scale, big big stove

Princess Pros:

• Princess design is more tried and true and has not seen changes as recently as the Ashford. I feel like part of the reason I'm having issues with my Manchester is that it was an early edition of the redesign for 2020 EPA standards.
• A lot of comments I've seen harp on the deeper 'belly' of firebox for the Princess. What benefit does this add beyond ash spillage? We would be getting the parlor legs if we got the princess, would that negate that benefit of thisLocation: Northern VermontArea heated: ~2400 sqf
  Specie burned: mix of maple, cherry, and poplar. Some pine for kindling / fire starting
  Volume burned: About 6 cord / year. Goal is to keep stove running all winter with few relights.
  Biggest challenge: Cooking ourselves out in the shoulder season / having to light the stove more often.
  Current Stove: Manchester 8362. Maintenance issues driving search.
• Slightly higher maximum BTUs than Ashford on high, 100 sqf higher maximum heating capacity
• Lower g/h emissions

Princess cons:

• People note the fire view is not always great. I recognize this is a sign of efficiency
• Not as pretty to my wife (and to some extent me) even with parlor legs
• Steel gets hotter faster, more likely to cook us out of the sitting room if we turn it up for a nice fire view

Ashford pros:

• I prefer the cast iron look
• Cast iron heats and cools slower, less likely to cook us out, longer lasting heat on longer burn times.
• Door is slightly larger. The majority of my wood is 18 inch log cuts that would load easier through the Ashford
  • I don't want to make my decision off this, but it is a benefit for the next season or two
• Ash drawer included
• Slightly higher EPA tested BTU on high
• Better fire view, easier to clean glass by burning

Ashford cons:

• Newer design, not as 'tried and true'
• More shallow fire box, more frequent cleanouts

 

[m37charlie]

Your house problem is that the floor plan looks long and skinny with lots of interior walls. I live in Anchorage with an early catalytic King I got in early 90s. Heating 2300 sq ft (2 floors) with 6 cords. Below freezing in daytime probably 22 weeks, at night ~28 weeks.
You shouldn’t be buying it for the door glass view. The Ashford is probably $1k more because it’s cast iron which has higher thermal mass. Since your house looks like a variation of a ranch, air flow is critical. Buy 2 Canada made heat powered (Peltier effect) fans; AND read my recent post on setting up automatic thermostatic control of the 110v fans, which are optional but you must order them to get full efficacy from either stove.
You will NOT “cook yourself out” once you’ve climbed the learning curve of how to control the air inlet, keeping door gasket tight, glancing at weather forecast before going to bed, etc. Even if you have lots of fuel in the stove and a warm front surprises you in the am: just turn the air control to “1”.

 

[Mynamesnotrick]

I’ll loo

Your house problem is that the floor plan looks long and skinny with lots of interior walls. I live in Anchorage with an early catalytic King I got in early 90s. Heating 2300 sq ft (2 floors) with 6 cords. Below freezing in daytime probably 22 weeks, at night ~28 weeks.
You shouldn’t be buying it for the door glass view. The Ashford is probably $1k more because it’s cast iron which has higher thermal mass. Since your house looks like a variation of a ranch, air flow is critical. Buy 2 Canada made heat powered (Peltier effect) fans; AND read my recent post on setting up automatic thermostatic control of the 110v fans, which are optional but you must order them to get full efficacy from either stove.
You will NOT “cook yourself out” once you’ve climbed the learning curve of how to control the air inlet, keeping door gasket tight, glancing at weather forecast before going to bed, etc. Even if you have lots of fuel in the stove and a warm front surprises you in the am: just turn the air control to “1”.

I will look into the fans, thank you.

When I say we’re concerned about getting cooked out, it’s more about when we’re in the room where the wood stove is.

I’m not buying either stove for the fire view, but it is nice to sit in front of a full flame. I’m more concerned about the steel cooking us out of the room faster than the cast iron.

In the setup we’re looking at, the price for the ashford and the princess are about the same fwiw.

 

[m37charlie]

If you’re new to BKs, you will find that as long as the door is tight, the thermostatically controlled air inlet (which, to my surprise may be a unique BK feature) offers precise control of heat output no matter how much of whatever type wood is inside.
Actually, since the mass of steel in the Princess is somewhat less than the mass ofcast iron in the Ashford (specific heats of cast iron and steel are nearly identical), the Princess will respond to turndown (in terms of outside surface temperature which is radiating according the Boltzmann radiation law σT^4 = radiation flux per unit area) quicker than the Ashford.
Have you ever operated a BK before?

 

[Mynamesnotrick]

If you’re new to BKs, you will find that as long as the door is tight, the thermostatically controlled air inlet (which, to my surprise may be a unique BK feature) offers precise control of heat output no matter how much of whatever type wood is inside.
Actually, since the mass of steel in the Princess is somewhat less than the mass cast iron (specific heats are nearly identical), the Princess will respond to turndown (in terms of outside surface temperature which is radiating according the Boltzmann radiation law σT^4 = radiation flux per unit area) quicker than the Ashford.
Have you ever operated a BK before?

I am not too concerned about mastering the heat control relative to the house as a whole.
My understanding is that to get a more traditional fire show, you need to open the thermostatic control more than you would for normal heating.
I’m fine to do that, but I expect that since the steel heats up faster, I expect we wouldn’t be able to sit in front of the stove as long with the Princess to enjoy the flames compared to the Ashford which is going to heat up more slowly.

Do you have an opinion on the Ashford vs Princess assuming they cost the same? I agree on the airflow challenge and will look into that suggestion.

 

[m37charlie]

Pros:
Ashford: higher thermal mass. Rumored clearer glass. Prettier for some people.
Princess: deeper box, fewer ash dig-outs. Much easier to weld eventually if it gets a crack.
The Princess will cool down quicker if you do a turndown to 1 in am because of sun, or going to work - assuming no pets (I include my cats in my calculations). Then, when you come home, or the sun goes down, and you throw more wood in (assuming there’s live coals inside) and turn air inlet (repeating myself, it’s thermostatically controlled) up, the Princess will reheat faster.
The beauty of BKs is that if weather permits (cool/cold enough), and you are available twice a day, or even every 16-18 hours, you’ll NEVER need to start a fire!!

 

[m37charlie]

You can always tell exactly where the air thermostat is at by turning up to 3, and then rotating back towards 1 over a couple of seconds. You’ll hear and feel a click or rattle.
Just like a wall thermostat, if the stove is on low, it will heat up to catalyst visibly glowing at the same rate whether you turn it to 3, 2.5 or even 2.1
These exact sweet spots may vary slightly in your particular installation.
With mine, it’s very sensitive between 1.8 and 2.2. Anything above that throws bigtime heat and makes my electric fan blow continuously or at least a lot. With the Inkbird controller.

 

[Highbeam]

The ash belly is hugely important for anyone seriously heating with a woodstove. I clean out the ashes only a couple of times per year. It's a huge pro. Ashford has like 3", princess 6". ALso keeps the mess in the stove better between less frquent cleanouts and a taller dam for daily reloads.

Super Big con for the ashford is the smoke leakage problem. Not every installation has the problem, certainly the minority, but for those that do there is no solution. Be sure you have a dang good chimney if you choose an ashford. Not good to you, but good to the BK manual.

If you can get the same price for each, wife highly prefers the ashford, and if you have an excellent chimney system, then I would totally get the ashford. She's a good looker.

Same cat for princess and ashford so lots of cheap cats available. These are efficient stoves, you'll have a hard time burning 6 cords in a year.

 

[Mynamesnotrick]

The ash belly is hugely important for anyone seriously heating with a woodstove. I clean out the ashes only a couple of times per year. It's a huge pro. Ashford has like 3", princess 6". ALso keeps the mess in the stove better between less frquent cleanouts and a taller dam for daily reloads.

Super Big con for the ashford is the smoke leakage problem. Not every installation has the problem, certainly the minority, but for those that do there is no solution. Be sure you have a dang good chimney if you choose an ashford. Not good to you, but good to the BK manual.

If you can get the same price for each, wife highly prefers the ashford, and if you have an excellent chimney system, then I would totally get the ashford. She's a good looker.

Same cat for princess and ashford so lots of cheap cats available. These are efficient stoves, you'll have a hard time burning 6 cords in a year.

It’s a completely straight pipe well over their minimum length, the only angle is at the back where it connects to my stove from the rear. I think it will remain straight, we’ll see though.

The only thing I wouldn’t meet is that the pipe is single wall in the room with the chimney, but the bulk of the run (~12’) is double walled.

 

[tabner]

I see people frequently point out the deeper ash belly in the princess, as a drawback to the Ashford being more frequent cool downs for ash scooping? But my Ashford has a hole in the bottom and an ashtray, so I don’t ever let the fire go out due to ash buildup. Once per week or so, with hot coals pushed to one side of the box, I use a welding glove to lift the little trap door, and scrape probably 75% of the grey ash down the hole into the solid steel ash tray. Immediately I load the stove up with wood on the hot coals and I’m off and running again, not really any different than a normal reload. A little later when the ash tray has cooled off I can slide it open and remove it, although it holds 3 or 4 clean outs worth of ashes.
I would love to try the princes, but I’m not sure the ash buildup in the Ashford is a huge problem for 24/7 burners (which I am).

 

[begreen]

The Ashford has been out for over 10 yrs. It's not a new design.