Could it be the Control Board? Inconsistencies in Pellet Feed on Englander 25PDVC-55SHP10

[Jmshuhart]

For quite awhile, I was having trouble with my Auger Motor speeds, due to having incorrect motors. Finally got it swapped out & the stove was running like a CHARM for a solid month.

Somewhere along the line, it started running hot again. This happened following a routine shutdown & cleaning. I adjusted by bottom settings from 3-4-1, down to 2-4-1... figuring I could at least slow the speed. That seemed to work & I was happy with the outcome. Had a little cold snap, below freezing a few days in a row. Worked like a charm, had my settings on 3/5 & 4/6 - all seemed appropriate given the weather. Warmed up, back to 1/3... again - all with main settings at 2-4-1.

On Monday 12/7 overnight into Tuesday (beginning of cold snap), I actually timed it out... on 3/5, the stove went 12.5 hours on a full hopper. I was pleased with that. Shut it down Tuesday late morning to clean, started it back up, finished out the cold snap & shut it down again Thursday late morning for another cleaning (working from home makes it so much more convenient). Started it back up... it seemed okay. It was cool out, but I had it on a 1 & 3 setting. I went to bed early Thursday night, and Friday morning I had to leave for work at 4am. I would say the hopper was about half empty when I filled it around 3:45am. I didn't think too much of it. Filled it & went into the office today. I got home around 3:30, and the tiny square in the bottom of the hopper was all that was left with pellets & it was out by 4pm. So today, on a 1 & 3, the pellets only lasted about 12.5 hours... the same as earlier in the week when it ran at a 3/5. That doesn't seem right??? Cleaned it, started it back up & I could just see the stove PUSHING.OUT.PELLETS. during warm up. I dropped the feed to 1, making it 1-4-1... and the stove set at 1/3 still. I'm gonna go bump it back up to 2 now that it's started (I didn't want it to over feed & put the flame out before starting up) to see how it looks, but I'm concerned.

Any thoughts on this? I'm beginning to think it could be the control board. The stove is heading into it's 10th year of use & the control board is original. I really don't think it's the auger motor acting up because.. I had it working after all my issues. And, adjusting the feed to 2 (2-4-1) really made a difference.... short term (like 2 weeks'ish).

Any insight, as always, is appreciated.

*NOTE: I do want to check to see if I'm running in the correct mode, in case something reset on me... but I totally forgot to do that before startup. So I'll hit that with the next shutdown/cleanup/restart.

 

[Ssyko]

it does sound like your programming in the pic is corrupt acting sporadic., a new board may be in order. but i would try a reset first. do the reset first then do the mode set 2 times to make sure it stays

Factory reset: unplug stove wait 5 sec. plug back in and within 3 sec push all 3 bottom buttons an hold for 5 sec release and F5 wil show in window. this just put setting back to factory. which should be 5-4-1 and mode for your stove. 25PDVC mode D / 25PDV mode C.

Mode change: unplug stove wait 5 sec. plug back in hold blower sped up and down arrows down for 5 sec then release. the mode the stove is in will be displayed in the heat range window A,B,C,D. to change press heat range up or down to desired mode. A,B are for different stoves so they should not be used.

 

[Jmshuhart]

it does sound like your programming in the pic is corrupt acting sporadic., a new board may be in order. but i would try a reset first. do the reset first then do the mode set 2 times to make sure it stays

Factory reset: unplug stove wait 5 sec. plug back in and within 3 sec push all 3 bottom buttons an hold for 5 sec release and F5 wil show in window. this just put setting back to factory. which should be 5-4-1 and mode for your stove. 25PDVC mode D / 25PDV mode C.

Mode change: unplug stove wait 5 sec. plug back in hold blower sped up and down arrows down for 5 sec then release. the mode the stove is in will be displayed in the heat range window A,B,C,D. to change press heat range up or down to desired mode. A,B are for different stoves so they should not be used.

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll try that tomorrow or Sunday, whenever the next shut down is.

 

[Jmshuhart]

Just for reference, here's an image of 1-4-1, with a 1/3... she looks a little high, huh?

 

[Ssyko]

Yeah thats quite high for 1 3. Should barley see a flame looking right at the burn plate

 

[Jmshuhart]

Yeah thats quite high for 1 3. Should barley see a flame looking right at the burn plate

Mode was correct. Went & reset the entire stove, then adjusted the mode & it's still running just as high as ever. I ended up leaving it at 1-4-1 but I don't think it makes a difference.

I'll be ordering a control board tomorrow. I can't think of any other reason for the feed to be too fast...

 

[Ssyko]

Yeah kinda looks that way, while your waiting i would add a plate to the bottom of the hopper to fine tune the feed a bit more also.

 

[Jmshuhart]

Yeah kinda looks that way, while your waiting i would add a plate to the bottom of the hopper to fine tune the feed a bit more also.

I don't think it'd be an issue, but I do need to replace the gasket around the glass on the door. But that would just cause a bad burn if it was affecting it, right? Not affect the pellet feed going too fast. It's early, my mind is swirling as I think about grabbing my credit card for a control board.

Edited to add: The burn is very clean, just like I have it turned up to a 5 or 6 instead of 1. I can see the pellets pour out of the auger way too fast.

 

[Ssyko]

Correct, nothing to do with the feed

 

[Jmshuhart]

I'm at a loss. Finally was able to replace the Circuit Board today. For the past few weeks, I've had the stove at 1-4-1, and burning a 1 & 3. It's been cold so it's been bearable temp wise.

Circuit Board replaced today. Checked for D, set stove to 3-4-1, my "normal" setting, started it up. 2 hours in, it's 27 outside, my house is sweltering. I dropped setting to 2-4-1, thought maybe the new Circuit board is just "stronger" bc it's new? I don't know. A 2 pellet feed should barely produce a flame! It should practically go out! Check these flames out.

The last thing I need to do is replace the gasket on the glass of the door, but I really don't see how that can affect it. Can anyone else think of anything else?? I'm at a total loss & am going to be screwed when the temps are in the 40s all week. Too cold to not run it, but will need to wear my swimsuit & get a drink with an umbrella to sit in the same room!

 

[Jmshuhart]

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[Ssyko]

Ok shut the stove down and let it cool off. Pull the scraper plate out and plug the holes under it on either side with some steel wool or aluminum tape or electrical plugs. Put plate back on and more air will go up through the fire. It will burn more efficiently. My old pdv and pdvc i had dialed in to a science. Heat setting 1 fan 5 bottom 3 set to 1 4 1.

you may need to add a restrictor plate like this

 

[Jmshuhart]

Ok shut the stove down and let it cool off. Pull the scraper plate out and plug the holes under it on either side with some steel wool or aluminum tape or electrical plugs. Put plate back on and more air will go up through the fire. It will burn more efficiently. My old pdv and pdvc i had dialed in to a science. Heat setting 1 fan 5 bottom 3 set to 1 4 1.
View attachment 270462
you may need to add a restrictor plate like this
View attachment 270464

I'll look into a restrictor plate - any ideas where I can find?

The stove burns clean. It's just feeding pellets too fast. Plugging the holes won't help me not go thru a hopper full of pellets in 12 hours. I need that to go back to 16. I'm working from home right now (thanks Covid) but I will be gone a minimum of 11 hours a day once I return to the office. If I need to make an errand on the way home, I'm gonna run out of pellets.

 

[Ssyko]

Any flat piece of sheet matal that’s tough to bend with your hands. Now in your first post you said you had auger issues? Are these auger motorsOEM or aftermarket? Have you timed them to make sure they are 1rpm and not 1.2-1.5? Alot of the Chinese motors are 1.2-1.5 and they screw up the pdv & pdvc feed rates.

 

[Jmshuhart]

I've been buying all my replacement parts for the last 10 years from Home Depot & Stove Parts 4 Less. It's not like I'm hitting up Amazon. I'm about to buy another OEM direct from Englander if I can to just be done with this mess. Now to decide what to do with the $300 circuit board... keep or return?

 

[Ssyko]

Have you called ESW customer service? Other than the augers rpm more than normal and no change with the new board my money is on the augers

 

[Jmshuhart]

I had an e-mail into them yesterday morning, still waiting for a response. Are you saying you think the problem could be the actual AUGER & not the motor itself?

I went ahead & went to their website & ordered a new auger. In fact, for whatever reason, they had some sort of sale on a package of (broken link removed to https://heatredefined.com/products/two-2-auger-motors-1-rpm-pu-047040x2?variant=5105919066143), with a (broken link removed to https://heatredefined.com/collections/pdvc/products/pu-047040). And on top of that, they offered 15% off when you purchased 2 items. So I added a door (broken link removed to https://heatredefined.com/collections/pdvc/products/ac-dgkc)(I have the window kit already), which ended up being free after the 15% discount.

I checked on my history. The auger motors purchased from Parts 4 Less were After Market. But the ones purchased on (broken link removed) say they are from Englander.... yet they don't specify OEM or Aftermarket. But being from Englander, I would hope it's OEM? Yet they are about $50 cheaper from HD than their website, so who knows.


Do you have any thoughts on the Control Board? My stove was installed in 2011 & had the original Control Board. Should I return it & get my $300 back, or should I just leave it on the stove? I don't know what the "life expectancy" is of a control board, but I'm also just pouring money into this thing plus the cost of burning extra pellets. I guess thanks for the stimulus that should hopefully be on it's way lol

 

[Ssyko]

No the auger drive motors. Most control boards are not returnable one installed, but you could try. Ok stay in contact with ESW they did have a shipment of augers that were not to spec. Sometimes easer to call them first thing in the am

 

[Jmshuhart]

I did some timing on the top auger this morning. Settings 1-4-1 & burning at 1&3. I'm getting the 16 second cycle, but not knowing the speed for each individual setting, I don't know what I'm looking at.

It took 3 Min & 50 Seconds to go around completely. And the auger spun approx 2 seconds & was off for approx 13 seconds. Give or take as I'm only as fast as my brain can register to click the button on my phone lol would 15 seconds vs 16 make that much of a big deal? I don't know. Bottom auger, purchased Jan or Feb of 2019 that I know is too fast... I timed that during startup mode (flames too high to see once started) & that one is 40 seconds, 1 full rotation, purchased from Home Depot by Englander (or so the website says).

 

[Ssyko]

ok this is from Mike Holton ESW head engineer: basically the heat range adjustment changes the amount of "on time" per cycle, each cycle represents one "run" + one "stop" in other words if the "on" is 2 seconds, the "off" will be 14 seconds. if the "on"is 4 seconds the "off " will be 12 seconds and so forth it always adds up to 16 seconds. the "feed amounts" are based on approximations , as you know all pellets are not the same uniform size so the "lbs per hour" are not a "set in stone" rate. FWIW the "on" time on heat range 9 in "D" mode is 4.77 seconds. the On time in C mode heat range 9 is 5.13 seconds. the other heat ranges have scaled differences between c and d as well though i cannot remember them off the top of my head "

 

[Jmshuhart]

ok this is from Mike Holton ESW head engineer: basically the heat range adjustment changes the amount of "on time" per cycle, each cycle represents one "run" + one "stop" in other words if the "on" is 2 seconds, the "off" will be 14 seconds. if the "on"is 4 seconds the "off " will be 12 seconds and so forth it always adds up to 16 seconds. the "feed amounts" are based on approximations , as you know all pellets are not the same uniform size so the "lbs per hour" are not a "set in stone" rate. FWIW the "on" time on heat range 9 in "D" mode is 4.77 seconds. the On time in C mode heat range 9 is 5.13 seconds. the other heat ranges have scaled differences between c and d as well though i cannot remember them off the top of my head "

Yup, i understand that. I'd like to figured out what the on/off ratio is for each range. With D + 9 being 5.13, and I'm running approximately a 2 (again, as closely as I can measure withmy ear & phone)... I don't know where that falls on a 1 - 9 scale but, something is off regardless if I'm running thru a full hopper on 1-4-1 & 1-3 in 12 hours. I will google this weekend

I know pellet sizes aren't universal. I burn lignetics & end of season last year, I was buying by the bag from Tractor Supply & still had the same problem. Interestingly, when the stove was running properly earlier this season, I was about half way thru a pallet of pellets. It was good, good, good, good & then bad, bad, bad, bad. It's not like it was mixed good, bad, bad, good, bad, good, good. Does thay make sense? So I don't think my pellet brand is the issue at hand. Just my mind thinking.

 

[Ssyko]

no it does not sound like it's a pellet issue. One way to find out if your augers are correct is remove them and use a test cord and plug into the wall. as you face the shaft it should turn 1 time in 60 seconds. if it doesn't then its not the right auger. beating your brain to figure out the math that the manufacturer holds onto tightly and is the only one that has that data.

 

[Jmshuhart]

Test cord? I don't know what that is I could also move it to the bottom & see if it goes 1 full rotation, correct?

 

[Ssyko]

yes bottom is always on when stove is. test cord is an old extension or lamp cord with just the plug and spade connectors on the other end

 

[Jmshuhart]

I'm going insane. Filled the stove around 10pm last night. My plan was to let it run out this morning so I could let it cool down & clean it. I woke up this morning thinking the house was a bit cooler than normal, but assumed maybe it was just colder last night & I didn't know. Temps read 70 in the same room as pellet stove (has traditionally been 78 - 85 in here). Went about my morning doing some work upstairs. Around 1030am, I came down & checked the hopper to see how much longer till we run out, since we're now at 12.5 hrs. The hopper is a little less than half full!! What is going on?! After further inspection, the burn pot is not nearly as full as it's normally been (makes sense, didn't burn as many pellets) & the flame does look pretty low. Still using my lignetics pellets, nothing changed there.

I'm going crazy. I still dont think it's burning properly as a 1 LFF shouldn't even be able to feed enough to keep a flame going. Literally... the ONLY thing that has been different... with my stove running so hot, I've been cleaning it every 1.5-2 days. About 3p yesterday would have marked 2 days since last cleaning/startup & I kept it going another 20 hours so far. So let's say 3 days instead of 2.

I'm GoInG iNsAnE wItH tHiS sToVE! Lol and I still have 2 Auger motors coming from ESW!