Dissapointed in New Blaze King King

[Squisher]

I am coming to the conclusion that for my wants and needs, this stove isn't for me.

I feel I can get better heating, going to a secondary burn type of stove or a furnace, with a strong lean towards a furnace equipped with it's own distribution ducting and, possibly, return air system to be used when the furnace is on. Will be discussing the options with a definite eye to code compliance as well as heat output. The downside to a furnace, is the need for power to run it. I have a couple generators around, but...

A while ago someone asked about the cost to run the blower fans to distribute the heat around the house. Well, without any real numbers, I will say that it is a lot cheaper to run the fans, at say 1/3 HP/250 or so watts, than to run the fans PLUS 68000 BTU of electric heat element in the furnace. The general layout around here is not very conducive to running a combined wood/electric furnace, which would incur more costs, again.

Sitting and watching the way the gasses flow around the inside of the airbox as the stove is lit, as well as when the stove is loaded over a bed of coals, I see no possibility of dragging enough air through the bypass door, to be able to keep any reasonable amount of airflow through the door, which is easily over 5 times the area of the bypass. That the bypass is in the center of the ceiling of the interior of the stove, and some distance below the height of the top of the door, exacerbates this problem. Now, you add the sloped inwards door, allowing the smoke off the near ends of a fresh load to rise straight up and out, and that leaves me really not liking this. The stink, well, simply makes me angry about the stove when I have to smell it. I have found that I cannot load the stove or relight it and then add wood, without having to endure it. At best, it's 'not as bad', as opposed to my desire, which is 'it's not a problem'.

Now, I am of the opinion that spending another whackload on the chimney, isn't going to make this go away. This I conclude, based upon the way the stove behaves when relighting, with the bypass open, and having to carefully modulate the amount the door is open, even while the flames within, are driving straight up the chimney through the bypass, circumstances which on the previous stove, essentially allowed me to leave the door wide open, while I fed in more fuel.

And yeah, insulating down here would be an improvement. as was pointed out though, it wasn't that big a deal, until I swapped out the stove for one that I thought should have been quite a case of overkill for my circumstances, if all you went by was comparative examination of the rated outputs.

I have been getting pretty much the temps I am told I should be(high 700's F), on top of the stove, as well as the burn times I am led to believe I should (10+ hours on a full load, on Maximum setting), and the heat just does not seem to be there.

All said and done, I will see in a couple days, what will end up happening to this stove, if it will be traded in, sold privately, or installed somewhere that does not require extensive modifications to existing infrastructure, in order that it meet the installation instructions and recommendations to the letter.

In any case, the heating season will be coming to a close very soon, I have a Pacific Energy (not sure the model, but not their largest) stove that I can install in the meantime, if I must, to get through the shoulder season. Or I put off giving away the old RSF (destined to become a heater in a Sauna, out in the bush near here, and re-install that.

As I posted on another Forum, I don't really care if the new stove runs on a mixture of spotted owl fat, baby seal tears, and shredded tires, as long as it throws heat, and lots of it.

Will keep y'all posted as to the discussions. Probably Wed night, or Thursday, if I am late getting home.

Cheers
Trev

Well, because the OP is still actively engaged and has repeatedly updated the thread with his progress. And despite all sorts of i think interesting side conversations(besides the unpleasantness) the topic is progressing and it would be nice to find out the eventual conclusion. I think.

 

[pen]

Someone needs to sum up where things are at and what is left to be understood, very quickly.

 

[bholler]

Someone needs to sum up where things are at and what is left to be understood, very quickly.

Pretty much we just want to see what trev finally figures out about the issue.

 

[trevj]

Nah, not really.
With some stoves that might be true, but I don't think the BKs are easy breathers by any means, from what I've read in this forum. And with the low flue temp and no liner....
Were all these dealers familiar with the BK line, or just the one that you got it from? And how long has he been handling the line? As far as the guy that won't sell cat stoves anymore, I wonder what brands he sold? I think dry wood is more necessary with cat stoves, so that could be why he has less complaints with the non-cats.
In any event, keep us updated on what happens...we have too much time invested in this thread to not see how it all ends.

Two were Blaze King Dealers, one the one I bought from, another (that I found out was a BK dealer after I had bought) was a local fellow.

The other was the dealer trying to sell me on a Summit. OK, he wasn't trying very hard, but we had a pretty informative conversation. He was the one that took back too many Cat stoves to be willing to sell them any more.

Irony for ya. I was digging around online and trying to find the specs of my pulled out stove, which I didn't, but found the manual for then RSF 65 that was in here in the beginning, and it said in the manual that because of the efficiency of the RSF, the flue temps would be lower, etc., so pretty much exactly what the BK manual says, as far as dire warnings about low temps and low draw, yet it worked pretty well with this chimney.

Yeah, won't bail on y'all. Just starting to imagine a certain someone starting to foam at the mouth every time the thread gets bumped back up, is enough to make me hold fast!

Cheers
Trev

 

[Squisher]

I believe basically to find out what other wood heating option Trevj goes with(another stove or wood furnace), how it's implemented, and whether it is enough heat for him.

 

[Marshy]

After 25 pages, I don't understand what more one expects to accomplish if it hasn't already happened.

For one, we don't know if his draft meets requirements and he was going to have that checked I believe. Two, there was a great discussion about an add on wood furnace in conjunction with his existing electric furnace that would be nice to know how he can plumb in of he goes that way...Three, I'm interested to know if he's having a creosote issue with the masonry chimney and I don't think he's been up to the roof to check yet.

 

[pen]

Sounds like there is good fodder for continuing a focused discussion.

Please keep things focused and positive.

 

[trevj]

I should have done better homework, except all that I was able to find, essentially, were posts of sunshine being blown up the collective behinds, singing the praises of Blaze King like it cured fricken cancer. It's a product. I'm not happy with mine. Spending a bunch more money and hoping that works? Not going to happen either.

So, thanks for clarifying. Rabid fanboy it is. Well, that's gotta be a relief to the Company, in the large.

I don't have to be professional. I am not representing anyone else's interests but my own. I have spoke my mind on a couple features that annoy me about the product, and have got far better sorted than I had ever considered a need for, on the pro's and con's of various types of wood stoves, and the issues that they bring to the table.

Cheers
Trev

 

[trevj]

A quick note to the mods.

Loud and clear. Thanks for your patience! Will strive to do better.

Cheers
Trev

 

[Woodyking]

Awright. some background.

I am not new to wood heat. I am living in a house my father built, in which he had originally installed a RSF-65 wood stove, and an electric Forced air furnace. I have lived with wood heat for pretty much a primary heat source for about 20 years total, in three different houses, in two Provinces, both here in BC, and in North/Central Alberta.

There is a intake duct above the wood stove location, with a thermo switch, which kicks in the fan on the furnace, to distribute heat about the house.

After my father died, the house was rented out for a period of several years. The original stove was adequately destroyed by the various renters. I began renting the house, when I was retired out of the Military. I have been in here for nearly five years now.

When I moved in here, we were able to source a nearly unused RSF-45 (35? In any case, the very small RSF steel box wood stove) and had it inspected. Despite it only taking at most about a 13 inch long stick of wood, it threw pretty good heat. Burn times were not long, but loading it up at bedtime usually resulted in enough of a fire left to start off another load of wood in the morning.

The family decided that with the rising costs of electricity, a new stove was due.

We settled for a Blaze King King model. It was the largest wood burning appliance that the store was able to provide us.

To be clear, I was looking for a plain steel box with a large capacity firebox, able to be loaded with a large qty of large firewood.

This stove looked like it would do, but so far, has been a disappointment in almost every way.

The wood I am burning is Douglas Fir, cut from standing dead trees. Dry as can be, breaks like glass, and beautiful firewood. We don't cut green wood for firewood. Green wood gets cut to go on a logging truck!

I am stuck using the chimney that is here, a 7x8 ceramic flue, in cinder blocks, rising from the basement floor level through the main floor and the upstairs, and out through the roof through the middle of the house, more or less 3 stories plus roof level clearance. I looked up the flue with a hand mirror a day or two back, and have a clean line of sight all the way to the top with no significant build-up.

My installation consists of a steel 8 to 7 tapered reducer, about a 12 inch rise from the top of that to two 45 degree bends, and a horizontal run of about another 12 inches to the thimble on the wall. Yeah, I know that the manual suggests 36 inches of rise, but that is where the thimble is. The actual straight rise is 20 inches from the top of the stove, to the mid side of the first 45.

All I have heard out of my wife since the stove was lit a few weeks back (between Christmas and New Years) is "Is there any wood in the stove?"

Here's a couple of my beefs.

First, I could really care a lot less about how long it will burn for when damped way down. I didn't buy it for low output heat, I bought it for HEAT! My hope was to be able to run at roughly half the max as a general setting, crank it down at night, up to max to provide for a warm-up or to heat when it is bloody cold out. So much for that.

I am really sick of the stench of creosote smoke in my house. When the door is opened, and wood placed on the hot coals, that first piece of wood flares and the wide shallow door pukes out wads of smoke until it is closed. Needless to say, loading the stove with MORE than one piece of wood at a time, WAS sort of what I had in mind.

I firmly believe that the guy that decided to hang the cat housing and it's hardware, down lower than the top of the door, deserves a solid shot in the gonads with a splitting maul.
Withe the front to back burn, as well as the loss of that height inside, which I believe also contributes to the puking smoke issue, wood loaded into the box tends to sit at an angle. I have a lovely new burn scar on my arm as a result of fighting with a block of firewood which wedged between that below it, and the hanging down structure. Annoying doesn't begin to cover my feelings on that. I very much feel that the stove door should be clear from it's top level, straight to the back of the stove. I really frikken HATE having to kneel down to see inside the stove to see in to load the wood in it.

But the crux of the matter, is that the stove never really seems to kick much heat at all. I have been running the stove pretty much with the adjuster cranked wide open, since I started the fire burning. Typically, I have lowered that setting down no more than about the three quarters point, and of late, less than that at night. And it's not really all that cold out right now.
One gent suggested that the reason I was not feeling the heat, was that I had not sprung for the fan units. I did not spring for the fan units, because I expected the heat to be distributed through my house by the furnace fans. This stove did not trip the thermo switch, like the smaller one was able, even with the switch adjusted, the heat output seems meager.

Now, if I reload the stove with small split sticks of wood, every few hours, it seems to heat almost OK. Not really what I bought this for. The original RSF-65 stove took a large qty of large wood. It burned from the bottom, and when you opened the door to load it, esp with the bypass pulled out, the stove was quite capable of sucking in any smoke from the sawdust or chips that might land on the door. It also allowed me to top load fresh wood pretty much any time, without having to stand around and wait in between step, as the instructions require for this one.

So, have I got a dud, is this typical, or do I have other problems? I have not yet bought a moisture meter, I do not have a manometer to check my flue draw. I don't even use paper to start the fire, let alone burn garbage, I have some fatwood, and split dry kindling off my firewood for that.
Temperatures on the catalyst have been just short of the top of the scale on the supplied gauge in the top of the stove.

My initial concerns with this stove were that the cat would be subject to damage from pitchy wood, as some of the old veteran trees that have died standing, had roots that pumped huge volumes of pitch up in to them prior to fully dying off. Well, that is no longer my number on concern. I just want some HEAT output!

So. Input would be appreciated, especially from Blaze King.
I am considering dumping this at a loss in the coming spring and seeing what else is better suited and available out there, so I would be pretty happy to hear suggestions. I need one that can pass an inspection, for the insurance purposes, else I would have simply bough a new made RSF-65 non-EPA stove and quietly installed it myself and got on with my life.

I would very much like to hear suggestions as to what other stoves there are out there that might better suit my needs. I am not after something to look pretty in the parlour. I am after a heating appliance, with which to heat my house. Ugly, is OK! Heat! I want to actually have to set the temperature on the stove, not simply run it flat out as a supplement to my furnace.

Thanks for your consideration.

Cheers
Trev

Wow. Sorry it's not working for you. I have the smaller princess and it heats my 2800sqft home. My guess it's your wood. My house it tight snd crap wood cotton wood still heats the house but only 12 hr burn times. With Oak 12-14% MOISTURE It's 24HR burns. I am baffled at your troubles?

 

[trevj]

Wow. Sorry it's not working for you. I have the smaller princess and it heats my 2800sqft home. My guess it's your wood. My house it tight snd crap wood cotton wood still heats the house but only 12 hr burn times. With Oak 12-14% MOISTURE It's 24HR burns. I am baffled at your troubles?

Me too. Moisture meter says my wood is OK, if nothing special. All Douglas Fir, from standing dead. No hardwood to burn around here worth speaking of.

Burn characteristics seem to be pretty close to what is expected, based on temperature measuring. Burns fully, box is clean when burnt to cold.

Will be talking face to face with my dealer tomorrow.

Glad yours is working out. Between the heat output, which seems lackluster, and the code violations which I am now aware, my install is neither performing to my satisfaction, nor is it like to, and will not pass an inspection, and the option of moving it up into the living space, isn't an option, so I am exploring what I may be able to make work with the chimney I have, as opposed to throwing a pile more money at a stove that has several characteristics which are becoming more and more rankling, but might have been acceptable if the output was there.

Cheers
Trev

 

[georgepds]

Just curious.. what did you do with the old stove?

If you were happy with it why not put it back in ?

 

[jeff_t]

Did you ever find a manometer?

I tried to keep up, but it got hard to sort out the bs from what was interesting.

 

[begreen]

Closing thread. This thread has wandered off into the marshes. There is no more helpful info here.

trevj, you are welcome to post again with your final outcome. Hope it works out well.