Fine Tuning BioMass

Tennman Posted By Tennman, Dec 15, 2011 at 6:31 PM

  1. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    First of all you need to adjust the circ. launch temp. it shouldn't be circulating at 140. It will burn much better if you let it get to 160 or a little higher before the circ kicks on.
     
  2. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    Second the tank IS a large heat sink. That's the whole idea, It needs to be insulated very well or it will be wasting your extra heat.
     
  3. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Thanks for the replies everyone, but I'm not quite sure if you guys fully understood what I was asking. My thermal storage tank is insulated very well, and holds temperature well. My problem is, when it gets over 170, the boiler circulator won't turn back off until it drops below that. I have my pump circ temp at 170.

    So for example, boiler heats water up to 180 degrees in the thermal storage tank. Boiler runs out of fuel, or goes to idle, but keeps circulating because the temp of the water is above 170 degrees. The boiler is just sucking the heat back out of the tank until it goes down to 170. How do I keep it from doing that?

    Also, when I'm burning but the boiler is under any type of load, it won't get much hotter than 170 without the pump cycling on and off a lot. Is this normal? Or should the boiler be having an easy time of getting up to 180-190 per se?
     
  4. 91LMS

    91LMS
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    Oct 20, 2011
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    what is your flow rate to storage? may need to slow your pump down or use a smaller pump at that. my grunfoos 15-58 on low is pumping (roughly 5 gpm) constant supply temps of 170+ with storage returning 100-120 deg water. my danfoss is mixing that to 145ish. once I reach 140 on the bottom of the tank I can bump my pump to the second speed (10 gpm) and supply temps stay consistant and increase as I approach a full charge

    those flow rates are not taking the cv of the danfoss into account so its not completely accurate
     
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  5. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Yeah I slowed the flow rate down a bit and that seems to help it stay up a little warmer but i feel like there is still room for improvement.

    But that still doesn't solve the issue of the boiler circulator not turning off till the tank gets back down to 170.....
     
  6. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Side question, still really want to know about the circulator issue, but does anyone get a lot of creosote building up in the upper chamber? If so, any tips on cleaning it out?
     
  7. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    Okay ericO, I misunderstood what you was asking. I put my boiler on a timer so it shuts off at the end of a burn, that turns the circ off. Some guys put a sensor in the chimney so when it drops below a certain temp the boiler and circ shut off. More than one way to skin a cat. I also Run a 15-58 on low. I rarely turn it up to medium, but I don't usually try to heat the whole storage to 190 either. a fancier variable speed loading valve could also solve the issue of pump turning on and off, but is really not necessary.
     
  8. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    Creosote in the upper chamber is perfectly normal. No need to clean it off. It will flake off and burn up and more will form. The wood only smolders in the top chamber. Now if you have it in the lower chamber or tubes, that's a different story.
     
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  9. 91LMS

    91LMS
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    I have my min boiler temp set at 160 and don't fire for a complete charge on storage. once my fire is out and return temps cool the boiler the circ is turned off but fans stay on. 160 on the bottom of 1000 gallons of storage keeps my radiant happy for quite a while.
     
  10. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Thanks you guys for the info! Woodmaster, just to make sure I understand what you are saying, you have a timer that shuts off the controller, and essentially the whole boiler correct? What kind of timer? Just like one that you plug into or something? I like the idea of the temp switch in the exhaust. When the temp drops, just have it cut power to the circ, that makes a lot of sense.

    91LMS, thanks for your replies as well. Yeh I have baseboard heat system so I like the water a little warmer.

    Thanks you guys!
     
  11. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    yes, I just have a simple timer that plugs in.
     
  12. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Does anyone know the location of the temperature probe on the biomass 40? Is it easy to access?
     
  13. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    You have to take the top cover off and its clamped on towards the left center.
    edit : At least that's where it is on the 60
     
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  14. Tennman

    Tennman
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    Mar 4, 2009
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    The new door seal design is a huge improvement over the old silicone extrusion. The material is now fiberglass fiber core with a silicone sheath outer wrap. Enormous improvement in sealing. If you've not replaced or upgraded to this new seal, I highly recommend it for the current season. If you order (2) that quantity gets you material for 2 doors, not a spare sent. If you want a spare set, like I thot I was ordering, order (4). Everyone should also have a spare door microswitch. Happy holidays.
     
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  15. Trex83

    Trex83
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    Done! Yes its much better. My dad had to re-adjust the door a little bit and we also put new refractories in the secondary chamber.
    Happy burning for everyone.
    Trex83
     
  16. Tennman

    Tennman
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    The following instructions are how I installed the new door seals.

    The new BioMass door seal consists of two parts; 1) a fiberglass woven wick with adhesive backing, and 2) a silicone sheath covered fiberglass rope seal.

    STEP 1:
    The flat woven fiberglass "wick" is the insulator that lays in the base of the seal channel. It provides some thermal insulation and maybe abrasion protection between the door face plate and the seal. Start at a corner and pull off the sticky backing on the wick as you run it around the seal channel to keep the wick stuck in place. Cut the excess when you get all the way around and butt into where you started. You have to be careful turning the corners to avoid a big wrinkle, but it can be done. When done and looking at door inside face, you should see that nice white woven fiberglass covering the bottom face of the seal channel.

    STEP 2:
    The door seal material comes in about a 3' section per door about 1"-1.25" in diameter. The core of the seal is like fiberglass rope with an outer sheath is an orange silicone layer probably 1/32"-1/16" thick. I think I did the curved section of the door first. I trimmed the length maybe 1" long (maybe longer) so the ends were crammed/compressed into the seal channel and well compressed at both ends. Then I did the bottom straight section again cutting long so the ends are in compression butting into the curved section seal. Repeat on the lower door.

    STEP 3:
    Adjust door hinges if the handles won't lock. I didn't have to adjust my hinges, but they were pretty tight at first. It didn't take long for them to compress and be really nice and tight when I close the handle. They're perfect now.

    Light years better than the silicone extrusion. Even if it doesn't last as long, it works far better and is easy to replace. Actually easier to install than the old extrusion design. Happy Burning!
     
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  17. ryooper

    ryooper
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    Dec 18, 2013
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    Got my 40 hooked up 2 weeks ago storage not hooked in yet runs great still tweaking a little bit only issue I have is I get condensate in chimney block with clay tile leaves big mess anyone else have this problem also pipe to chimney is coragated.
     
  18. dpsfireman

    dpsfireman
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    Feb 26, 2011
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    First season I used mine it was in an outside masonary chimney. I had so much condensate I was concerned about it damaging the chimney because it was freezing at the botton. I lined it with stainless steel and no more condensate plus it worked better because it heated up more quickly.
     
  19. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    Probably need to install a insulated liner. The exhaust leaving these isn't very hot. especially when the tubes are clean. Then without storage it probably goes into idle sometimes and that allows the chimney to cool off if it ever gets warm in the first place.
     
  20. ryooper

    ryooper
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    Dec 18, 2013
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    Woodsmaster, I have a insulated pipe to go from boiler to chimney the installer ended up putting single wall galvanized pipe in would it help to put insulated in? I can touch the pipe at any given time.
     
  21. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    The insulated would help get a little more heat to the chimney but probably not enough to make much difference. . You need a insulated liner installed in the masonry chimney.
     
  22. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Is the galvanized pipe the one coming from the boiler to the chimney ? On my system, I have a triple wall stove pipe, but couldn't find a triple walled tee fitting other than online and for way to much money, so I just bought a black stove tee. I wrapped some unfaced fiberglass insulation around it, and I think that really helped keep the temp up.
     
  23. EricO

    EricO
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    Aug 26, 2014
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    Does anyone have experience in the life span of the blower fan? I'm just curios because I think I'd like to get a back up just in case.

    My fan will make bad noises every once and a while from creosote build up if I leave the bypass open for to long. I'm thinking this noise as well as the fact that it probably throws the fan out of balance isn't good for the life span.

    I need to clean it off but does anyone know where to get a backup? I tried looking up the part number but its in polish haha
     
  24. ElkRiverFJ

    ElkRiverFJ
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    Aug 30, 2012
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    I think this is what you are looking for?:
    http://www.newhorizonstore.com/Products/271-blower-motor-biomass.aspx
     
  25. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster
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    Make sure the nuts are tight on it. I thought mine was going bad, but it was just vibrating from being loose
     

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