First time Papa Bear owner

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Gearhead36

New Member
Jan 16, 2014
20
South Mississippi
Good evening all. I typically lurk around a forum and size it up before joining, but it didn't take long to realize this can only be a good thing. It doesn't really get too cold for very long in S Mississippi, but when it does it's nice to have a little heat when turning wrenches in my shop.

My old suburban type stove in my shop finally burnt the top out, and I happened upon a Papa Bear for sale in nearby New Orleans. It was a little worse than advertised, as it had gone underwater and she did not volunteer this info. Given the weight for shipping, the difficulty of finding one, and the fact that I really wanted one, I negotiated a deal. All it needs is bricks removed to clean up some heavy rust scale and new pins in the door. Previous owner had cut the pins when they froze up. Looks like I will only need to replace 8-10 bricks as it really looks good inside. Some may wonder why remove the bricks, but with heavy scaling behind the brick I am worried about putting heat to them and causing them to crack.

Everything is there. It is an early design with angle iron legs, flat door top, and a double bent handle. Air caps are aluminum. I am taking pics of the process, and as soon as I figure out that part of the forum I'll post some for all to see. Oddly enough, this is like building a car, one of the fun parts of the process is making it come together. I'm sure the firing will be fun too!

Cheers, and thanks for all the information I have read about already!

Jim
 
I have seen stoves left out side and gone through house fires, not started from the stove. :) Take the brick out and get it sandblasted. inside and out. then you can start the process. I have many hinge pins but you should be able to go to a local store and buy a 3/8 Rivet and it should work. You can get all the help and more than you may want lol here. These are great people here willing to help. Oh yeah welcome to the forum sorry about that.
 
I have seen stoves left out side and gone through house fires, not started from the stove. :) Take the brick out and get it sandblasted. inside and out. then you can start the process. I have many hinge pins but you should be able to go to a local store and buy a 3/8 Rivet and it should work. You can get all the help and more than you may want lol here. These are great people here willing to help. Oh yeah welcome to the forum sorry about that.

Thanks for the reply CamFan. I measured the pins and they are 5/16, not 3/8. I found this rather odd since all I see offered are 3/8. Should I just drill it out or attempt to find pins? No sense drilling if I don't have to. Also, I need a new spring handle, as the old one got stretched pretty well. Where can I find a suitable replacement? Lastly, I thought I read where the Bear family stoves were not intended to have door gaskets, however I've seen a few pics that had them either on the stove or the door. My current one has remnants of a gasket on the door. Do I need one?
Thanks in advance for any help!

Jim
 
Welcome Gearhead, "No need for the door gasket"! Spring handle can be found at woodmans stove supplies, and Cam Fan I'm sure can hook you up with hinge pins:) You got a great stove! Good luck
 
Hi Jim, If you can't find solid rivets for pins, they are easy to make with a 3/8 bolt (or whatever size you need) with 1 3/4" of un-threaded shank from head to threads. I grind the points off the head and chuck the bolt in a slow running drill and form the head with both the drill and grinding wheel on a bench grinder running. Forms a nice round head just like original rivet. Then cut the threads off and you have a pin. Keep it greased or anti-seize on it. Same as the draft cap threads. Clean them as good as you can with a wire brush so rough threads don't wear the cap threads. Keep anti-seize or grease on them as well. You can grease and clean the threads through the door opening on the back behind cap.
I've wire wheeled some bad doors that came up good.
Once you get the rust taken care of, you'll find the bricks that are reused and even new ones will take a while to dry out. It won't put out much heat while evaporating moisture from the bricks for the first fire or so. Even stove bricks stored for years absorb moisture from the atmosphere.
 
We only used 3/8 pins. some places used bigger for some models. we did not even if it was called for. Drilling the hinges could be done but not as easy as in a drill press. the handles were to fit a 1/2" rod. Any stove being made today that uses a spring handle on a 1/2" rod would work unless you want original. Coaly may know where you can buy new ones. I have some but they are not 1st line handles anymore.

Ok about the gasket. These stoves were classified as airtight. But not to todays standards. If you want to keep it original then probably no gasket. If original is not the goal then here is a test. Cut a strip of cardboard that will fit in the channel on the stove. put the strip in the channel at the side with the hinges if it is a double door do both sides. If you can shut the door and lock it as normal you can add a gasket and it will work. any good stove store should have the gasket. it was 5/8 flat gasket.

Do you need one? not if when you shut it down and it is still burning in the morning.
 
image.jpg image.jpg Excellent news. A wealth of information here. Makes this project more fun than work! Hopefully I'll get the brick out today, then after a little chipping on the heavy stuff I'll blast and repaint it.

Roger on the hinge pins. I have access to a lathe to speed the process up. Might try to fix the spring handle, if not I'll get a new one. I've already planned to build a baffle plate for the inside.

I'll try to attach a few pics. I would appreciate any info that could be given on the data. If there is info anywhere else on the stove let me know please.
 
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The M / P is for Mama and Papa (use same door) R = right hand swing.
The US patent Des. 237,798 was given to the first steel plate stove;
So your door was made after November 25 1975. Handle bends, springs, and draft cap design changed through the years and helps determine build dates.

http://www.google.com/patents?id=ed...ombination heating and cooking stove"&f=false

Door swing was due to the first idea of putting the stove across the hearth in front of the blocked off fireplace. The stove didn't stick out into the room much, and had a side outlet vent. You would want the door to swing towards the hearth.

Before UL tags; some stove markings were stamped on rear by some builders or written in weld on the bottom. They normally included state initials. Sometimes the welder's as well. These are a stove number, not serial.

Hand filing pins on a lathe does good too.
When you want to add pictures in the text, just put the curser where you want the picture when you click thumbnail, and that's where it puts it. You did good!

Spring handles are available in the same style as the later plated springs in nickel or brass from Woodman's. 3 1/2'" long, 1/2" shank. RH-LDN was the nickel plated stock number. Brass plated springs were used with later stove options with arched top doors.

They get stretched when tried to remove incorrectly by twisting the entire spring. Turning the spring on the handle counterclockwise tightens the coils on the handle. Vice grips or pliers on the very last coil only, at end of spring will unwind by loosening the spring windings on the handle and remove easily. To install, turn clockwise and push by hand with no tools.
 
Thanks Coaly! Caps are aluminum and handle has two 90 bends. Bricks are out and a good ole needle gun got the scale out. Blasting it today and paint tomorrow. I'm using some grill paint from Lowes rated at 1000 degrees. That good enough? If so I would like to hear your paint cure process. Here are a few more pics of today.

Thanks!
Jim

image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg
 
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Just fire it up outside with a couple pieces of pipe to burn the stink off outdoors.
Here we have to light a small fire to get the metal warm enough to paint in January, dig a spot out in the driveway to set it out of the way, and keep it hot enough to stay warm until it stops smoking off the paint. Much easier in July.
 
Looking nice Gearhead, when I did my Fisher, I also took a palm sander and some 80 grit to smooth it more, I had a couple of good size rust spots that needed some attention. It'll be nice when your done:cool:
 
Blasted and treated, ready for paint. Heavy pitting in the top, that's not going away, will give it a little more character. Tomorrow, paint, then a nice little burn in during the games. I'm going to use old brick for now, then replace bad ones later. Should be much easier with all that rust cleaned up from behind them. I'll put the whole ones on the bottom and cracked ones in easy to get places near the front. Not sure if I'm more excited about heating the shop or cooking on it out there....lol.

Thanks for all the advice folks!

Jim

image.jpg
 
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I cook on mine all the time, Chicken stew in the making;), Grandma has been cooking away now for about 30 years.
 

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Looks Very nice!:cool: Good for 50 more years!

Thanks WeldrDave, wish I'd have learned about these stoves years ago. Should heat my shop well, and there are less places for mice to hide now. Was muscling the thing around for 3 days until I drug the old bike lift out. Works well! I'll post pics of smoke tomorrow.

image.jpg
 
Nice Jim. Those knobs are hard on the eyes ! Give them a spray and wipe the edges with spirits or thinner and they'll look like this;

Alum. Brushed and Polished.JPG Satin on left , polished on right.
I'm a cap junkie.
 
Nice Jim. Those knobs are hard on the eyes ! Give them a spray and wipe the edges with spirits or thinner and they'll look like this;

View attachment 124613 Satin on left , polished on right.
I'm a cap junkie.

Coaly I saw that in an earlier post. I was wondering how you got that look. They are pitted in a pretty ugly way, went under saltwater from Katrina. I didn't like how they turned out when I sprayed them but it was the only rattle can I had..lol, kinda takes away from the rest of the stove. I'll give that a try before I fire it in the morning, then post a pic. If I'm unsuccessful, any ideas where I can find a better set?

Thanks for the tip!
 
I noticed the pitting. It shows in your pic blown up.
Not cheap, here's the place with the original patterns;
http://www.barrcasting.com/draft.html

The Coal Bear had the bottom primary caps painted and unpainted secondary top. So it's not unheard of.

Coal Bear Painted 1.JPG
 
I noticed the pitting. It shows in your pic blown up.
Not cheap, here's the place with the original patterns;
http://www.barrcasting.com/draft.html

The Coal Bear had the bottom primary caps painted and unpainted secondary top. So it's not unheard of.

View attachment 124617
Saw Barr casting doing some research. Agreed, not cheap. Not much chance of seeing used ones down south here. Might just make these work and see if anything shows up, never know! Thought about blasting then filling pits with JB Weld and smoothing. Threads are still ok, might be worth a go.
 
Gearhead, When I did my baby door, I spray painted the door and air damper with the high heat paint, "then" Highlighted the edges of the trees and Fisher name with Chrome aluminum industrial paint. Good for high heat applications, can find it at just about any hardware store. Mine came from ACE hardware.
 

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That looks nice Dave. I just finished redoing my caps. Took it from slutty to classy. Probably not as nice as the ones Coaly posted but they were pretty rough. Heck it's not a classic if it doesn't have some patina!

I have a question, I had to take my plasma cutter and zip the tabs off the inside in order to remove the brick. Seeing as how they only retained every other brick, is there a crucial need to install new tabs? If so I'd prefer to do it before it gets too much smoke on the metal.

Thanks for all the info,

Jim

image.jpg
 
Well, the tabs are there obviously hold the bricks in place. Coaly has the sequence for them to got back in. For future reference, if you pulled the bottom out first, then the sides, then the back, they should have came out. I will say, Mine were so bad on one stove I have, I had to break them out. If I were you, I would tack weld some in if you can, actually they should have held the corners of two. If you cant, the bottom should hold them in. There are very few people in the USA, "that I know of" that has the knowledge of Fisher stuff than Coaly or Camfan. Becareful, they become addicting!!!….. I have 5…. Your Papa looks super,:cool: That thing will blast heat!
 
Never heard of a slutty Papa, but he sure looks more manly.
Never tried a stove without brick retainers. They are probably going to tilt inwards getting ash behind them, until they break off when loading. Normally removing bottom bricks allows bottom to be pulled out and brick slips out from under clips.
I'll fix pic, they burn better that way.
 
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