For all you Englander guys

[wkpoor]

This trailer has been at the local Southerlands for yrs and I never paid any attention before. And yep they had a selection in the store. Actually helped a guy who was looking to buy a new wood stove. Same as I've told you guys before. Average Jo knows nothing about EPA technology in wood stoves. 1st thing he said was why are these stoves so small and will they really heat my house. He currently heats with a smoke monster and they are typically much larger than what currently offered on the market today. I gave him a crash course in EPA stoveology and did recommend the Englander brand. I looked it over while I was there. I like what I see. I wish though they would use heavier steel in both the body and the top. I like the big radius in the door opening to help reduce cracking. However I prefer the US stove design of incorporating the secondaries into a heavy steel baffle instead of the thin steel tubes in the NC30. Not sure how susceptible they would be to mechanical damage. I have had discussions about the white board being used in most stoves for baffle over cast iron ones. It has been suggested its done for cost. Don't know but that looks like another service item down the road.

 

[BrotherBart]

I had my 30-NC shipped to me from a Sutherland's store in Boulder, CO. As to the boards, my six season old ones look like new. If I can be careful and not break the glass I can be careful and not break the boards. And I never want another heavy steel baffle as long as I live. I had to get the local iron works to make me a replacement for my old stove every four or five years because of deterioration and warping.

 

[wkpoor]

I to wouldn't want a steel baffle. I was thinking cast iron. As for warping I'm concerned about the surface the door seals against being of such thin steel. More so since the Magnolia did that and its built very similar.

 

[BrotherBart]

Us Englander owners will try to muddle through the winter somehow. :lol: And the next and the next and...

A cast iron baffle would be nuts. Zero insulating value for keeping firebox temps in the range needed for re-burn. The reason cast iron stove makers don't use them. That and the fact that they would crack like crazy. Jotul has one in the F3 but the part that faces the fire is steel bolted to it. Jotul had cast baffles in some early re-burn stove and changed to ceramic board.

 

[wkpoor]

I asked Steve about this and he said in his testing a ceramic board didn't improve secondary action and was worried they would get damaged when cleaning above the baffle. I generally take the notion if everyone is doing it there must be something to it even if it were just cost. Guess I'll keep an eye on my cast iron to see how long it lasts. I too have had fits with other stoves and steel baffles. They don't do extreme heat cycling very well.

 

[precaud]

However I prefer the US stove design of incorporating the secondaries into a heavy steel baffle instead of the thin steel tubes in the NC30. Not sure how susceptible they would be to mechanical damage. I have had discussions about the white board being used in most stoves for baffle over cast iron ones. It has been suggested its done for cost. Don't know but that looks like another service item down the road.

I'll take stainless steel tubes and ceramic baffle over a heavy steel baffle ANY DAY, for performance, ease of repair, and longevity. No offense, but when that mild steel runner cracks that stove will be worth its weight in scrap.

 

[Dix]

Really? I consider the baffle in the PE like a well seasoned skillet. The more it's used & seasoned, the better it gets.

 

[precaud]

Dixie, the PE baffle is stainless steel, not mild steel.

 

[sebring]

I was clumsy and gouged 2 small places on the fiberboard in my englander. I took a small dab of rutland furnace cement that comes in a tube and filled in thoes areas. So far they are still there, and look like they will stay. Fragile yes, fixable easy..

 

[yooperdave]

I chose the nc-13 for it's simple design and effectiveness. I use it to heat less than 1000 sq. ft. and am quite pleased. Based my decision on the recommendations of "stove salesmen" and also by the members of this forum.
I am glad to hear that the ceramic board lasts for years (BB), as I was a bit concerned about it initially.
About the only thing I would change on it would be more primary air (for quicker start-ups).
If and when i get around to making the cottage larger (basement) and a year-round place, I'll probably go with the 30, or else use my old non-epa for the basement.

 

[precaud]

I was clumsy and gouged 2 small places on the fiberboard in my englander. I took a small dab of rutland furnace cement that comes in a tube and filled in thoes areas. So far they are still there, and look like they will stay. Fragile yes, fixable easy..

Next time you pull the baffle out, flip it so the gouges are on top so the repair can't fall out...

 

[wkpoor]

A cast iron baffle would be nuts. Zero insulating value for keeping firebox temps in the range needed for re-burn. The reason cast iron stove makers don’t use them. That and the fact that they would crack like crazy. Jotul has one in the F3 but the part that faces the fire is steel bolted to it. Jotul had cast baffles in some early re-burn stove and changed to ceramic board.

Well I can tell you the secondaries come in at the same temp as the Mag did and from what I read here is about where most do and that is 400 degree stove top. With good dry wood maybe a bit sooner. Not saying the board doesn't improve performance that I can't see, just saying I can't see it. I run this stove harder than probably most with top temps always in the 750 range. If that baffle is going to crack I'll geter done.

 

[precaud]

Well I can tell you the secondaries come in at the same temp as the Mag did and from what I read here is about where most do and that is 400 degree stove top.

Yeah, but that's like saying ice cubes freeze at the same temp no matter what fridge you put the trays in. It's all about how quickly it comes up to high temp where the baffle and secondary outlets are. And a light-weight ceramic baffle/stainless burn tube system will come up to operating temperature MUCH quicker than a comparatively massive steel rail will. No contest. This is a situation where all that mass buys you nothing. With a top-down fire, the lighter ceramic/stainless system can start burning cleanly in a matter of seconds.

Get the thermal mass out of the firebox and into the area surrounding your stove, where it will do you some good.

 

[backpack09]

My cast iron Morso uses a cast baffle over the burn tubes, but they also put a piece of insulation over the baffle to keep the firebox hot.... and the cast baffles warps just like the plate steel.

 

[leeave96]

My Englander is a quality heat BOMB! I can't imagine wearing out this stove. If I replace a baffle or secondary tube - big deal. As my body ages, the easier and lighter replacement components is better on the back.

The only baffle system that intrigues me are the ones on the PE stoves. From what I have read, they are designed to inject the secondary air with repect to the N/S orientation. I'd like to see one up close to see how it compares to the Englander 30.

Bill

 

[BrotherBart]

The only baffle system that intrigues me are the ones on the PE stoves. From what I have read, they are designed to inject the secondary air with repect to the N/S orientation. I'd like to see one up close to see how it compares to the Englander 30.

Bill

Here it is in all its glory.

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewreply/980025/

 

[oldspark]

They aren't all that much different (in function) are they?