Going to make the jump to a Stove, need some final q's answered

[thundercracker]

Hi
I've been lurking for a while now, a ton of great info here, thanks to everyone.

i have a 2100 sq. ft. 2-story colonial with only 985 sq. ft on the first floor and the rest upstairs. decently open concept on the first floor, and i'm really only looking to heat the first floor with the pellet insert into my existing fireplace.

i have 2 zone(upstairs/downstairs) baseboard hot water heaters, oil furnace.

Q#1- what do i have to do to make sure my pipes don't freeze on the first floor? should i run the heat on the fist floor 1/week, 1/mth, never while i'm burning? i hope to keep the 1st floor at 70 during the days, 65 or 68 at night. i will keep my upstairs at 65-68 using the oil to heat the baseboards.

Q#2 - anyone care to guess how much oil i might save? we moved into the house last january '14, and had an oil delivery at least each month at the cost of about $575/mth. I'm hoping that this stove will eliminate 2 oil fill ups, is that wishful thinking, given that i will still use oil to heat the 2nd floor?

Q3 - anyone have any good solutions on gates or surrounds, to keep my little kids away from the stove? (aside from yelling at them) i have a 3 yr old that's particular to jumping off things. the 5 yr old is pretty cautious. i heard about some type of surround that screws intot he fireplace mantle, but haven't seen any pics.

Q4 do you all run a humidifier as you burn, if so, how much, all day, a couple hours/day?


Q5 - looking at a harmon p35i vs. a quadfire classic bay. both are around the same price, i guess both are the same company. should i look at any enviro's? or anything else? right now i'm looking at about $3,000 for the stove (harmon or quadrfire) plus an additional $1000-1100 for the chimneyliner and install.


unrelated to stoves Question- i have an 1997 on demand water system for my hot water. does anyone know if this is inefficient for oil furnaces? should i consider a storage tank-style water heater, would that save some oil? basically, when i need hot water, i think the furnace fires up to heat the water.

thanks again everyone

 

[JohnD]

Hi
I've been lurking for a while now, a ton of great info here, thanks to everyone.

i have a 2100 sq. ft. 2-story colonial with only 985 sq. ft on the first floor and the rest upstairs. decently open concept on the first floor, and i'm really only looking to heat the first floor with the pellet insert into my existing fireplace.

i have 2 zone(upstairs/downstairs) baseboard hot water heaters, oil furnace.

Q#1- what do i have to do to make sure my pipes don't freeze on the first floor? should i run the heat on the fist floor 1/week, 1/mth, never while i'm burning? i hope to keep the 1st floor at 70 during the days, 65 or 68 at night. i will keep my upstairs at 65-68 using the oil to heat the baseboards.

Q#2 - anyone care to guess how much oil i might save? we moved into the house last january '14, and had an oil delivery at least each month at the cost of about $575/mth. I'm hoping that this stove will eliminate 2 oil fill ups, is that wishful thinking, given that i will still use oil to heat the 2nd floor?

Q3 - anyone have any good solutions on gates or surrounds, to keep my little kids away from the stove? (aside from yelling at them) i have a 3 yr old that's particular to jumping off things. the 5 yr old is pretty cautious. i heard about some type of surround that screws intot he fireplace mantle, but haven't seen any pics.

Q4 do you all run a humidifier as you burn, if so, how much, all day, a couple hours/day?


Q5 - looking at a harmon p35i vs. a quadfire classic bay. both are around the same price, i guess both are the same company. should i look at any enviro's? or anything else? right now i'm looking at about $3,000 for the stove (harmon or quadrfire) plus an additional $1000-1100 for the chimneyliner and install.


unrelated to stoves Question- i have an 1997 on demand water system for my hot water. does anyone know if this is inefficient for oil furnaces? should i consider a storage tank-style water heater, would that save some oil? basically, when i need hot water, i think the furnace fires up to heat the water.

thanks again everyone

Sounds like you moved into my house.... I don't do anything for the pipes. If you are burning to that temp 24/7, the pipes will be fine.
I went from $5000 to $2800 in oil the first year we used the pellet stove and the winter with the stove was way worse weather wise and much colder. Cost of the stove, installation and 5 tons of pellets was cheaper than what we spent in oil the first year. Stove paid for itself by the middle of the second winter.
I don't run a humidifier... You can if you want, depends on your preference.
I have a Quadrafire CB1200.... I love it! It's a beast! Puts out great heat and easy to use... I can't compare it to the Harmon.....never had a Harmon.
I have the same water system... It's horribly inefficient.... I would strongly recommend a storage tank....
Hope this helps...

 

[apandori]

Could go electric on demand as well for hot water. People seem to like those.

 

[TimfromMA]

Q#1- what do i have to do to make sure my pipes don't freeze on the first floor? should i run the heat on the fist floor 1/week, 1/mth, never while i'm burning? i hope to keep the 1st floor at 70 during the days, 65 or 68 at night. i will keep my upstairs at 65-68 using the oil to heat the baseboards.

If your pellet stove is on the first floor, that should be sufficient. Keep all your oil thermostats turned to 50 so that if the stove ever goes out, the oil furnace will kick in.

Q#2 - anyone care to guess how much oil i might save? we moved into the house last january '14, and had an oil delivery at least each month at the cost of about $575/mth. I'm hoping that this stove will eliminate 2 oil fill ups, is that wishful thinking, given that i will still use oil to heat the 2nd floor?

It's just a guess, but I think you'll save anywhere from 30% - 50%. I save about 40% but my stove is upstairs and keeps my 1600sqft upper level nice and toasty.

Q3 - anyone have any good solutions on gates or surrounds, to keep my little kids away from the stove? (aside from yelling at them) i have a 3 yr old that's particular to jumping off things. the 5 yr old is pretty cautious. i heard about some type of surround that screws intot he fireplace mantle, but haven't seen any pics.

We don't have small children but my brother in law built a nice wooden barrier using what looks like staircase bannisters for their 1 year old twins.

Q4 do you all run a humidifier as you burn, if so, how much, all day, a couple hours/day?

I don't use one.

Q5 - looking at a harmon p35i vs. a quadfire classic bay. both are around the same price, i guess both are the same company. should i look at any enviro's? or anything else? right now i'm looking at about $3,000 for the stove (harmon or quadrfire) plus an additional $1000-1100 for the chimneyliner and install.

My stove is a St. Croix and have no experience with these other stoves.

 

[xSpecBx]

I had a similar thought as to trying to keep small children and animals away from the stove. I was looking at a safety gate. Link to the one I was looking at is below.

http://www.amazon.com/Kidco-Auto-Close-HearthGate-Black/dp/B006OJIKD0

 

[thundercracker]

all great feedback. real-life experiences are so much more helpful to me than the sales guy/sales literature.

do you ever leave the stove on at home, unattended by anyone? If so, for how long? like an hour, or like when you are at work?

 

[apandori]

The instructions for my stove say leave it on a setting of 2 out of 10 if you leave, but I know that a lot of people on here leave their stoves up higher once they "trust" them. Generally if anything breaks in a pellet stove it shuts itself down or the fire burns out anyway. Once you get used to it you'll probably think the same way.

 

[TimfromMA]

all great feedback. real-life experiences are so much more helpful to me than the sales guy/sales literature.

do you ever leave the stove on at home, unattended by anyone? If so, for how long? like an hour, or like when you are at work?

You can leave your pellet stove burning unattended afterall, you have no problem leaving your oil furnace on all day don't you?

My pellet stove runs off a thermostat. I leave my pellet thermostat set at 60 while at wok and the stove will cycle itself on and off as needed to maintain that temperature. If the stove happens to fail or it runs out of pellets, my oil thermostats will kick in when the house cools to 50.

 

[Havilcek stole the ball]

I have a pellet stove in the living room that was installed when my youngest was about 3 or 4 and we've had no incidents. Kids are smarter than they look sometimes. My kids instinctively stay away from things that are on fire. If they do make a mistake (like when the older child touched the surface of a hot iron), it will only happen once.

 

[LuvMyPellets]

I have a 7yr old Crown Oil Boiler (87% EFF)1600 Sq ft. 2 Zone Baseboard with 3rd circulator on a 50gal Crown Stainless HW Storage tank. I bought a tank of oil 5yrs ago and it is still 3/4 full. It runs once or twice a year to circulate the water and probably this year I am going to get antifreeze in the system and shut it down for good. 6 yrs ago I put the pellet stove in and 5yrs ago the GE Hybrid Water heater. Our Electric went up $9 a month for the GE. The 40,000 BTU stove Keeps the main part of our house at 70 or above and the bedrooms around 64-66. The drive in basement never got below 54. I have determined conservatively that I am around $12,000 in savings over the 6yr period. The stove has never quit and runs on thermostat 24hrs a day as soon as the temp drops.

 

[Ctcarl]

all great feedback. real-life experiences are so much more helpful to me than the sales guy/sales literature.

do you ever leave the stove on at home, unattended by anyone? If so, for how long? like an hour, or like when you are at work?

I have the p35i and love it.im able to clean myself is a really champ.as far as saving oil.i keep my oil on 55 and on freezing cold days I leave it running 24-7.normally I turn it off in the morning and have my 16 yr old turn on when home from school.pending on the pellets you get I had green supreme very inexpensive and had to clean it good after every ton.last ton was green team .when I pulled it part to clean after one ton.it was fine.so this year just got 4 tons of green team and plan on cleaning after every 2 tons.go with the harman is won't disappoint.Hope this helps good luck

 

[railfanron]

We leave ours on automatic on a programmable thermostat. It comes on when needed, home or not. A funny thing happened last winter. It was bitter cold and I had the furnace programmed to heat the house at night and the pellet stove during the day. The igniter failed on the furnace and the pellet stove took over in the middle of the night. It was Sunday morning so the pellet stove did all the heating until Monday afternoon when I put in a new igniter.
This year the pellet stove will take over more of the heat.
Ron

 

[thundercracker]

I bought a tank of oil 5yrs ago and it is still 3/4 full.

this is incredible. you must have ground installed tank? We moved into our current home in Feb 2014. we moved from a house that had gas heat. Oil heat cost was eye-popping and triple what we paid for gas heat. I was hoping to convert the house to gas, however we happen to live on a stamp of land that is surrounded by 2 gas lines, but inaccessible because both lines are on the other side of a)train tracks, and b) a small stream. Gas company said they would never consider extending the line under the tracks or stream due to costs, and not enough customers to warrant the cost.

thanks again for all the info, truly helpful. funny enough, i think the wife wants the stove more than i do, given all the reports here about stoves making the house warmer...

 

[Boomer Sailor]

Hi
I've been lurking for a while now, a ton of great info here, thanks to everyone.

i have a 2100 sq. ft. 2-story colonial with only 985 sq. ft on the first floor and the rest upstairs. decently open concept on the first floor, and i'm really only looking to heat the first floor with the pellet insert into my existing fireplace.

i have 2 zone(upstairs/downstairs) baseboard hot water heaters, oil furnace.

Q#1- what do i have to do to make sure my pipes don't freeze on the first floor? should i run the heat on the fist floor 1/week, 1/mth, never while i'm burning? i hope to keep the 1st floor at 70 during the days, 65 or 68 at night. i will keep my upstairs at 65-68 using the oil to heat the baseboards.

Q#2 - anyone care to guess how much oil i might save? we moved into the house last january '14, and had an oil delivery at least each month at the cost of about $575/mth. I'm hoping that this stove will eliminate 2 oil fill ups, is that wishful thinking, given that i will still use oil to heat the 2nd floor?

Q3 - anyone have any good solutions on gates or surrounds, to keep my little kids away from the stove? (aside from yelling at them) i have a 3 yr old that's particular to jumping off things. the 5 yr old is pretty cautious. i heard about some type of surround that screws intot he fireplace mantle, but haven't seen any pics.

Q4 do you all run a humidifier as you burn, if so, how much, all day, a couple hours/day?


Q5 - looking at a harmon p35i vs. a quadfire classic bay. both are around the same price, i guess both are the same company. should i look at any enviro's? or anything else? right now i'm looking at about $3,000 for the stove (harmon or quadrfire) plus an additional $1000-1100 for the chimneyliner and install.


unrelated to stoves Question- i have an 1997 on demand water system for my hot water. does anyone know if this is inefficient for oil furnaces? should i consider a storage tank-style water heater, would that save some oil? basically, when i need hot water, i think the furnace fires up to heat the water.

thanks again everyone

I have 2,400 sq. ft. in CT, so similar climate as you, but you may have a touch colder weather than me. I used a Harman 52i last season and heating the entire house without an issue. (although when we were hitting -7 through -10 lows at night and daytime highs of 10 - 15.... the upstairs was getting somewhat cold - 70/68 on side with stove / 66/64 opposite side - - then upstairs was 58/60 and stove was almost fully cranked (and using "better" pellets). BUT with normal winter temps of 15-20 low and 20-25 high, the house was basically 72/70 - 67/68 - - 63-66 upstairs). So maybe look at the slightly larger Harman insert and you can skip using oil all together

 

[Jocko1]

If you have small children go to any fireplace store and buy a quality safety gate. Mine cost 200 bucks but it blocks the entire stove from kids, thats my most important advice. I also second the ge geospring, it is a great hot water heater and will pay for itself in 8 months. I run a large whole house humidifier all winter too to keep house comfortable. 2100. Sq. ft is a big area to heat with a pellet stove I would look for at a minimum 50,000 btu stove. Also I second keeping oil burner thermostats set at 55.

 

[thundercracker]

If you have small children go to any fireplace store and buy a quality safety gate. Mine cost 200 bucks but it blocks the entire stove from kids, thats my most important advice. I also second the ge geospring, it is a great hot water heater and will pay for itself in 8 months. I run a large whole house humidifier all winter too to keep house comfortable. 2100. Sq. ft is a big area to heat with a pellet stove I would look for at a minimum 50,000 btu stove. Also I second keeping oil burner thermostats set at 55.

Thanks for the reply. I'll get some kind of barrier for the kids for sure. I'm not trying to heat my entire house, just the first floor whichever is just about 1000 sq ft. That when i'm only getting a smaller 30k btu unit. I'm skeptical that a bigger stove wouldn't reach my upstairs plus wouldn't it be uncomfortable in the stove room if I cranked up the stove to try to reach the second floor?

 

[Boomer Sailor]

Thanks for the reply. I'll get some kind of barrier for the kids for sure. I'm not trying to heat my entire house, just the first floor whichever is just about 1000 sq ft. That when i'm only getting a smaller 30k btu unit. I'm skeptical that a bigger stove wouldn't reach my upstairs plus wouldn't it be uncomfortable in the stove room if I cranked up the stove to try to reach the second floor?

I don't think you'll be uncomfortable trying to heat the 2nd floor as well as the first. I didn't imagine my 52i would be able to heat both (and the stove is NOT centrally located at all) but when it's really cold out, physics has a wonderful way for drawing the warmer air into the colder room and balancing everything out nicely... or at least reasonably comfortably as was my experience. (I have electric baseboard heat and I try to never turn that on - and I never did have to last winter once the stove was installed).

I would suggest that you post just that type of question on here and see what type of responses you get before you IMHO inadvertently buy too small of a stove whereas a larger one would have surprisingly heated both floors! You said you have an opened floor plan on the first floor (I have a 1989 colonial and certainly not an opened floor plan at all)....

So search around on this site - it is a wonderful resources for REAL WORLD experiences from countless people. My vote is that you can heat your entire house comfortably with a larger stove such as mine. Don't pull the plug quiet yet

 

[rona]

all great feedback. real-life experiences are so much more helpful to me than the sales guy/sales literature.

do you ever leave the stove on at home, unattended by anyone? If so, for how long? like an hour, or like when you are at work?

The stove starts when cold weather gets here and stays on 24/7 until spring. It is shut down once every three to four weeks for 1/2 hour to clean it. I've never had a problem in 10 years of burning that would make me not trust it. Just keep a cleaning schedule and do the maintenance.

 

[Boomer Sailor]

The stove starts when cold weather gets here and stays on 24/7 until spring. It is shut down once every three to four weeks for 1/2 hour to clean it. I've never had a problem in 10 years of burning that would make me not trust it. Just keep a cleaning schedule and do the maintenance.

I totally agree! Maybe the first night when going to sleep you may feel uncomfortable with an appliance which has a blazing fire in it running in an unattended fashion, but pellet stoves are really a "set and forget" type of thing with various automatic shutdowns should that need arise! (Harmans in particular are very much a hands-off stove. Heck, I can't even adjust the air intake if I wanted to - the stove does everything automatically). If the stove gets too hot - if the convection blower isn't set properly, etc, etc. - it's really "sailor proof" as we said back in my navy days. Harmans can even turn them selves on and off if you choose that type of setting!

When the winter season is really in place, I turn my stove off 1x per week for my Saturday routine of emptying the ash pan and brushing everything off (which takes about 20 minutes) and then the stove is back on until next Saturday morning!

 

[thundercracker]

So now I'm thinking about a bigger stove, thanks sailor!

How many bags would you say you burn per typical January day? I just saw some pricing for okanoggin something or another for $370/ton, not delivered!

 

[fmsm]

I think you will be surprised (pleasantly) at how much heat a stove will throw. For years I had a Whitfield in my basement level and would get blown out down there because it would get so hot. Last year I replaced the Whitfield with a Harman. Prior to this I had a stove on my first floorl that would heat that level plus my upstairs. After installing the Harman I was shocked to discover that my basement stove was capable of heating almost my entire house! I attribute this to the stronger fan in the Harman compared to the Whitfield. Now my basement level family room is comfortable (around 72) and the rest of the house can be heated with one stove to 65-68. My first level stove is on an automatic thermostat and is much more economical than it had been.

I would highly recommend a Harman, then set it and forget it (other than adding pellets and cleaning). They are made to run and I wouldn't worry about it running with nobody there. As for the little ones, my grandchildren instinctively stay away.

 

[Big papa]

I would also recommend the larger insert more heat gain from pellets means less oil I have a harman accentra 52i its only warm to the touch when running you won't get burned if it's accidentally touched or bumped into no need for a gate in my opinion.

 

[Boomer Sailor]

Wow talk about getting the highest rated pellet out there right off the bat! In July I had 3 tons of LaCrete pellets delivered for $305-ish per ton.

As for how much you'll burn, well 2 things to consider - first, the amount of btu's/lb that your pellets are rated (normally speaking, ~7,700 for a low and up to ~9,000+ for what you were looking at (Okies).... the higher the btu's, the less per hour you will require. Secondly, each stove has a different max feed rate (I don't recall what mine is, but that is easy to look up for any stove), but just say approximately 5 - 6.5 lbs/hr for any stove out there. Soooo if running on MAX for 24 hours, then 120 - 156 lbs... or from 3 to almost 4 bags per day.

However, when we bottomed out last winter with the few sub-zero days, my STOVE TEMP setting on my Harman was never higher than "6" (7 was max) - only because I didn't want to run it at max, but upon reflection, I could have. But NORMALLY speaking with NORMAL January/February temps, I would say between 2 - 3 bags IF you are trying to heat your entire house as I was. I would top off the stove before I left for work at 2:30pm and top off again before bed 12 hours later so the wife never had to touch anything My 2,300 sq ft house was approximately 70-ish - 68-ish on the first floor and 63 - 66-ish on the 2nd floor all winter.

If you are wondering about how many tons you would need for the entire season, I good rule of thumb after reading various posts on this site, I would say 4 tons minimum, 5 tons comfortably and 6 the maximum depending on normal variables... Stove btu output, pellet btu strength, size of house, temperature of house desired, etc., etc. (and that is running the stove exclusively from now - May!)

 

[Pellet-King]

Heat rises, you might be pleasantly surprised how warm your upstair's get's

 

[Boomer Sailor]

I was hoping to just heat my first floor.... I was thrilled to see how comfortable the upstairs was! (I wouldn't have electrically heated the upstairs higher than 64-65 anyway) But all of us pellet burners will admit that we all LOVE having a 70 degree house all winter!!