Hearthstone Phoenix vs Jotul Carrabasset

[czydrm]

Hey folks,

I currently have a Hearthstone Phoenix that just isn't doing what I expect. It is in a large room, 450 sf or so, with 12 ft high cathedral ceiling and a fair bit of glass. The house is a new build with spray foam insulation in the walls and R50 blown-in insulation in the ceiling. The Phoenix does an ok job of heating this room but all in all I a disappointed with it. I have the option from the dealer to replace it and I am looking at the Jotul Carrabasset. My goal is to be able to heat my entire 1850 sf home with wood.

Any thoughts, comments or questions?

 

[pen]

How big is the entire home?

What's the layout like?

Is the fuel well seasoned? How long has it been cut/split/stacked? What type of wood?

What sort of stove top temperatures are you seeing?

Welcome to the site and I hope we can help to get you to where you are looking to be!

pen

 

[czydrm]

The entire home is 1850 sf. 550 sf upstairs and 1300 down stairs. The stove is against an interior wall.

The wood is a mix. I had some stuff that had been sitting in a guy's garage for 30 years. I burnt great! Now I have a mix of maple, oak and poplar that is not as seasoned as it should be. I got it late and have had to re-split.

Stove top temps, I am not totally sure. I had an oven thermometer on the top that went to about 220F. I have a flue thermometer at about 2 feet above the stove. I have seen temps up around 600 but normal is more like 350-400.

Should I mention that I also have creosote icicles?

Thanks for the welcome!

 

[czydrm]

Oh, almost forgot.... burn times, regardless of wood quality, are less than 2 hours.

 

[pen]

Are your turning the air down as the fire establishes itself? Or do you find that you are keeping the air control mostly open?

Are you packing the wood right in? Or are you leaving gaps, criss-crossing things, etc.

How tall is the chimney on this thing? Is it a SS class A chimney/flue system? A masonry one? A masonry chimney with a SS flue liner?

pen

 

[czydrm]

Typically I do not turn the air down as I have found that if I do, temps drop below 300 quickly.

I put in as much as will fit, which isn't that much. There are gaps.

The chimney is about 20' and is brand new SS class A.

 

[cableman]

Get your self a temp gun or a stove top therm, when my shelburne is running 350-400 flue im alot lower on the stove top. Dry wood is a big part of it, lll let my wood burn in and see flue temps 600-700 easy then the stove comes up to 500 and puts out nice heat. Id say its more a wood issue and use the thermometers untill you get a good feel of how the stove burns. Im still learning mine!

 

[pen]

As you eluded too, it's not a huge firebox, and for that space in your climate I can see how it might be undersized.

However, with that much Class A that is 6 inch to match the stove, you should have no problems turning the air down to none or almost none and having that thing rock and roll at max stove top temps.

Is the wood you are burning cut into splits? Or are they rounds?

 

[tcassavaugh]

I absolutely love the jotul line. plain, simple and easy to operate. I'm not familiar with the F55 Carrabasset but I have a f3CB I use to heat my upstairs, about 1200 sq feet. I started out with an old 602 I got for free that's retired but not forgotten and will be set up again someday. I get a good six hrs burn with the f3cb but often longer especially if I pack it good and shut it down for the night. I was going to suggest a f600 firelight with your high ceilings and glass you mention but I see it has a higher efficiency rating and higher btu using shorter wood......more with less. sounds good to me.

 

[czydrm]

The wood when I got it was pretty much quartered. Most of it has had to be resplit.

 

[lazeedan]

I agree that it sounds like a wood issue. Leaving the air open sends all the heat out the stack. Shutting the air down with wet wood chokes the fire till it smolders.
The Phoenix is probably on the small side for 24/7 heating in your climate.

 

[Polarbear]

We have a hearthstone Phoenix in our 1500sq ft ranch. When I get it rolling the whole house can be 75 degrees. Most of our windows leak cold air and need to be replaced as well as our patio door that has bad glass. There is about 7" cellulose insulation in the attic. House was built in 94' and was never even caulked. Its caulked and painted now. Still lots of updates to do. I tried burning fresh split oak that was dead 1.5years and it burned terribly. The oak is all over 20 percent moisture. For $30 you can buy the general moisture meter. I also have the general infrared thermometer. It helps getting accurate stove temps. I burn ash at MM readings of about 15 or less. I'm getting 6hr burns on full loads easy.

 

[jzinckgra]

Your house sounds a lot like ours. We've got~ 1700sqft main and ~750 upstairs. Cathedral is 26' high. Jotul F55 seems to be working well. We also have spray foam and batts in the walls and cellulose in ceiling. Super airtight but lots of glass which loses a lot of heat at night but we're south facing so we benefit during the day big time. Here's a pic.

 

[splitoak]

With my heritage I'm heating bout 1300 sq ft...12' ceilings. ..keeps it between 70-73 depending on how I load it...ive had it to bout 580...throws off a lot of heat...but I'm still new to this and I need to find better ways to distribute the heat...

 

[begreen]

Oh, almost forgot.... burn times, regardless of wood quality, are less than 2 hours.

Something doesn't sound right here. How is burn time being defined? How is the stove being run, that is what fuel, what size fuel charge, air control settings during the burn, etc..?

 

[czydrm]

Burn time is defined as the time between first lighting the fire or reloading it and the time it is down to coals and almost completely out.

Fuel is a hardwood mix. Some is newer and some it really old and very dry.

Fuel charge is as much as will fit in....not very much... 6 or so pieces.

Air control is almost always all the way open because any other setting drops the temp too low and eventually will choke the fire out. This is the same regardless of the type or quality of wood.

 

[begreen]

Something is not right if you are going from load to just ashes in 2 hrs. I suspect this is not the stove. You should not have to run with the air wide open. Either the wood is not fully seasoned or the draft is poor. Have you tried a couple bundles of store bought wood? What is the chimney height?

 

[Motor7]

The phoenix is rated to 60,000 btu which should run you out of that room if you are burning seasoned hardwood and operating the stove correctly. I am heating from a 1080sq ft basement, the main floor(another 1080) above and a loft of 200sq ft & the great room is right above the stove. It is 30'x20' with 20' cathederal and big glass similar to jzinc's(nice pad by the way). I can generally maintain 68 degrees on the main & loft with nothing but two computer fans under the floor at two registers & get consistent 8 hr burns when fully loaded for the night...and my wood this year is marginal.

Your stove should see 6-7 hr burns, so you need to re-examine how you are doing things.

 

[czydrm]

Chimney height is just under 20'. It does have an offset in it.

 

[czydrm]

I used to have a cottage with an ancient old parlor stove that was far from air tight and my wood was way worse than what I currently have. That stove would force me to open the door mid way through the burn and a load would last all the way through the night.

 

[begreen]

Chimney height is just under 20'. It does have an offset in it.

If this is just a 30 deg offset then that shouldn't be a big issue. How is the stove connected, through the wall or straight up? FWIW, modern stoves are much less tolerant of damp wood than old stoves. They burn entirely different.

 

[czydrm]

There is a 45 degree coming out of the stove and then straight up through the ceiling into the attic and then 30 degree offset toward the top in the attic. Also, the house is on top of a hill with no trees sheltering it. It's a great site for a windmill!

 

[czydrm]

The phoenix is rated to 60,000 btu which should run you out of that room if you are burning seasoned hardwood and operating the stove correctly.

The thing is no one, not the dealer, the manufacturer, nor any one else has made it clear how to run this type of stove correctly.

 

[jzinckgra]

There is a 45 degree coming out of the stove and then straight up through the ceiling into the attic and then 30 degree offset toward the top in the attic. Also, the house is on top of a hill with no trees sheltering it. It's a great site for a windmill!

Forgot to mention our stack is 21' with two 45 degree elbows on the inside then straight up. Sounds very similar to yours

 

[shoot-straight]

I have a Phoenix. Two things. You need a damper, and dry wood. Very dry wood. You get virtually zero heat unless you reduce the air intake. I have gotten mine to 400 before but usually cruise at 300. 6 hour burn times should not be a problem. Go buy 3 bundles of kiln dried wood like oak, throwsome on a bed of coals and watch what happens. Once it gets good and hot, cut back the air almost all the way over a 5-10 min period. Get that damper!

I too have it in a great room with cathedral ceilings. I live in the open, no windbreaks for mile and on a hill. When its windy it cannot keep up. 2250 sq ft. Leaky house. Going to upgrade to an Ashford I think. I want a little more heat and a longer burn time.