Newbie trying to use an existing wood stove insert inside fireplace

[gzax]

Hello there,

Have read a lot of useful comments over the last few months as I have been in preparation of getting to use the wood stove insert in my fireplace. It came with the house and has two doors with glass panels. One of the panels was broken and the gaskets were gone. Took it to a store in the neighborhood to have the panel replaced and gaskets installed. Feels like the store owner is trying to scare me into buying a new wood stove insert from them. I am being told it is the oldest wood stove out there(just by looking at the panels) and also that it won't be efficient and even with new gaskets (as the old ones were completely gone) it will still put carbon monoxide inside the house.

Is it possible I can post a picture of my wood stove insert to see if anyone can tell me if the unit is that ancient and whether it works or not. Also the wood stove insert was looked at by a fireplace maintenance company two years back when they were doing lining for my hot water boiler(that runs on gas). They told me that I do not need a liner and the flue's are all metal and run all the way up. The guy looked (stuck his head inside the fireplace and looked up by shining a flash light) and said that it was all good for use and all it needs is the broken glass panel to be fixed and the gaskets to be re-instated. I feel like I am getting scared by a sales guy to make me buy something from them.

When I asked the store for a service visit to check the flue's he said, he is sure that there is no liner and I am looking at a chimney fire. Is there a way I can check it myself from inside the fireplace by looking up? I just don't feel comfortable with sales people who try the FUD (fear, uncertainity and doubt) on the customers..

Thank you for your time.

 

[mellow]

Post pictures, that will help alot. It sounds like a zero clearance wood fireplace with doors, once we see a picture that will tell us more.

If you want someone to come and look at it I would contact a professional:
http://www.csia.org/
(broken link removed to http://www.ncsg.org/search)

 

[gzax]

Mellow.. Thank you for the response. I will get the pictures in this evening. Unfortunately, I do not have the doors as I had to bring them in for the glass panels to be installed along with the gaskets.. Also has 5 small flue's (about 3 inch diameter) instead of a single 6 inch.

 

[gzax]

Please see attachments.

02_ Chimney - showing two flue's at the top. The Flue that comes into the fireplace has a cap on it. The other one was left open by the contractor who did some work for me. Since it runs into the firepit, it won't be an issue (those were his words). I dont' think that is going to be an issue.

03_fireplace - shows the fireplace with the wood stove insert in its full glory. minus the doors which are out for service.

06_fireplace - shows the blower motor in the bottom. The slider above the dial opens and closes the airflow in the bottom.

07_fireplace - shows the tubes / flues thru the vent where the warm is supposed to come back to the room (it is only my guess).

012_fireplace - shows the 5 flues (3 inch diameter) on the top of the unit.

014_ash_pit - shows the ashpit and the hookup going into the hot water heater (gas powered).

Yes I want to have a professional service and assess the unit. I feel I am a bit late as the ones that I contacted are busy and some of them didn't even returned my calls. The one in my town was willing to work on it after I get the panels fixed by them. But they were trying to sell me a new unit for $3K.. So I wanted a fair understanding on the system from some of the seasoned veteran's in this group, as I know you will give me an honest answer and you have no vested interest in selling me anything.

Thanks again for your response.

Regards,

 

[bholler]

I just tore one of them out of a customers house yesterday. And i would not use it. It is installed by just sliding it into the firebox with no real connection to the chimney. And with that stove there is no good way to connect it. They do not burn cleanly and are very prone to chimney fires. And due to the fact that they are not really connected a chimney fire can be very intense and dangerous. So while the guy at the stove shop may have exaggerated some points he was right it is unsafe.

 

[gzax]

so there is no real metal pipe running thru the chimney from the wood stove insert?

How old is this model? Is this from the 70's or so?

One of the fireplace guys who came in to do the liner for my hot water boiler told me that It is all set to go and only needs a new panel and gasket and everything else looks good..

What is the real cost of a new wood stove insert including installation? My house is about 1700 sq ft.. I think a 2000 sq ft unit might be sufficient..Also what is a reliable brand?

 

[bholler]

How old is this model? Is this from the 70's or so?

yeah i think it is 70s

so there is no real metal pipe running thru the chimney from the wood stove insert?

No there is no connection at all and there really is no way to do it. It is a bad setup that does not meet current standards and cant be brought up to code

 

[gzax]

THank you bholler.. what would you recommend as a good brand and what is the average for a good wood stove insert that I can get which produces enough heat (and burns 8 hrs or so) for 2000 sq ft space?

 

[bholler]

do some research on here there are many good stoves and inserts on the market at a wide range of price points. But no matter what you install you will need an insulated liner to go with it

 

[Cynnergy]

Bholler gives great advice! As for recommendations for a new stove, what is your floor plan, open or closed? A quick diagram would be good. How good is the insulation in your home? Do you have a supply of dry wood for this year?

As for burning over 8 hours, you will need over a 2 cu. ft. stove. How much bigger will depend on the answers to the above.

 

[mellow]

You will need to pull that wood fireplace out to get a measure of your fireplace to figure out what size insert will fit in there, sounds like it should just slide out.

 

[gzax]

Bholler gives great advice! As for recommendations for a new stove, what is your floor plan, open or closed? A quick diagram would be good. How good is the insulation in your home? Do you have a supply of dry wood for this year?

As for burning over 8 hours, you will need over a 2 cu. ft. stove. How much bigger will depend on the answers to the above.

Thank you..

 

[gzax]

You will need to pull that wood fireplace out to get a measure of your fireplace to figure out what size insert will fit in there, sounds like it should just slide out.

Thank you..

 

[Smoked]

Measure the hearth out front too! If the lintel height is tall enough and or hearth is deep enough, you may be able to go with a free standing stove as well. Then you could have so many choices it could blow your mind But seriously, if you can get into some freestanding stoves, many more beautiful and less expensive options become available. Not necessarily both though. I had an old insert like that and had 2 flue fires in 4 years. After the first one, I tried a boot and direct connect, after the second, I quit burning until I could afford to do it right

 

[gzax]

Measure the hearth out front too! If the lintel height is tall enough and or hearth is deep enough, you may be able to go with a free standing stove as well. Then you could have so many choices it could blow your mind But seriously, if you can get into some freestanding stoves, many more beautiful and less expensive options become available. Not necessarily both though. I had an old insert like that and had 2 flue fires in 4 years. After the first one, I tried a boot and direct connect, after the second, I quit burning until I could afford to do it right

Thank you.. It is this level of detail or feedback's that I was looking for as I didn't felt comfortable the way how the sales guy at the fireplace was talking to me.. follow up question.. so freestanding stoves are cheaper than inserts? I thought it was the other way around..

 

[gzax]

I just tore one of them out of a customers house yesterday. And i would not use it. It is installed by just sliding it into the firebox with no real connection to the chimney. And with that stove there is no good way to connect it. They do not burn cleanly and are very prone to chimney fires. And due to the fact that they are not really connected a chimney fire can be very intense and dangerous. So while the guy at the stove shop may have exaggerated some points he was right it is unsafe.

bholler, I see a bunch of screws outside. Can I pull the insert out if I take all those screws out? I would like to get a measurement of the fire place opening. Is that an easy one person job or do I need to bring in helping hands as it is heavy or the top panel (looks like cast iron) may come loose, etc..

 

[Smoked]

Thank you.. It is this level of detail or feedback's that I was looking for as I didn't felt comfortable the way how the sales guy at the fireplace was talking to me.. follow up question.. so freestanding stoves are cheaper than inserts? I thought it was the other way around..

No, there are some very expensive freestanding stoves as well but there is one non cat stove, the Englander 30-NC that is a very good value. My impression is there are more nice freestanding stoves in the $1,500 - $2,500 range than Inserts. Most quality inserts start in the $2,500 at least around here once you add in surrounds and blowers and sometimes the door. There are all kinds of things to consider though. Cat vs non cat. If free standing, a rear vent could sit farther out on the hearth, while a top vent will have to have the flue collar behind the lintel but they can be offset a little. Devil is in the details for sure! If that is a pretty standard masonry fireplace, you should have some good options. The below photo is my potential stove number 2 waiting for me to get enough help to get the thing lifted up there. It is a rear vent freestanding stove and all but about the back 2 inches will be out on the hearth. Just gives you and Idea of what can be done. Get folks here the numbers and I am sure you will get plenty of stuff to research!

 

[bholler]

bholler, I see a bunch of screws outside. Can I pull the insert out if I take all those screws out? I would like to get a measurement of the fire place opening. Is that an easy one person job or do I need to bring in helping hands as it is heavy or the top panel (looks like cast iron) may come loose, etc..

you need to pull it out a little those screws have nuts on the back side and they hold the surround on. It is not a heavy stove at all but it is still probably a 2 person job to pull it out completely. But 2 people can carry it pretty easily.

 

[gzax]

you need to pull it out a little those screws have nuts on the back side and they hold the surround on. It is not a heavy stove at all but it is still probably a 2 person job to pull it out completely. But 2 people can carry it pretty easily.

Thank you..

 

[gzax]

No, there are some very expensive freestanding stoves as well but there is one non cat stove, the Englander 30-NC that is a very good value. My impression is there are more nice freestanding stoves in the $1,500 - $2,500 range than Inserts. Most quality inserts start in the $2,500 at least around here once you add in surrounds and blowers and sometimes the door. There are all kinds of things to consider though. Cat vs non cat. If free standing, a rear vent could sit farther out on the hearth, while a top vent will have to have the flue collar behind the lintel but they can be offset a little. Devil is in the details for sure! If that is a pretty standard masonry fireplace, you should have some good options. The below photo is my potential stove number 2 waiting for me to get enough help to get the thing lifted up there. It is a rear vent freestanding stove and all but about the back 2 inches will be out on the hearth. Just gives you and Idea of what can be done. Get folks here the numbers and I am sure you will get plenty of stuff to research!

View attachment 162270

Thank you.

 

[gzax]

Do I have to get heat resistant tiles for my floor (is there a code like that) that will cover the brickwork( I think that is what is called hearth) and also the hardwood floor surrounding it? The bricks are about 1 ft raised from the hardwood floor and there is about 2 ft of bricks(as a raised platform in front of the fireplace) before the wood stove insert.

 

[begreen]

No tiles needed on top of the brickwork. However, the insert will require the hearth to extend 16" in front of the stove door. Sometimes this requires a hearth extension at the floor level. This can be a simple ember protector with the hearth is raised. as described. In your case you may not need it. This depends on the insert.

 

[DanCorcoran]

No, there are some very expensive freestanding stoves as well but there is one non cat stove, the Englander 30-NC that is a very good value. My impression is there are more nice freestanding stoves in the $1,500 - $2,500 range than Inserts. Most quality inserts start in the $2,500 at least around here once you add in surrounds and blowers and sometimes the door. There are all kinds of things to consider though. Cat vs non cat. If free standing, a rear vent could sit farther out on the hearth, while a top vent will have to have the flue collar behind the lintel but they can be offset a little. Devil is in the details for sure! If that is a pretty standard masonry fireplace, you should have some good options. The below photo is my potential stove number 2 waiting for me to get enough help to get the thing lifted up there. It is a rear vent freestanding stove and all but about the back 2 inches will be out on the hearth. Just gives you and Idea of what can be done. Get folks here the numbers and I am sure you will get plenty of stuff to research!

View attachment 162270

About that photo of your stove...

 

[Smoked]

About that photo of your stove...

I know, something is missing... and needs to get fixed soon. Seriously, what's up?

 

[gzax]

No tiles needed on top of the brickwork. However, the insert will require the hearth to extend 16" in front of the stove door. Sometimes this requires a hearth extension at the floor level. This can be a simple ember protector with the hearth is raised. as described. In your case you may not need it. This depends on the insert.

Thank you..