So is a newer insert worth it?

[ironspider]

I have a ten year old (or so) quad 4100 insert. It's been very tough to heat my 1700sq ft home this winter.

So the question: are newer inserts way more efficient? Enough to justify several thousand dollars?

 

[begreen]

Not hugely so. Is this in an exterior wall chimney and fireplace? Is there a damper sealing block-off plate in place

 

[Dix]

Need more info, J.

Or, to quote Johnny 5, need more input

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

Probably yes, go way bigger than you have now......

 

[Grisu]

I have a ten year old (or so) quad 4100 insert. It's been very tough to heat my 1700sq ft home this winter.

So the question: are newer inserts way more efficient? Enough to justify several thousand dollars?

This winter was really cold. I don't think you were the only one whose stove was struggling. With a 2.4 cu ft firebox (if that has not changed) the 4100 may just be a bit undersized for your home when the temps go as low as they have been this winter. Have you thought about insulation and air-sealing improvements or maybe a larger stove?

 

[Dix]

I had 2 stoves struggling this winter in a 2000 SF house this winter, 15 miles away from you. With no back up heat source.

Can you put in a free stander???

I'm thinking a NC 30.

 

[begreen]

The question is whether new inserts are more efficient than his. I don't think most are. More capacity may help, but if this in an outside wall fireplace without a blockoff plate fixing that may bring similar results at a much lower cost.

 

[Dix]

Good point, BG.

Would insulating the liner help, as well ???

This winter was really brutal here, especially for our area.

 

[ironspider]

We are pretty well insulated, and I'm not sure a bigger unit will fit, I don't recall the original size of the fireplace.

 

[ironspider]

No room for a free stander

 

[bholler]

Would insulating the liner help, as well ???

Insulating the liner would not help with heat output really. There are many other good reasons to do it but that isn't really one of them

 

[ironspider]

The question is whether new inserts are more efficient than his. I don't think most are. More capacity may help, but if this in an outside wall fireplace without a blockoff plate fixing that may bring similar results at a much lower cost.

Yeah thAts pretty much the question. I can upgrade a car to gain better mpg but if I don't need a new one will the more efficient car pay for itself.

 

[Dix]

Insulating the liner would not help with heat output really. There are many other good reasons to do it but that isn't really one of them

If it's an exterior chimney, it would help.

 

[Grisu]

Yeah thAts pretty much the question. I can upgrade a car to gain better mpg but if I don't need a new one will the more efficient car pay for itself.

Depends what other heating source you use when the insert is not enough and how much "fuel" (oil, gas etc.) it needs during a winter. When the Quad was working out for you the winters before I would just keep going as usual. If pessimistically every 5 years the winter is so cold that you need to burn additional oil for like $400 you have a very long payback period for a new insert. In practice, you will never break even at those numbers.

 

[begreen]

Yeah thAts pretty much the question. I can upgrade a car to gain better mpg but if I don't need a new one will the more efficient car pay for itself.

Is this in an exterior wall chimney and fireplace? Is there a damper sealing block-off plate in place?

 

[dafattkidd]

Is this in an exterior wall chimney and fireplace? Is there a damper sealing block-off plate in place?

Ironspider, BG is on to something here. If your set up lacks a block off plate, installing one will most likely help tremendously,

 

[mellow]

Going off this thread you do not have an insulated liner: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/newb-needs-help.117495/

Block off plate and insulate your fireplace opening, that will help keep some of those BTU's in your home, insulating the liner will help your draft issues.

See this thread for how I did mine, it made a difference in how much heat my insert pumps out: Finally got around to insulating my fireplace

 

[begreen]

That's my thought. It could be the cheapest and most effective way to improve the heat efficiency of the existing insert.

 

[jatoxico]

Yes to the block off plate and insulating the smoke chamber etc. Even if you do end up with a new insert for whatever reason you'll still be glad you took those steps.

 

[bholler]

If it's an exterior chimney, it would help.

It might help very slightly by increasing the draft and that might possibly increase the efficiency. I am not saying don't insulate te liner in my opinion every liner should be insulated but for safety draft and reduced buildup reasons not improved heat output.

 

[ironspider]

Lol I don't even know what a block off plate is, but I'll check out the link for insulating the chimney.

 

[begreen]

If you don't have a block off plate and this is an outside wall fireplace you can raise the temp of the hot air blowing out of the stove significantly by installing a blockoff plate.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/why-damper-seal-is-needed/
https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/why-damper-seal-is-needed/

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/articles/making_a_block_off_plate/

 

[Dix]

J, is the chimney on an outside wall?

 

[ironspider]

J, is the chimney on an outside wall?

First floor no but about 10-15 ft is totally exposed.