Trouble shoot my P61

[jimbolyard]

I bought my P61 Harman stove in 2001. Other than some flame guides and a fan motor it has ran like a champ until the last few weeks.

Now all of a sudden it leaves unburnt pellets that fall into the ash pan. The burn pot is clean, and I have turned the feed down as far as it will go. I have always used room temp mode but just turned it to stove temp mode to see what happens. It has a lot of smoke from the flue as well. I use Hammer pellets exclusively. I have shut it down and cleaned it.

I do not know if this is related but today it flashed two blinks which my manual says the hopper plate is not shutting all the way. I emptied the pellets and it seems to move freely.

Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks
Jim

 

[mralias]

When was the last time the entire stove was cleaned including the venting, blowers removed, vacuum line and switch cleaned, auger cleaned, etc. etc etc? Everything you mention in your post are symptoms of a dirty stove. I suspect an air restriction in the venting area. That is where I would start. If cleaning does not work then you can start ruling out some part issues.

 

[katman]

I had some problems running a batch of Hamers through my PB105. Burned these in prior seasons and they were fine. Started getting incomplete combustion and pushing unburned pellets into ask pan. I'm blending them now with another pellet and it is working fine,

 

[tjnamtiw]

How did you avoid this forum for 13 years that you had your stove? I know Harman owners will say because it's a HARMAN, but .............. This place is too addictive to not post or to lend a helping hand to fellow stove owners, especially Harman owners because they need help.

 

[jimbolyard]

t: 1664896, member: 4948"]When was the last time the entire stove was cleaned including the venting, blowers removed, vacuum line and switch cleaned, auger cleaned, etc. etc etc? Everything you mention in your post are symptoms of a dirty stove. I suspect an air restriction in the venting area. That is where I would start. If cleaning does not work then you can start ruling out some part issues.[/quote]


As far as cleaning i cleaned it yesterday. My cleaning consists of cleaning the whole stove inside, the burn pot, the little trap door in the bottom of the burn pot, the small box that catches the fines(the one with the wing nut and cast iron door), the ash area and exhaust. I have never removed blowers to clean them as they seem to work fine. I have no idea about any vacuum line or switch (where is it and what does it do?). As far as I can tell the vent is open and clean as is the exhaust probe.

I have been suspect of the door gaskets as they have never been replaced and look very flat.

It has been on manual mode for 24 hours and does not seem to be overfeeding, but it is still as low as it will go(set on one).

Thanks for the replies all!!

Jim

 

[Bioburner]

Try the dollar bill test on the door gaskets. Putting a bill in the door and closing and see how easy it is to pull out. If it slips easy you need to replace gaskets. Do the test all around the doors. An easy project and only about $20 with getting a drill powered steel brush to properly clean the gaskets seating area. Most stoves start needing gaskets sets around 5 years or so.

 

[alternativeheat]

Try the dollar bill test on the door gaskets. Putting a bill in the door and closing and see how easy it is to pull out. If it slips easy you need to replace gaskets. Do the test all around the doors. An easy project and only about $20 with getting a drill powered steel brush to properly clean the gaskets seating area. Most stoves start needing gaskets sets around 5 years or so.

My P61 needed a lower door gasket within a weeks time, brand new stove. I changed it out for 1/2" rope gasket, the original was leaking all along the bottom edge of the door. The butane lighter test found that, the flame got sucked right in and you could see from the ash pattern on the door where the air was washing the ash off. They say the upper door is more important but that makes no sense to me since the whole stove is under vacuum. An air leak is an air leak in a P61 imo.

 

[jimbolyard]

I forgot to mention after a hard reset I still get the two blinks which the manual says is the slide plate is not shutting all the way, not sure if that is related or not. I am going to get new gaskets and change them out. What sixe do I need and are they just glued in?

Jim

 

[Bioburner]

Air leak means it isn't feeding the fire as designed causing improper burn. Unburnt pellets dropping into pan etc . If my new stove needed a new gasket I would be very disappointed.

 

[alternativeheat]

Air leak means it isn't feeding the fire as designed causing improper burn. Unburnt pellets dropping into pan etc . If my new stove needed a new gasket I would be very disappointed.

It's good you didn't take delivery of my P61 then, cause that's what it needed. I wasn't doing cartwheels over it myself but I work with mechanical devices every working day of my life. Nobody has made the perfect machine as yet, is my experience after 44 years as a truck and general fleet mechanic . The mind set is, well they didn't get this right. It seals now though. Ya it should have been right from the factory but it wasn't. Life moves on.

 

[Bioburner]

It's good you didn't take delivery of my P61 then, cause that's what it needed. I wasn't doing cartwheels over it myself but I work with mechanical devices every working day of my life. Nobody has made the perfect machine as yet, is my experience after 44 years as a truck and general fleet mechanic . The mind set is, well they didn't get this right. It seals now though. Ya it should have been right from the factory but it wasn't. Life moves on.

Just leaves the little voice "what else is not right". Probably why I've rarely bought new. Only been burnt once bad in buying used, a low miles Ford. Was up on lift every month I had it, 9 months. Dealer offered a great price on new and it didn't see a major repair for over a decade. Still have it, a 91 Ford F250 Powerstroke with aftermarket Banks.

 

[alternativeheat]

Just leaves the little voice "what else is not right". Probably why I've rarely bought new. Only been burnt once bad in buying used, a low miles Ford. Was up on lift every month I had it, 9 months. Dealer offered a great price on new and it didn't see a major repair for over a decade.

There is merit to that. Maybe I have a Fridays second shift stove here! Now that would suck. A gasket I don't mind, a parade of faults is another matter.

Part of the trouble you might have had with Ford is it was a low mileage turn in. And it was a Ford, just saying. There was a time when quality wasn't a huge concern with Ford. Its a bit different today. They make some good vehicles. You got to think back to Fairmounts with feedback carbs to get into the Fords I mean by low quality.

 

[Bioburner]

There is merit to that. Maybe I have a Fridays second shift stove here! Now that would suck. A gasket I don't mind, a parade of faults is another matter.

Part of the trouble you might have had with Ford is it was a low mileage turn in. And it was a Ford, just saying. There was a time when quality wasn't a huge concern with Ford. Its a bit different today. They make some good vehicles.

It was an insurance buy back I found out as it had been in a accident and company had the first year policy of total replacement if under x miles. Internet has made making a lemon like being a leper, no one will get near one pretty quick.

 

[alternativeheat]

It was an insurance buy back I found out as it had been in a accident and company had the first year policy of total replacement if under x miles. Internet has made making a lemon like being a leper, no one will get near one pretty quick.

Well my stove was brand new! At least the dealer made good on your car it seems. I bought a used truck from a Ford dealer locally back in the 90's. The payment at the time is what I could afford. I was so disgusted with the truck I drove it to the lot and took the plates off of it and told them they could have it back, no way I was driving it home yet again with something else to go wrong. I had a ride and left. That evening I got a call from the GM. He offered me a new Ranger and with the better finance rate on new vehicle loans the monthly payment was within a few dollars of the used junk. I sent more people his way as a result who bought vehicles from him.

 

[Bioburner]

I forgot to mention after a hard reset I still get the two blinks which the manual says is the slide plate is not shutting all the way, not sure if that is related or not. I am going to get new gaskets and change them out. What sixe do I need and are they just glued in?

Jim

I just took a chunk of the old gaskets in an got at a Farm store as they had 12 ft chunks in a kit with high temp silicone gasket adhesive. Make sure the old surface area is clean. A drill powered wire brush is great an only $4 or so and the gasket kit $15 or so.

 

[jimbolyard]

Well I replaced the door gaskets (piece of cake), and the stove is running like it always has. I did step up to 1/2 inch in the process. I still get two blinks, the switch is a micro switch and the lever is bent, but it almost looks like it is supposed to be. Can anyone tell me for sure if it has a bend or not?

I keep a few spare parts (flame guides, blowers, and an exhaust fan) on hand for replacement as the need arises. I was thinking of maybe having a ESP probe around as well. I would also like to have a few plastic covers for the exhaust motor if available. My local dealer has nothing in stock and I wondered what else I should keep around. Any suggestions would be helpful, as well as some contact information for a good place to order from. I order from a hardware store right now but they are not very knowledgeable at all.

thanks
Jim

 

[Bioburner]

Only thing you don't have is an auger motor, and control board. Couple of pot switches for the board $10. Make sure the stove is on a good surge suppressor or UPS.

 

[jimbolyard]

Well Thursday night it started feeding too much again and spilling partially burnt pellets into the ash pan and smelling up the house. I emptied out the pellets and let it go out. I am starting to think there is something wrong with the pellets. I am going to see if I can buy some different brand and try them I guess. Any other ideas?

Jim

 

[alternativeheat]

Well Thursday night it started feeding too much again and spilling partially burnt pellets into the ash pan and smelling up the house. I emptied out the pellets and let it go out. I am starting to think there is something wrong with the pellets. I am going to see if I can buy some different brand and try them I guess. Any other ideas?

Jim

Are you still getting the two blink warning saying the gate isn't closings ? If so, maybe the gate really isn't closing for what ever reason. Do you hear the periodic clinking of pellets falling into the auger trap ? If not , maybe you are getting a constant feed of pellets from the hopper because of the gate not shutting , again for what every reason ( worn part, a piece of stick that made it's way into your pellet supply, what ever).

If you are not getting the warning light, maybe something in the board is headed south. Have you cleaned or inspected your flue liner ? And sure, why not try a different pellet ? A couple of bags will tell you if it's that. I just returned six bags of the dirtiest high burning pellets I have experienced yet. Bought 14, mixed that last couple of bags I've used with a couple of other good burning pellets and returned six bags. But you might think there was something wrong with the stove, the flame rolled off the heat exchanger leaving ash up there on a high demand heating night. I cleaned out the hopper when it was low and put in some Energex Hardwood pellets and all was normal. Had to really clean the stove Sat though, it looked like I hadn't done it in 3 weeks, last cleaning was the prior Sat ! Fines box had more in it than the week before with nearly a ton having gone through it, the ash pan was half full, like 2.5- 3 weeks burn. One morning i woke up the dining room was 70 deg, normally 73, they weren't producing heat, the stove gobbling these things down like a kid left along at the candy bowl. Junk and they said Premium on the label..

 

[zmedic]

Sounds to me like pellets, or a board. I had that same problem with a USSC 6039 after a full clean and adjusting everything all the way down, first found out it was partly my pellets and then the board went out and just kept overloading it.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Since its 13 years old, I would be very suspicious of an intermittent problem with the control board. Try the different pellets and let us know.

 

[Luv2burnPellets]

Could it be your pellets are damp? Or the hopper slide plate isn't sliding because there is a loose set screw on the shaft and linkage system?

 

[jimbolyard]

I know it has been a while but I couldn't find any pellets that late in the year. So I bought some at Lowes this season and tried three bags in the stove just as I shut it off last year. They burnt just like they should. I had three bags of Hamers left and I burnt them next, the stove started burning terrible again. Started into a ton of the Lowes pellets and its my old stove again! I burnt 10 or so bags and shut it down for my annual cleaning. Started back up and on my last few bags in that ton and its like it always has been.

I am thinking just for maintenance I should get a new ESP and replace it because its still original. Maybe keep the old one for a spare. I clean it with the shopvac during my annual cleaning.

Anyone know of a place to order that plastic cover on the combustion blower?

Thanks
Jim