Whistling Jotul F500

[tflt]

This post is following the discussion from here, https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/whistling-jotul.166519/#post-2786071

I pulled the top off my Oslo 500 V2, (new in 2010) and found what looks to be the source of my whistling. It appears that there is a leak at the top left corner of the stove, by the dark spot leading into the corner.

Above is the left front top cover corner, below the corresponding corner of the stove.

It seems like the stove cement cracked out of the top corner, so I guess this will not be a simple gasket replacement in the top plate.
Underside of top plate-

Top of stove

It looks like the stove will need to be broken down and resealed. I feel ok about doing the job, but am wondering if there are any good tutorials anyone could point to for homework beforehand.
@begreen on the air?
Thanks for any pointers!
Pat

 

[Todd]

I wonder if your front plate is a little warped and caused that separation?

If you take it all apart try dry fitting it back together before cementing to make sure it fits together properly.

 

[begreen]

The sealing edge looks pretty crusty-rusty. Did it have some water dripped on it at some point? It's going to take getting the left edge realigned if possible, resealing, the top edge cleaned well until it's smooth, painting, and then a new top gasket

 

[tflt]

I remembered that the stove was moved once to build the concrete pad riser below it. I bet it was lifted by the top, possibly causing the leak. I wouldn't think the stove was warped, it's been well cared for since new, I'm the only one who loads it.

 

[tflt]

The sealing edge looks pretty crusty-rusty. Did it have some water dripped on it at some point? It's going to take getting the left edge realigned if possible, resealing, the top edge cleaned well until it's smooth, painting, and then a new top gasket

Yes, I lifted the top off and took the pics without brushing anything off. I had a drip into the stove a while back and sealed it up, I guess that was all it needed. The left corner lost some cement when I took the top off, it actually looks pretty square standing over it.

 

[stovelark]

Have torn down and rebuilt several earlier versions of the F500. Be careful taking it apart, the sidewalls and front are heavy, don't want one falling on a toe... Clean out all the grooves of old cement. Get new hardware in stainless if possible. When you start reassembly, have 3 or 4 cartridges of furnace cement at the ready. Fill the seam completely, when the walls of the stove come together, they will force the excess inward to the stove. If any gets on outside of stove, have a wet paper towel ready to wipe off while its wet. For the secondary manifold, ensure the tube assembly is cemented in well too. For the top assembly, Jotul says you don't need to put the top plate bolts back in, but I would, it just makes everything fit together better. Make sure the oval centerplate gasket is in place, and bring it down firm, but don't overtighten. Patience is key, and of course, its best to finish assembly once you start. One last thought, once broken down, do a good inspection of the baseplate, ensuring no cracks in the corners, going diagonal to the ash grate corners. If you don't have to disturb the ash pan housing on the base, I'd leave it alone, but if you suspect leakage, of course check the gasket so that it seals. I've seen top plates with cracks like yours, sometimes it was a corner top leak, sometimes its the oval centerplate not completely sealed. Good luck with her, hopefully only the top and gaskets are in need of replacement, the castings and secondary burn chamber is still available I'm sure, but they will be expensive. Good luck.

 

[tflt]

Have torn down and rebuilt several earlier versions of the F500. Be careful taking it apart, the sidewalls and front are heavy, don't want one falling on a toe... Clean out all the grooves of old cement. Get new hardware in stainless if possible. When you start reassembly, have 3 or 4 cartridges of furnace cement at the ready. Fill the seam completely, when the walls of the stove come together, they will force the excess inward to the stove. If any gets on outside of stove, have a wet paper towel ready to wipe off while its wet. For the secondary manifold, ensure the tube assembly is cemented in well too. For the top assembly, Jotul says you don't need to put the top plate bolts back in, but I would, it just makes everything fit together better. Make sure the oval centerplate gasket is in place, and bring it down firm, but don't overtighten. Patience is key, and of course, its best to finish assembly once you start. One last thought, once broken down, do a good inspection of the baseplate, ensuring no cracks in the corners, going diagonal to the ash grate corners. If you don't have to disturb the ash pan housing on the base, I'd leave it alone, but if you suspect leakage, of course check the gasket so that it seals. I've seen top plates with cracks like yours, sometimes it was a corner top leak, sometimes its the oval centerplate not completely sealed. Good luck with her, hopefully only the top and gaskets are in need of replacement, the castings and secondary burn chamber is still available I'm sure, but they will be expensive. Good luck.

Thank you for sharing your experience! I believe the only leak was at the top left corner, but it looks like I should take off the side plates and reseal them also. Will it be possible to break it down in place as far as the lower plate/legs and reseal all the side plates? I'm pretty confident the ash pan housing is not leaking.

 

[EbS-P]

I dislike these kind of jobs. The ones that if you were to do it a second or third time you could do it so much faster and possibly better. And jobs that have rusty hardware that will break. It’s not that I can’t do it. I’m always pressed for time. I’d probably replace the top gasket out it up for sale and replace it with a PE T5/or T6.

 

[tflt]

I am cleaning up the stove and thinking it looks pretty good.

Until I came across this catastrophe in the top plate, center of the ovel....

What's next, new top plate?
Bah humbug

 

[stovelark]

You can take off the sides and front plate, leaving essentially the rear wall and baseplate/legs/ash housing together. The problem is keeping the rear section stable, thus not breaking the seal of the rear to the baseplate seam. This job is not for everyone. If you are a mechanical person, you can safely and properly re-do your stove. Don't know if Jotul still offers to rebuild it for you, they offered that service years ago. Getting the stove to them is the issue then. For the person with time to do this, it can be done. This stove is about 17 years old, you know how many cords have gone through it. Just know what you're getting into. The bit of good news is the stove will let you know if its sealed by how well the burn can be controlled. Remember too, if you do the rebuild, the first few fires need to be small kindling fires, to dry out the stove cement, and testing that all is well with the unit. Take pics of the breakdown too, to help with re-assembly if its weeks down the road..

 

[stovelark]

Ah yeah- that'll need replacing. Might be good as a start to see the cost of these parts, and making sure they are still available? Might be a while for parts to come in too. The F500 is a super heater, the original Oslo exceeded the planned heat output (it was the Jotul 8's replacement). Soak the hardware for the sideplates now, they are easy to snap off.

 

[tflt]

You can take off the sides and front plate, leaving essentially the rear wall and baseplate/legs/ash housing together. The problem is keeping the rear section stable, thus not breaking the seal of the rear to the baseplate seam. This job is not for everyone. If you are a mechanical person, you can safely and properly re-do your stove. Don't know if Jotul still offers to rebuild it for you, they offered that service years ago. Getting the stove to them is the issue then. For the person with time to do this, it can be done. This stove is about 17 years old, you know how many cords have gone through it. Just know what you're getting into. The bit of good news is the stove will let you know if its sealed by how well the burn can be controlled. Remember too, if you do the rebuild, the first few fires need to be small kindling fires, to dry out the stove cement, and testing that all is well with the unit. Take pics of the breakdown too, to help with re-assembly if its weeks down the road..

Thanks, I'd pull the back also to reseal if I'm taking the sides off. Looks like my top plate is screwed also, (see above new pics...)

 

[begreen]

Sorry to see to the top crack. It might be good to seek out an F500 with a cracked baseplate or cracked back around the flue collar, with a top plate in good condition. Stovelark has given some good advice, inspect the base around the grate area. If it's ok, leave the base alone.

A few more tips. Take lots of pictures at each step of disassembly. These will serve as a visual guide for the reassembly. Use a ratchet strap around the stove as a safety and during rebuild to hold the sides in place. If you can have an assistant, during the rebuild, an extra pair of hands can be helpful. Hearthstone sells a good cement that is similar to the factory Jotul cement. This is available through multiple vendors, like Woodman's.
https://www.woodmanspartsplus.com/product/HearthstoneFurnaceCementforSoapstone

If you want a full, professional rebuild, get in touch with @D. Hermit . It wouldn't hurt to ask if he has a spare top plate.

 

[tflt]

Sorry to see to the top crack. It might be good to seek out an F500 with a cracked baseplate or cracked back around the flue collar, with a top plate in good condition. Stovelark has given some good advice, inspect the base around the grate area. If it's ok, leave the base alone.

A few more tips. Take lots of pictures at each step of disassembly. These will serve as a visual guide for the reassembly. Use a ratchet strap around the stove as a safety and during rebuild to hold the sides in place. If you can have an assistant, during the rebuild, an extra pair of hands can be helpful. Hearthstone sells a good cement that is similar to the factory Jotul cement. This is available through multiple vendors, like Woodman's.
https://www.woodmanspartsplus.com/product/HearthstoneFurnaceCementforSoapstone

If you want a full, professional rebuild, get in touch with @D. Hermit . It wouldn't hurt to ask if he has a spare top plate.

I just added Kingdom Stoves to my contacts! I'll be calling. I see that D.Hermit hasn't been active here in a while.
Thanks for the link, and tips. I'll start getting my ducks in order. The base looks good no cracks from the grate area at least.

 

[tflt]

Sorry to see to the top crack. It might be good to seek out an F500 with a cracked baseplate or cracked back around the flue collar, with a top plate in good condition. Stovelark has given some good advice, inspect the base around the grate area. If it's ok, leave the base alone.

A few more tips. Take lots of pictures at each step of disassembly. These will serve as a visual guide for the reassembly. Use a ratchet strap around the stove as a safety and during rebuild to hold the sides in place. If you can have an assistant, during the rebuild, an extra pair of hands can be helpful. Hearthstone sells a good cement that is similar to the factory Jotul cement. This is available through multiple vendors, like Woodman's.
https://www.woodmanspartsplus.com/product/HearthstoneFurnaceCementforSoapstone

If you want a full, professional rebuild, get in touch with @D. Hermit . It wouldn't hurt to ask if he has a spare top plate.

Sorry, what exactly is "soapstone"? I imagine that's the right cement for the Oslo.

 

[stovelark]

Soapstone is a natural stone that is very aesthetic, wood stove companies use it for the Heat collection media for their stoves (Hearthstone, Woodstock and others). Hearthstone uses their own mix for cementing the slabs of soapstone together, in cast iron framing to form their stove bodies. IIRC, it is a lighter color, whereas regular furnace cement is usually blackish. For Jotuls, we always used Rutland furnace cement in the caulk tubes. I second BG's suggestion too, if you have a helper, it would be ideal. The soapstone stoves have polished outsides and unpolished interiors, Hearthstone slabs were reported to be 1.25" thick.

 

[begreen]

Rutland Furnace cement will work well. It's commonly used here. The Hearthstone cement bonds well. It's white, like the factory cement that Jotul uses, though I don't know if it is the same composition as the Jotul cement. In use, it's smoother and less granular than Rutland. The fiber base resists cracking and it appears to bake harder.

I checked the Jotul spares site in the UK. They sell Vitcas refractory mastic which is sold in white or black.

 

[D. Hermit]

I just added Kingdom Stoves to my contacts! I'll be calling. I see that D.Hermit hasn't been active here in a while.
Thanks for the link, and tips. I'll start getting my ducks in order. The base looks good no cracks from the grate area at least.

Ive been active, just not on here haha. Very busy shop these days.

But yes Im always around. Ill see if maybe BeGreen can update my contact info here and my website on it.

We are in touch now so Ill see what I can see. Thankyou!

 

[begreen]

I just added Kingdom Stoves to my contacts! I'll be calling. I see that D.Hermit hasn't been active here in a while.
Thanks for the link, and tips. I'll start getting my ducks in order. The base looks good no cracks from the grate area at least.

The man knows his Jotuls (Elms too).