Woohoo! Install day...the saga.

[Thislilfishy]

Finally time for my install of a Napoleon 1400PL. I decided to go with Napoleon as the manufacturer is about 45 minutes from my house (Wolf Steel). They have a showroom and do installs directly from the factory location so the price was the best around and I figured the install teams would be very knowledgable about their own product. I decided to build my own hearth pad, as the pre made ceramic tile pads look kinda cheap in my mind, but they sure aren't cheap to buy! The stove only requires ember protection, so based on the instructions in the manual I plotted out my pad location with exactly 1.5" large dimension then required by code as nothing in my house is square.



Now, I have an idea of my sizes, but what to do...just a simple ceramic...then the wife pipes up...let's to flagstone. Ugh, alright. YouTube time. I watch a video of a dufus that puts metal lathe on top of a carpet and lays stone in it. Okay, I am a dufus but surely I can come up with better. The other issue, in that little corner the floor varies by 1 3/4"!! I originally figured I'd screw down some durock but after some thinking I figured it just wouldn't flex THAT much. So what about a thinset leveler. Two problems, I don't think leveler is meant to level that much, and that pine is the subfloor, with lots of big gaps.

...cont.

 

[Randy Acton]

If you have a 1 3/4" difference over that short of a run there must be a problem with the structure.

Floor joists might be bad, beams or supports under problem might be bad.

Adding more weight to that area would not be suggested unless you figure why you have that much sag in the floor

 

[Thislilfishy]

So screw it, I'll take the dufus ideas and modify to suit. First I put down a birch underlay with screw through the subfloor (5/8" pine) and into the joists where possible. Screws at every 6".



Then I laid down metal lath with a 4" overlap on all joining edges. Using the same screws as before placed every 6", effectively now I have screws every 3" through the subfloor and into the joists where applicable. Originally I was going to use flagstone, but after some research I figured what the heck lets see if I can find some soapstone! First phone call and yup! 14-1500 lbs of 1 1/4" soapstone slabs for $250.



Then a tilesaw rental, and a matching template:



My FIRST mistake, if you decide to use this template method, make sure to get those tile setting spacers. So when you lay out your template, it's exact. I didn't and ended up cutting quite a few stones with a hand grinder the next week as I was setting them. This was very difficult. I started by painting the lath/underlay with concrete adhesive. Then mixed a small batch of type N mortar and troweled it into the lath to get it into it completely. Then mixed a large batch of mortar (by hand, this stuff is meant to be a very dry mix and is very tough to do in large batches!!). Then poured small sections at a time, starting at the deepest (2"-1/2") corner and working across. I set one row of stone at a time and coated each stone with concrete adhesive. Then using the same mortar filled the gaps between the stone. And voila!

 

[Thislilfishy]

Randy, yeah there are definitely issues here. There is a new support beam in the basement, and a number of joists where notched to allow the support with out terribly damaging the remaining structure. 3/4's of that pad sits on top of the stone foundation with the subfloor between it and the stone and nothing else. The rest is on the joists, the stone at one joist section is slightly higher then the rest causing a size able hump. It's actually the most solid section if the house right now. There's a very large construction project planned for next year, and that wall of the house is likely being ripped out, except for this corner.

Ian

 

[Thislilfishy]

Installers have the stove placed for measuring the pipe down...it will be moved out a bit more...but it's just for reference now!

 

[spirilis]

That is gorgeous!

 

[Thislilfishy]

Thanks, I have some experience with concrete, but have never worked with stone or tile for that matter. I am moderately happy with the results...but I am bit of a perfectionist, and one stone was a fair bit thinner then the rest and ended up about 1/16-1-8" lower. You can't tell by looking at it, but you can see it when you lay a long level over it.

Ian

 

[DougA]

YIKES 1500 lb of soapstone for $250.

I was looking for some a few weeks back and called around everywhere I could and came up with way more than 10 times that $$$$ for a hearth. I've got a Soapstone stove so I thought it would be awesome to have a soapstone hearth. If you have any left over or know of anyone with more, please PM me as I'm 90 min from you.

BTW, the hearth looks fantastic.

 

[Lockpicker]

Looks nice. Can I suggest a nice trim board to match the flooring wrapped around and flush with the top of the stone. That would really clean it up.

 

[DougA]

Found your ad and I've sent you a reply. Hope we can connect.

 

[Thislilfishy]

Got your mail...sent you my info. Trust me it's hard to find. It was a heck of a trip...thanks for the compliments. To be honest, all told I figure my cost on that was close to $800 maybe more including fuel, saw rental, sandpaper, new sander (my original one exploded!), diamond blades...etc


Lockpicker: Yeah, that's in the works, I wanted to wait to ensure the mortar cured fully (it shrinks a bit as it cures). Then sand it smooth and wrap it in some cedar.

 

[Simonkenton]

"...metal lathe on top of carpet, stone on top of the metal lathe..." Yes, that guy is a dufus.

 

[mstoelton]

I was looking for some a few weeks back and called around everywhere I could and came up with way more than 10 times that $$$$ for a hearth. I've got a Soapstone stove so I thought it would be awesome to have a soapstone hearth. If you have any left over or know of anyone with more, please PM me as I'm 90 min from you.

try here:http://www.alberenesoapstone.com

I got my soapstone hearth from here and it is really nice- 22" x 7' long about $500 shipped from Virginia to Michigan.

 

[Thislilfishy]

Except we're in canada...so multiply everything by 2.

But wow! Those DIY kits are awesome prices!

 

[Thislilfishy]

Bad news...install won't be complete today. They were short a part(a sealed box was missing the ceiling adapter). Also they need to add two more sections for the roof clearance plus the associated support rods. I was frustrated at first, but I'd rather have it done right then done quickly. I have a good feeling about the installer though. His most used tool was his tape measure, I watched him measure, measure, re measure, adjust a little bit and measure again throughout the day.

 

[wenger7446]

You will love your 1400. I have one myself.

 

[firefighterjake]

Great looking hearth.

 

[fossil]

"...metal lathe on top of carpet, stone on top of the metal lathe..." Yes, that guy is a dufus.

Well, speaking of doofuses...a "lathe" is a turning machine for wood or metal working. A "lath" is a thin flat strip of wood or metal used as a substrate for plaster or mortar.
Sorry to put my spelling police hat on, but I'm just so-o-o-o-o tired of this particular simple error.

OK, carry on.

 

[Thislilfishy]

Well, speaking of doofuses...a "lathe" is a turning machine for wood or metal working. A "lath" is a thin flat strip of wood or metal used as a substrate for plaster or mortar.
Sorry to put my spelling police hat on, but I'm just so-o-o-o-o tired of this particular simple error.

OK, carry on.

Haha! Thanks, I was having trouble with that word. Let's just call it metal meshy stuff then!

Thanks all, I am certain the 1400 will more then heat this house. Just my wife baking brings the temp up several degrees on the main floor, but the second floor stays cold. Thinking the 1400 will have the main floor roasting and the second floor warm.

We were going to get the BK Princess but with a $7000 installed cost, we opted for the budget stove. It shows some cost cutting measures here and there, but still looks well built. The welds are all very well done and it feels solid.

My hearth build got a good test. The two installers were standing on the stove, and the pad didn't crack or creak or anything under the legs of the stove. The installer is also the inspector and he complemented me on how solid it is...if this old house collapses, that hearth pad will still be there!

Ian

 

[fossil]

Let's just call it metal meshy stuff then!

Works for me

 

[DougA]

Just wanted to report that I connected with Ian that night. My Garmin took me down the 'snowmobile path' which would have been fun in the daylight and without hauling a trailer. It reminded me of the switchbacks and no shoulders in Italy. Going home the correct way was much easier.

I ended up buying all the soapstone he had left for my hearth. Hopefully, I can sell what I don't need and end up with zero cost also.

After a bit of nervousness, Ian got the skid with the soapstone lifted onto my trailer with his tractor/loader. If I thought the soapstone wasn't heavy prior to this, the rear wheels on the tractor were up in the air and the skid was only about 9" high with soapstone. We got home safe & sound and I'll be getting the hearth done as soon as the wall behind it gets finished - maybe today.

Thanks Ian. Sorry didn't have time to see your stove. Maybe another time.

 

[Thislilfishy]

I wouldn't say zero cost...there will be plenty to pay with sore muscles!

Those snowmobiles trails are typically the only way in and out through the winter as all the main roads remain closed. But they sure can be a challenge. Living up in truck country we assume everyone owns at least one truck...but we are a bit isolated. Things would have gone a lot more smoothly if we could see what we were doing...but it got done. Even my grumpy neighbor has a good laugh at our expense. You must post some pics of your finish work, I expect it to be nicer then my work.

Goodish news in the install, I went directly to the managers office in the show room, they weren't even aware that the install was incomplete (admittedly they were swamped in there, tis the season for them I suppose). After a slightly heated discussion my install should be completed Wednesday. I complemented the installer on the quality of his work, but gave them crap for grossly underestimating the amount of work required. Having spent the last 20 years in construction I had a feeling it couldn't possibly be a one day job...got my fingers crossed.

Ian

 

[OhioBurner©]

Looks terrific! I hope someday to build a new hearth, and perhaps a greater part of a new house or remodel. Just wouldn't be feasible trying to redo whats in this one, and its mostly fine I just get sick of red brick everywhere.

 

[Thislilfishy]

Looks terrific! I hope someday to build a new hearth, and perhaps a greater part of a new house or remodel. Just wouldn't be feasible trying to redo whats in this one, and its mostly fine I just get sick of red brick everywhere.

Haha, I am glad Doug bought my stone, my neighbor was asking if I could cover her brick hearth with it. She's a cute neighbor and all, but not THaT cute!

Ian

 

[firefighterjake]

Just wanted to report that I connected with Ian that night. My Garmin took me down the 'snowmobile path' which would have been fun in the daylight and without hauling a trailer. It reminded me of the switchbacks and no shoulders in Italy. Going home the correct way was much easier.. . ..

Wouldn't be the first time I've seen someone's GPSr steer them wrong . . . going down a one way street, getting stuck in middle of a snowmobile trail . . . in the winter . . . with the trail covered in snow. At least you had the excuse that it was night and there was no groomed sled trail.