Jotul Oslo F500 V3 air leaks

[VTSR5]

Well, I thought the community might like to know about some issues with my brand new Jotul F500 V3 Oslo from the Chimney Sweep Fireplace Shop in Shelburne, Vermont. I've spoken with my salesman by phone, and he was accomodating, but no action plan as of yet, so I wrote them today to make a formal request for replacement under warranty. Here's an excerpt:

I would appreciate your help in processing a warranty claim on my new Jotul Oslo V3. Here are the issues:

(1) With small fires, the stove operates as expected and functions well enough. However, with a large load of fuel, such as for an overnight burn, the stove burns very aggressively and quickly, even when the primary air control is in the fully leftward position (closed). These are full loads of fuel, maybe four splits, but I am not coming close to packing every inch of the firebox in these kinds of burns. For example, no fuel against the front glass or touching the burn tubes of the top of the firebox. This burn will get extremely hot and last about four hours leaving a handful of embers. Nowhere near enough to last the night, and therefore not very useful.

(2) I attribute this to at least two uncontrolled air leaks that I am aware of, detailed in the photos attached. Both these areas will draw smoke from an incense stick into the stove in a very clear-cut and obvious way. The main leak seems to be 5 inches or so of the joint where the right end plate meets the front panel, near where the Jotul logo appears. The gap between the end panel and the front panel is not uniform, and is 1/8 inch larger at the top than at the bottom. The second leak I have found is on the curved portion of the ash door. This area easily passes a dollar bill when closed, and also draws smoke into the stove.

(3) After its first several fires I noticed that the stove had leaked a black material onto the hearth. The leak appears to come from the bottom of the stove, at the back. My fuel was well dried and my chimney very clean. I don't see that the problem has continued, and I am not concerned about the staining of the hearth, but I wonder if this staining indicates that some sealant material leaked out and created another uncontrolled air path into the stove?

In my opinion, as a wood burner for over forty years, this stove is much too loose and not operating as designed or intended. It burns much too fast, and much too quickly to be useful in the Vermont winter climate. I think it is a case of defective materials and/or workmanship, and I would like you to replace the stove with another new Oslo that we can inspect together at your location prior to delivery. Please let me have your response to that request in writing.

PS. My chimney consists of six feet of 6" double-wall black pipe, transitioning to twenty feet of 8" ID Metalbestos, all in a straight run. The chimney is very clean and passed a level 2 inspection just prior to installation of the stove in September.

 

[begreen]

Sorry to see these issues happening. It looks like the right panel is a misfit. That's uncommon. The ashpan sealing issue was reported a short while ago and may be a design flaw.

#3, the brown/black fluid is from moisture bleeding out from the refractory cement. It is common enough with new Jotul stoves that they ought to put a note in the manual and suggest putting a pan under the back of the stove during break-in. We had it with our F400. Once the moisture has been boiled off, it does not return. Hearthstone uses a similar cement and also sometimes their stoves bleed too when new.

 

[VTSR5]

Thanks, Begreen. What more do you know about the ash door issue? Has anything been posted on this?

 

[begreen]

Yes, webby3650 posted an update on observations with their store stove in which he mentioned that they noticed that one needed to be extra sure that the ash pan door be tightly closed.

Flue damper on a Jotul F500 V3

I'm having a new one installed soon, and after reading so many posts about inability to shut air down low enough...I bought an in-line flue damper. Simple 6" butterfly valve...purpose made for job. The insert I took out drafted great, and also had issues not being shut down enough, for a long...

www.hearth.com

 

[RSNovi]

I also had the initial black/brown liquid puddle on the floor on both my F500 stoves. It went away after the first season. Maybe even after the first few burns.

 

[VTSR5]

Thank you for the info. The black liquid doesn’t seem to be an ongoing problem, and so far I am detecting no air leaks in that area. Quite a few burns in this stove now, maybe 25 or so. The air leaks at the Ash store and upper right front panel seem remain significant problems I think.

 

[VTSR5]

Well, I thought the community might like to know about some issues with my brand new Jotul F500 V3 Oslo from the Chimney Sweep Fireplace Shop in Shelburne, Vermont. I've spoken with my salesman by phone, and he was accomodating, but no action plan as of yet, so I wrote them today to make a formal request for replacement under warranty...

UPDATE: Chimney Sweep Fireplace Shop scheduled a field service technician, Mark, to assess my Jotul Oslo V3 today. He was great; punctual, knowledgeable, professional. I had let the stove burn out over night and cleaned it out before his arrival. Mark spent 10 minutes or so visually inspecting the cold stove, then built a small fire of two medium splits. He easily replicated the conditions I had identified, and then confirmed my findings of two principal air leaks, one at the curve of the ash door, and another significant one at the joint where the right end panel meets the front panel. He said it is a matter for the Jotul rep to work out with the store, but his recommendation is to pull the stove and either repair or replace it. Here's the great part, though: Mark regasketed the ash door, then jammed some gasket material into the leaky joint between the front panel and the right hand end panel. The stove instantly began behaving better, and the fire now responds dramatically to movements of the front air control. Smoke test revealed that both air leaks were eliminated this way (as a temporary fix). With the firebox at about 1/3 full, I can tell the stove is behaving MUCH better than it has for the past 60 days.

CONCLUSION: If your flue is not unusually long but you are still having sub-par performance with your Jotul Oslo V3 that manifests itself as overly hot, fast-burning, difficult to control fires, and disappointingly short burn times, especially when the firebox is loaded over 2/3, then look carefully for air leaks.

NEXT STEPS: I'm pleased with the service from Chimney Sweep Fireplace Shop in Shelburne, Vermont so far in response to my complaints about defects in my brand new Jotul Oslo V3 as detailed in post #1 above. It took them about a month to get a technician here after they received my written complaint, but that's not a problem for me -- I know it is peak season for them. What remains to be seen is how well the dealer and Jotul will resolve the issue. I'll post a follow up about that when I have more information. Until then, the temporary fix seems to have tamed the stove considerably. I'll update that also when I get a chance to burn an overnight fire, maybe tonight! Here's a photo of the stove burning nicely on low air. Zoom in to see the gasket material stuffed into the gap at the right hand side of the stove.

 

[acesneights1]

I'm not sure what version my stove it but it's about 15-16 yrs old (same model) and dojng the same thing your is. I doubt mine has any warranty so I'll try what you did as a temp fix for a permanent fix.

 

[VTSR5]

My suggestion would be first re-gasket the doors, including the Ash door. Then build a small fire and test the quality of the seal on those doors using an incense stick. Then go around the rest of the stove with the incense stick checking carefully for uncontrolled leaks at the joints. I haven’t owned a Jotul before so I can’t say for certain, but based on my experiences with other brands, a 15 year old stove that’s assembled from cast-iron panels and seen a lit of use is probably due for a rebuild and resealing.

 

[CSJ_PA]

UPDATE: Chimney Sweep Fireplace Shop scheduled a field service technician, Mark, to assess my Jotul Oslo V3 today. He was great; punctual, knowledgeable, professional. I had let the stove burn out over night and cleaned it out before his arrival. Mark spent 10 minutes or so visually inspecting the cold stove, then built a small fire of two medium splits. He easily replicated the conditions I had identified, and then confirmed my findings of two principal air leaks, one at the curve of the ash door, and another significant one at the joint where the right end panel meets the front panel. He said it is a matter for the Jotul rep to work out with the store, but his recommendation is to pull the stove and either repair or replace it. Here's the great part, though: Mark regasketed the ash door, then jammed some gasket material into the leaky joint between the front panel and the right hand end panel. The stove instantly began behaving better, and the fire now responds dramatically to movements of the front air control. Smoke test revealed that both air leaks were eliminated this way (as a temporary fix). With the firebox at about 1/3 full, I can tell the stove is behaving MUCH better than it has for the past 60 days.

CONCLUSION: If your flue is not unusually long but you are still having sub-par performance with your Jotul Oslo V3 that manifests itself as overly hot, fast-burning, difficult to control fires, and disappointingly short burn times, especially when the firebox is loaded over 2/3, then look carefully for air leaks.

NEXT STEPS: I'm pleased with the service from Chimney Sweep Fireplace Shop in Shelburne, Vermont so far in response to my complaints about defects in my brand new Jotul Oslo V3 as detailed in post #1 above. It took them about a month to get a technician here after they received my written complaint, but that's not a problem for me -- I know it is peak season for them. What remains to be seen is how well the dealer and Jotul will resolve the issue. I'll post a follow up about that when I have more information. Until then, the temporary fix seems to have tamed the stove considerably. I'll update that also when I get a chance to burn an overnight fire, maybe tonight! Here's a photo of the stove burning nicely on low air. Zoom in to see the gasket material stuffed into the gap at the right hand side of the stove.

View attachment 287238

I am about 3 months in on burning my new Jotul F500 v3 and have air leaks around my ashpan door as well. Do you happen to know what diameter gasket your stove tech used when he regasketed your door for you? Did he do anything special? Use a larger diameter than what was originally installed?

 

[VTSR5]

I don’t have the spec, but he told me it was a larger diameter gasket than originally installed. No other techniques observed.

 

[CSJ_PA]

I don’t have the spec, but he told me it was a larger diameter gasket than originally installed. No other techniques observed.

Great, thanks for that info. I know the original installed version is 3/8" on the ashpan door. I will give some 5/8" a try.

 

[MR. GLO]

I had a new stove from jotul and had same issues. I sent it back. They fought for a while but the co2 in the house forced them to take it back.

I own a pe summit now and will never buy a stove with a ashpan again.

All these stove manufactures are hiding behind dealers and many dealers can't even rebuild or fix a stove or know how to check draft.



#senditback

 

[CSJ_PA]

Great, thanks for that info. I know the original installed version is 3/8" on the ashpan door. I will give some 5/8" a try.

View attachment 289578

Update:. 5/8 inch was too large, 1/2 inch worked perfectly. Totally sealed the ashpan door, zero leaks. Also, I covered the two small unregulated holes on the side of the ash house with magnets as someone recommended. Wow, with both fixes the control has been tremendous, it burns like a totally different stove.

 

[daltojoh]

Great, thanks for that info. I know the original installed version is 3/8" on the ashpan door. I will give some 5/8" a try.

View attachment 289578

I just had the F 500 V3 installed and after break in burns ran it for first time last night. I had to leave my damper all the way closed and was still at 900-1100 temp on the cat probe. Is it normal to have the damper lever all the way closed or is it air leaking in you think? Newer to this stove so curious what "good" looks like. Thank you

 

[bigealta]

Update:. 5/8 inch was too large, 1/2 inch worked perfectly. Totally sealed the ashpan door, zero leaks. Also, I covered the two small unregulated holes on the side of the ash house with magnets as someone recommended. Wow, with both fixes the control has been tremendous, it burns like a totally different stove.

Wow... All i can say is this site is awesome. Some guys here figure out fixes for what no one else seems to be able to figure out, and stove owners go from massive frustration and disappointment, to elated to have a great heating machine and burning experience!

Jotul should be reading these threads and putting out an Update trouble shooting repair bulletin.

Already quite a few new and existing oslo owners here have transformed their problem stoves.

 

[EbS-P]

Wow... All i can say is this site is awesome. Some guys here figure out fixes for what no one else seems to be able to figure out, and stove owners go from massive frustration and disappointment, to elated to have a great heating machine and burning experience!

Jotul should be reading these threads and putting out an Update trouble shooting repair bulletin.

Already quite a few new and existing oslo owners here have transformed their problem stoves.

Except it’s not permitted to alter the burn rate. So manufacturers won’t say a thing.

 

[bigealta]

Except it’s not permitted to alter the burn rate. So manufacturers won’t say a thing.

Yup, Very Unfortunate. Need a rethink on the rules. Obviously some flexibility with performance issues should be allowed. And certain problem stoves allowed to be "modified" or in the gasket case simply corrected.

Something like, if draft is over a certain rate, ashpan air holes are allowed or even recommended to be covered.
If ashpan doors leak air, gasket recommended to be replaced by a larger size.

 

[Todd]

I just had the F 500 V3 installed and after break in burns ran it for first time last night. I had to leave my damper all the way closed and was still at 900-1100 temp on the cat probe. Is it normal to have the damper lever all the way closed or is it air leaking in you think? Newer to this stove so curious what "good" looks like. Thank you

Sounds like normal cat temps. 1600+ is too hot and will start to degrade it.

 

[daltojoh]

Sounds like normal cat temps. 1600+ is too hot and will start to degrade it.

I was hoping to hit that sweet spot of 600-800 if that means it burns more efficiently. What about the damper being in the all the way closed position. Its obviously getting air somewhere because of possible air leaks in my opinion. Curious what others are seeing for "normal"

 

[CSJ_PA]

I was hoping to hit that sweet spot of 600-800 if that means it burns more efficiently. What about the damper being in the all the way closed position. Its obviously getting air somewhere because of possible air leaks in my opinion. Curious what others are seeing for "normal"

My setup. I have ~29ft flue, I have a butterfly damper about 24" up from stove top, and a flue temp (internal, not a surface temp) gauge. I replaced the ash pan door seal with 1/2 rope vice the 3/8 standard and the two small holes to the left and right side of the ash house (you can see them by looking at the bottom right and left of the stove) covered with a small ferrite magnet. I start my fire with the flue damper fully open and the primary air lever open (small lever in the front of the stove). I don't change anything with air flow until my flue temp reads over 400 and my cat is above 600. At that point I bring my primary air lever closed to half or quarter open, let it settle for a min, and depending on wood type, can burn there without touching my flue damper (flue temp 350-450/cat temp 800-1100, and it will generally cruze there until it needs more fuel). Once I burn for a few days or until I get a really solid bed of hot coals, and the draft starts kicking hard, I will slowly, very very slightly start to augment draft with my key damper until I get the lazy flame look again, all while keeping primary air lever almost closed. I will also use my key damper to augment draft when I feel like my cat is climbing faster than my stove/flue temps. This stove gets air from a few different locations (you can only control 1), the air intake from the back is controlled with a cable attached to a thermostat on the back of the stove (steel cable in the back).

My flue temps/stove temps are too cold when the cat reads 600, the sweat spot for me is 800-1000 at the cat, fwiw.

 

[Sailrmike]

Wow... All i can say is this site is awesome. Some guys here figure out fixes for what no one else seems to be able to figure out, and stove owners go from massive frustration and disappointment, to elated to have a great heating machine and burning experience!

Jotul should be reading these threads and putting out an Update trouble shooting repair bulletin.

Already quite a few new and existing oslo owners here have transformed their problem stoves.

What would be awesome is if the manufacturer would just give up on trying to make this box pass emissions. Needs a complete redesign IMHO

 

[bigealta]

What would be awesome is if the manufacturer would just give up on trying to make this box pass emissions. Needs a complete redesign IMHO

The “One size fits all” designs on some of these stoves is just too difficult. A stove with a 16ft chimney will perform very differently than the same one with a 29ft chimney. There needs to be better allowance / adjustments for different installations.

 

[VTSR5]

I just had the F 500 V3 installed and after break in burns ran it for first time last night. I had to leave my damper all the way closed and was still at 900-1100 temp on the cat probe. Is it normal to have the damper lever all the way closed or is it air leaking in you think? Newer to this stove so curious what "good" looks like. Thank you

That does not seem out of line for the cat probe for a well established fire in the Oslo V3. When you close the primary air control all the way, how does the fire behave? Mine, which I know has multiple uncontrolled air leaks, remains burning pretty fast with bright yellow flames. A proper tight stove should slow way down to slowly rolling flames with elements of blue or purple color, with lots of evident flame activity in the secondary burn tubes at the top of the fire box.

 

[stoveliker]

I just had the F 500 V3 installed and after break in burns ran it for first time last night. I had to leave my damper all the way closed and was still at 900-1100 temp on the cat probe. Is it normal to have the damper lever all the way closed or is it air leaking in you think? Newer to this stove so curious what "good" looks like. Thank you

If you close the air, you are creating a lot of fuel (half burned gases) for the cat, and this the cat tends to get hotter when you do that.

If you close the air all the way, there should be no flames. If there are, you may have a leak.