Trying to avoid my 3rd cold winter...

[TennesseeJake]

OK, so I am a big forum browser, but this is my first post ever. Someone please let me know if this is in the wrong section.

So here is my deal... I built a barn 3 years ago that is also my apartment. I had always wanted to have hydronic heat, and thought that since I have an almost endless supply of hardwood scraps at my disposal, a wood boiler would be best. I have the Orlan Eko 40 sitting in place. I ran 1/2" oxygen barrier pex on 12" centers in my slab and put 2" closed cell foam underneath and on the edges. I ran these in 280' loops and back to 2 manifolds for the 2 zones.

So there are two zones (Apartment & Shop):

Apartment is 2 stories, concrete downstairs, and wood floors upstairs (i made metal 'fins' and ran them over the pex on that loop). Whole thing is 2x6 walls R40 and R50 ceiling.

Shop is just one story with 16" ceilings, and not the greatest insulation. However I am not trying to get it up to room temp really, just want it a little more comfortable.

That being said, I have done almost all the work myself, but tried to hire a guy who was going to get my system turned on, and he ended up making all kinds of ridiculous errors, and basically just robbed me of $1,500. His name is James Lasater for anyone in the Nashville area. At least I was left with a little copper and a Taco Pump...

So I am about to cut all his piping out, and start over myself. I am thinking of about 500 gal storage, but not positive. I was planning a closed system, and this is the primary and only heat source. I have forced air run in the apartment for backup, and am not totally concerned about it working perfectly in there, but would LOVE some warmth in the shop.

I am posting some photos of the botched work from the guy I hired, and of my manifolds. I can also post photos of my schematics and other information. I just would greatly appreciate all of your knowledge because I know alot of people on here have real-world experience, and know that this can work!!

Thank you for all the knowledge y'all have already given me even though I have been silent until now!
Best regards, Jake

 

[huffdawg]

Hard to tell by that pic. what is botched aside from the untidy pex. If you have plenty of space , go with 1000 gals of storage and insulate well. you will be glad you added the extra 500 gals. You will have no problems getting help on here , whether it be from skilled members that work in the HVAC trade or DIY'ers.. The eko 40 comes with some good tips in the manual . There are some good write ups in the sticky section also.
Primary secondary piping for boilers. and
Simplest Pressurized Storage System Design

I did mine a little different you can see a real time drawing of it here (broken link removed)

It is basically a primary secondary system, with the hydraulic separator tank being the primary loop.

Where are you planning to put the boiler and storage?
You will need 1-1/4 minimum for your near boiler piping and your supply and return from storage.. A danfoss boiler protection valve should have come with the eko and a honeywell air scrubber.
Some form of an expansion tank... rule of thumb is 10% of system volume or there are expansion calculators avialable online.
Best thing to do is post some diagrams of how you want or think you need to pipe it and the guys here will give you helpful criticism and point you in the right direction. Seems like you have done a lot of the work already .
Huff

 

[TennesseeJake]

Thank you Huff. I appreciate the reply, and good advice.

To answer the boiler and storage question:
I was planning on putting them in the heated area of the shop just for energy efficiency / less piping, but I would rather have them in the unheated section of the shop or even outside... just thought that in the shop would be easier to maintain and pipe. Do you have any recommendation based on the floor plan drawing? The unheated storage side of the barn is wide open as well...

I will plan on a 1000 gallon storage tank. Any recommendations on one vs. two? any supplier recommendation?

I am attaching what I think my system would be below, and ideas are welcome!! Thank you again.
Jake

 

[TennesseeJake]

You will need 1-1/4 minimum for your near boiler piping and your supply and return from storage.. A danfoss boiler protection valve should have come with the eko and a honeywell air scrubber.

Neither came with it unless they are built in where I don't see them...

Should I switch from black iron to copper immediately at the boiler?
Do you know of any photos of the EKO 40 or a similar situation to mine for a visual...

Your real-time website is incredible!!
I would LOVE that, do you market that service? All I can say is wow.

 

[711mhw]

Are you not running now at all?
I have a very similar building as yours.

 

[TennesseeJake]

not running yet!

 

[huffdawg]

Neither came with it unless they are built in where I don't see them...

Should I switch from black iron to copper immediately at the boiler?
Do you know of any photos of the EKO 40 or a similar situation to mine for a visual...

Your real-time website is incredible!!
I would LOVE that, do you market that service? All I can say is wow.

Hi TJ. You don't have to switch at all, copper is more expensive but looks a lot nicer and is a lot easier to work with than black iron.

The chap that designs and sells the controller is a member on this site (NoFossil) his website is http://vecs.org/ go to the site and you will be able to contact him from there .. Very good guy...

The controller is very handy for me as I work a way from home 50% of life and I can monitor and change parameters.

When I ordered my eko 40 it came with a taco 007 circ. pump and a honeywell air ejector . You can order them online from pexsupply.com or other similar suppliers.

Huff

 

[huffdawg]

Thank you Huff. I appreciate the reply, and good advice.

To answer the boiler and storage question:
I was planning on putting them in the heated area of the shop just for energy efficiency / less piping, but I would rather have them in the unheated section of the shop or even outside... just thought that in the shop would be easier to maintain and pipe. Do you have any recommendation based on the floor plan drawing? The unheated storage side of the barn is wide open as well...

I will plan on a 1000 gallon storage tank. Any recommendations on one vs. two? any supplier recommendation?

I am attaching what I think my system would be below, and ideas are welcome!! Thank you again.
Jake

One word of caution, at least with my EKO is I have had some troubles with the door seals .. They leak smoke . I have my boiler in a room attached to the back of my shop so its not to big a deal... I personally would not put an EKO in my living or working space. I know Stee , who' s a member on this forum has his in his basement and he says he has no problems with smoke leakage. The choice is yours. Also if you plan to heat your dhw through the summer months you prolly don't want the boiler and tanks in the space either.. My Storage tanks are in my shop, I insulated them very well. 3 inches of closed cell foam and then surrounded by lots of fiberglass batts.
If you could mount a 1000 gal tank vertically that would be the best as far as stratification goes. Both of my 500 gal tanks are vertical , it all depends if you have the height for it or not..
Don't take my word as gospel though I am not a professional. I work at a job where I get a bit of hands on experience at lot of different skills that are useful for doing this type of stuff.. Also I wouldn't have the system I got without all the help I received from the members of this forum.
For me it was a lot of fun and personally satisfying when all was said and done.



Huff

 

[TennesseeJake]

Huff: thank you for all the help.

Will these two parts work for the relief valve and pump? not sure why relief valves have such a huge price range...
Should I just stick with 1 1/4" copper all the way to the manifolds, or does that not really matter?

http://www.supplyhouse.com/Watts-0382008-3-4-Boiler-Pressure-Relief-Valve-30-psi

http://www.supplyhouse.com/Taco-007-F5-007-Cast-Iron-Circulator-1-25-HP-1983000-p

I would love to see a photo if possible to know where to put the air scrubber, and boiler protection valve (is that the 30 PSI relief valve?)

 

[huffdawg]

I put my air scrubber about 2 feet down stream from the boiler output... I don't think it is technically in the right spot according to the pundits but its working and I am pretty sure many have them in the same location. Others will correct me if I'm wrong but I think the optimum spot for them is the suction side of the boiler pump.

I am pretty sure I have the same pressure relief, you just need to reduce down from a tee or get a tee that is already reduced down to 1"

The pump is also the same as I used but I am not sure if the one in that link has an internal flow check... might be a good idea for all your pumps.... stops media from flowing the wrong way when pumps are off ( I think ghost flows is the correct terminology) .. If I was to change my taco 007 boiler circ pump out right now I would put delta t bumble bee , wilo or grundfos alpha ..
I am away at work right now and cant find the correct pic to give you .. I will try to see if my wife will take some pics for me .

 

[NateB]

Here is my supply side I am working on
(broken image removed)