Woodstock Progress video

[Battenkiller]

Haven't yet put the Fireview up for sale. Holy cow, we just got home! Will keep you posted though but to be completely honest, we still are unsure about our needs for this winter after all the remodeling has finally been completed, or at least that part which will be affected for heating purposes. If it turns out that the Progress will be too large then we'll keep the Fireview. But I am really impressed with this new stove and that is why I could not leave without putting down a deposit.

Dennis, if I remember right you have a rather smallish home. We are looking for a smaller home, say a 1200 sq.ft. ranch sitting on a full insulated basement. What's your gut say about a Progress in a home like that, based on your experience with the Fireview?

Geez, I can't believe I've actually accepted the name of this stove now. I guess stoves are like women. You might not want a blind date with a gal named "Butch", but when she turns out to look like Charlize Theron, it's suddenly the prettiest name on Earth.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Oslo, the dedicated crew were working right up to the start of the party to get those 2 stoves out there. I know they worked well past normal quitting hours getting ready for this thing. I was anxious to see the final product and was amazed to see what they ended up with. There will still be improvements and many are in the works. Us early buyers will not be left out on those improvements either.

 

[Battenkiller]

I wonder if the 60 per week is based on man power or facility space?

Not sure, but I'd guess it is an estimate based on both factors. However, if Tom is only producing 40/week right now while employing a work force that could build 60/week... he ain't as smart a business man as we all know he is.

From the looks of the place, there are only so many drilling and milling stations, assembly stations, storage racks, R&D area, office space, showroom, etc. There is always a physical limit that you will run into in any production facility. Who knows? Maybe 100/wk? Can't imagine that place handling much more than that, but what do I know about stove manufacturing?

Also, maybe Tom doesn't really want to expand that much. I know some guys who run a small but state-of-the-art vacuum infusion canoe plant. They have a plan to expand up to 200 boats a year, but beyond that, the business model is to keep production the same but increase the price. There was also a great New Hampshire guitar maker (Gurian Guitars) that was doing quite well in a small facility in Hinsdale. When the place burned to the ground they use the insurance money to build a huge plant in Keene. Five years later they were out of business.

Greed can get in your way in business and you can lose it all. Guys get into businesses like this as much for the lifestyle as for getting rich. Money doesn't turn every head. Pride in your accomplishments and maintaining both personal and professional integrity is much more important to some. I don't think I'd be far off the mark to say that Woodstock is probably guided more by those ideals than by money.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Not one of the workers but I think it may have been Tom that said maybe 4-6 per day on building the new stoves. Time will tell there.

Battenkiller, it will still depend upon insulation, windows, doors, etc. but right now I feel if we'd have bought the Progress rather than the Fireview (which we could not have done) that the Progress would have been fine albeit perhaps a little large. What counts most is how the stove will perform during January and February nights when it is cold every night. The longer burn will be the best part as during the extreme cold if we crank the stove up, I do put wood in the Fireview during the night. That usually is not a problem as guys our age have a tendency to be getting up nights for other things so it is natural to check on the stove. If need be, we can throw a couple splits in.

One other thing is that we do not like the big temperature swings and strive to keep the house at a more even temperature. I think that will become much easier with the new stove.


Of course, when we bought the Fireview we had been burning wood up to 23" in length. Now all our wood is around 16" and the Progress will take the 23". Some times things just work out that way. But the wrong size in small won't be much of a problem as we can stand some on end to finish filling the stove.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

I wonder if the 60 per week is based on man power or facility space?

Not sure, but I'd guess it is an estimate based on both factors. However, if Tom is only producing 40/week right now while employing a work force that could build 60/week... he ain't as smart a business man as we all know he is.

From the looks of the place, there are only so many drilling and milling stations, assembly stations, storage racks, R&D area, office space, showroom, etc. There is always a physical limit that you will run into in any production facility. Who knows? Maybe 100/wk? Can't imagine that place handling much more than that, but what do I know about stove manufacturing?

Also, maybe Tom doesn't really want to expand that much. I know some guys who run a small but state-of-the-art vacuum infusion canoe plant. They have a plan to expand up to 200 boats a year, but beyond that, the business model is to keep production the same but increase the price. There was also a great New Hampshire guitar maker (Gurian Guitars) that was doing quite well in a small facility in Hinsdale. When the place burned to the ground they use the insurance money to build a huge plant in Keene. Five years later they were out of business.

Greed can get in your way in business and you can lose it all. Guys get into businesses like this as much for the lifestyle as for getting rich. Money doesn't turn every head. Pride in your accomplishments and maintaining both personal and professional integrity is much more important to some. I don't think I'd be far off the mark to say that Woodstock is probably guided more by those ideals than by money.

Methinks you are right about Tom. I don't think greed affects him as it does so many. I got to talk with him much more this year and found out a few interesting things and got more insight into his ideas.

One also needs to know that it is just now that they are getting all the castings so that they can build the new stove. The castings has held them up longer than they figured and also the EPA testing held them up a lot. It appears the shop is ready to get these things into production for sure. I do not know if they can add more stations or not but looking at the shop, I think they could add some without adding space. Also, the sales of the other stoves will no doubt decrease as the orders for the Progress increase.

 

[Todd]

Thanks Todd. There are many new things in the works at Woodstock but I'm not sure just how much should be let out at this time. I will answer a few questions when I find that thread where I asked for questions to ask Woodstock. I heard there were some questions posted while we were on the road. I'm slow, but I'll get caught up soon....I hope.

Spill your guts Dennis, we would all like to know what's in the works for the future of Woodstock. I would think if Tom told you something he figured your more or less an Ambassador for hearth.com and would pass it on.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Thanks Todd. There are many new things in the works at Woodstock but I'm not sure just how much should be let out at this time. I will answer a few questions when I find that thread where I asked for questions to ask Woodstock. I heard there were some questions posted while we were on the road. I'm slow, but I'll get caught up soon....I hope.

Spill your guts Dennis, we would all like to know what's in the works for the future of Woodstock. I would think if Tom told you something he figured your more or less an Ambassador for hearth.com and would pass it on.

I agree with this. Don't be a tease. Spill it Dennis.

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

Thanks Todd. There are many new things in the works at Woodstock but I'm not sure just how much should be let out at this time. I will answer a few questions when I find that thread where I asked for questions to ask Woodstock. I heard there were some questions posted while we were on the road. I'm slow, but I'll get caught up soon....I hope.

Spill your guts Dennis, we would all like to know what's in the works for the future of Woodstock. I would think if Tom told you something he figured your more or less an Ambassador for hearth.com and would pass it on.

I agree with this. Don't be a tease. Spill it Dennis.

He's been sworn to secrecy.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Thanks Todd. There are many new things in the works at Woodstock but I'm not sure just how much should be let out at this time. I will answer a few questions when I find that thread where I asked for questions to ask Woodstock. I heard there were some questions posted while we were on the road. I'm slow, but I'll get caught up soon....I hope.

Spill your guts Dennis, we would all like to know what's in the works for the future of Woodstock. I would think if Tom told you something he figured your more or less an Ambassador for hearth.com and would pass it on.

I agree with this. Don't be a tease. Spill it Dennis.

He's been sworn to secrecy.

Then why bring it up?

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

They may have to open up a second plant just to make these stoves to keep up with demand. maybe not...

One of the workers told me they could produce about 60/week and are currently at about 40/week or so (if I'm remembering correctly). That leaves room for only 1000 more stoves a year unless they ramp up their operation there. If this new stove really takes off, maybe it will force their hand into building a second plant. Not sure how eager they'd be to do that after just burning their mortgage last year. If it was my place I'd just hit max capacity and then bump the price up over time and reap in the extra profits.

Uh... not that they should listen to anything I say. :shut:

BK, you know someone in the PR department is looking at these posts.
Depending on the feedback they get on these first 250 hybrids, this will determine what kind of marketing campaign they search for.
I can imagine word of mouth alone might make this new stove be a mucho wanted item. Price might scare people away after the
introductory price goes away.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Woodstock will be monitoring the feedback from this stove really close and hopefully people will cooperate to give them good feedback; positive or negative. That can only help others down the road along with helping Woodstock.

There are some new stoves in the works along with some possible reworking of some of the present stoves. How about a boxwood stove? Someone had posted that in the "ask" thread we had and yes, one is in the works. I really like the idea of reworking the firebox door handles and told Tom that is one of the big things I keep hearing. Most also know about the thermostat controls they are working on and that could be big for sure. But all in all I expect the number one thing will be this new Progress stove and feel they will put the most emphasis on this stove which is good. It could be the start of something really big and I wonder how other stove manufacturers now feel about this new technology? Perhaps other new ideas will also come from this and other companies will come out with new things which will help all of us.

 

[bjkjoseph]

a problem that i have with the fireview is that when i reload,or on start up it smokes like hell..even though its not long the whiney neighbors whine and whine like i'm burning toxic waste...will the new stove solve this problem...i like this hybrid idea..i hope it works good.

 

[Slow1]

a problem that i have with the fireview is that when i reload,or on start up it smokes like hell..even though its not long the whiney neighbors whine and whine like i'm burning toxic waste...will the new stove solve this problem...i like this hybrid idea..i hope it works good.

Hmmm... all stoves smoke a bit on startup and reload. If you are getting far more than "normal" then I would first suspect your wood.

Edit to add: You can minimize your smoke on startup with top-down fire starting, and on reloads by using some smaller pieces if staring from coals and, of course, by using the driest pieces. If re-starting from coals, don't wait for it to be down to bare bones coals (i.e. that last fistful) - reload on a decent bed that will have flames before you close the door.

 

[Todd]

There are some new stoves in the works along with some possible reworking of some of the present stoves.

What are some of the mods their looking into for the current stoves? I have heard an ash pan, different glass and less ordinate castings for the fireview. Also heard some mods for the Keystone/Palladian but can't remember what they were. Refresh my memory please. I'm betting these mods are a long way out. Most resources will be diverted to the new stove.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

You are right Todd. Probably not too far out for some of the modifications.


Joseph, I also suspect your wood is perhaps not as dry as could be, however, you can always expect smoke when reloading and when starting with a cold stove.

 

[bjkjoseph]

woods fine, i also have a non cat no smoke ....all cat stoves smoke alot when reloading..esp after burning on low all night...what i wanted to know is..can you burn this stove with the bypass open..and have it burn like a non cat.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

You can burn the stove with the bypass open of course. You could also remove the cat if you wanted but that would seem a bit silly. The stove is designed to be both secondary and cat so why not just use it as designed. It will not smoke any more than other stoves. It is the wood that causes the smoke, not the cat or the stove.

You state that all cat stoves smoke a lot when reloading..esp after burning on low all night. What? That will not affect how much smoke you get on reload. We burn on low all night long and reload on hot coals just like most folks do and there is not an unusual amount of smoke. Also with the new cats you can light them off sooner so even less smoke now.

 

[BrowningBAR]

woods fine, i also have a non cat no smoke ....all cat stoves smoke alot when reloading..esp after burning on low all night...what i wanted to know is..can you burn this stove with the bypass open..and have it burn like a non cat.

I have not experience that as I am using both a cat and non cat stove in the house.

 

[bjkjoseph]

look out the window

 

[BrowningBAR]

look out the window

I do. Often. A lot, actually. After reloading I tend to look outside to note the difference between the Cat, Non-cat, and the Pree-EPA stove that I am using. I do not notice a longer period of smoke after reload from the cat stove.

 

[Todd]

a problem that i have with the fireview is that when i reload,or on start up it smokes like hell..even though its not long the whiney neighbors whine and whine like i'm burning toxic waste...will the new stove solve this problem...i like this hybrid idea..i hope it works good.

I think the new stove will solve this to some degree because the bypass is located in the top front of the fire box compared to the rear like the other stoves. The secondary baffle should help as well. One thing I have found with keeping down the smoke in the bypass mode is burning smaller splits. If you reload 4 splits that totally fill up the Fireviews box it will take longer to catch and smokes more. Cutting the splits down so you can fit 6-8 splits in there leaves more air space and quicker light offs and also doesn't really effect the burn times since it's a cat stove.

 

[bjkjoseph]

todd i thought the same thing..but i called woodstock today and they said,it will smoke the same as the fireview until the cat is engaged..i still like what i see with the new one..i hope it gets good reviews.

 

[leeave96]

I'm not sure I understand. All cat and non-cat stoves smoke untiil you get the secondaries going, the cat engaged or you are in the charcoal stage.

We lit off the Keystone, a cat stove, and the Englander 30-NCH, a non-cat stove, this morning. The Keystone went to no smoke mode within about 15 minutes, we are still waiting for the Englander to get hot enough to get the secondaries going. I'm still new with the non-cat secondaries type stoves, but based on a few start-up or reload, the cats stove is much quicker to get no smoke. So my view is - if you want to reduce the amount of time it takes to get a no smoke out the chimney burn, the cat wins hands down and the Progress ought to do this the same as any other cat stove.

BTW, one thing I am ready to point out to my neighbors (and any local official) is that the stoves I burn are some of the cleanest available in the world. I could have bought a used fisher smoke dragon and saved a lot of $$$$'s, but I wanted to mimimize the smoke impact on the neighborhood - in addition to burning less wood and having a nice looking stove....

Good luck,
Bill

 

[Todd]

I think a lot of this depends on the size of the stove, splits and coal bed. I've had times where I'm down to a coal bed where I should of restarted with kindling but try filling the box up with splits and end up cracking the door for 15 minutes trying to get it to catch. I can get away with this more with the Keystone because opening up the ash pan door for a few minutes creates that blacksmith forge effect but the Fireview was a different story. The s/s cat also helps cut down the time before smokeless burn, like Bill I can engage in 15-20 minutes from a cold start and most reloads only take 5-10 minutes or less depending on the stove temps.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Todd, I saw the Fireview cat engages only about a minute after reloading while at Woodstock. The cat lit right off too! Not sure I would want to do that on a regular basis though even with our dry wood.