Blaze King Ashford is up and running!

[Dairyman]

First off, I am heating my house, I have no central heat source. Why do you insinuate that we aren't heating our houses? You've said this several times.
12 hour burns on high? Sure, but I don't know anybody that runs their stove on high. If they do, then they have undersized their stove by a long ways!
BTW, non-cats are testing and getting real numbers, they just aren't good! So they go with the default numbers that are allowed by the EPA.

I will always have a non-cat as well as a cat stove, I appreciate features of both combustion systems. There is nothing like the burn times I am experiencing with the BK! It was sub-zero last night and I did not need to add wood to the BK this morning, I simply turned up the air for a short time before I left. Believe it or not!

So you didn't have the lopi going last night???

 

[Quentin2]

I'm one of those guys on a 12 hour burn schedule with the king and quite frankly it's amazing to me what this stove is doing for me.

I am currently solely heating my house 2850 sq. ft. Two stories with one king from the first floor. My stove room and downstairs is 80-85 my upstairs and bedrooms are currently 70-75. I have no fans blowing air anywhere except the duallys coming off the stove.

My first season burning and thankfully I have access to 20 acres that has some standing dead beetle kill spruce, I can cut and split and burn the same day. Spruce wood around here is certainly not coveted for long burn times but rather fire starter and quick fast hot heat. I don't fiddle or take the time to load the stove like a game of Tetris cause I don't need to in order to get a comfortable 12 hour burn. This wood is very light.

Right now it's about 15 outside and gusting 30 mph, typical crappy winter palmer weather. I have my t stat set at 1.5 cats running about a 1000, stove top at 450, stove is like a giant cigar heating my house, super easy to use, if we get to single digits or below zero I turn it up to 2 or 2.5 if it gets to thirty or so I turn it to .5 or 1 and enjoy 16 to 20 hours of whole home heat.

I probably shoulda posted this in a different thread but it inspired me. Nice Ashford webby! It's cool that you take the time to share your experiences with all the stoves you've burned.

 

[webby3650]

So you didn't have the lopi going last night???

Yes and if you knew anything about my floorplan, you would know why. It's an old breezy L shaped ranch, when its in the low teens or in this case below zero, I run a stove just for the area that is secluded from the rest of the house. We would survive just fine without, but I don't want cold feet. And I love to burn!

 

[BKVP]

BKVP leaving Detroit now via Delta. Will chime in later...

 

[Todd]

That and hearing about "low and slow". Four cubic feet of low and slow? I wanna hear about kicking that thing in the ass and heating a house in the winter. Which most say is a twelve hour loading schedule just like with a large firebox non-cat.

I can tell ya from my BK Princess last year If I wanted to heat my 2200 sq ft in the middle of Winter I pretty much ran it at medium on a 12 hour schedule just like I would of ran a similar sized non cat. The beauty of it was in the shoulder seasons where I didn't have to fiddle with awkward loading schedules, just load it once per day and adjust the t-stat as needed. Maybe with a King I could of went 24 hours most of the time, but still think I'd have to burn hot at times.

 

[Dairyman]

Yes and if you knew anything about my floorplan, you would know why. It's an old breezy L shaped ranch, when its in the low teens or in this case below zero, I run a stove just for the area that is secluded from the rest of the house. We would survive just fine without, but I don't want cold feet. And I love to burn!

Ok I saw the sub zero temps and didn't see mention of it. Would you have been running the Ashford hotter without it or just let that area be cool? It sounds like your house isn't that much different than mine will be after we convert the garage to living space so I'm curious.

 

[Dairyman]

BKVP leaving Detroit now via Delta. Will chime in later...

Any news on the dressed up door for the Ashford?

 

[webby3650]

Ok I saw the sub zero temps and didn't see mention of it. Would you have been running the Ashford hotter without it or just let that area be cool? It sounds like your house isn't that much different than mine will be after we convert the garage to living space so I'm curious.

That's funny you mention that. The outlying space was the garage! It's 30x30 with 10' ceilings. It's 2 steps down and exposed to the wind on 3 sides. Needless to say, it's hard to get heat out there.

 

[webby3650]

Also, keep in mind when someone talks about only getting a 12 hour burn in a Bk it's likely that reloading at 12 hours fit their schedule. I will find that to be the case sometimes when it's real cold, I will add some wood because I will still be gone at the 20 hour mark. It will need reloaded at 16 hours or so when it's real cold, but your not home.
The big difference to me is instead scratching up a few coals and adding a full load, I knock some of the partially burned logs over and put a few extra pieces on top. There is no more "getting the house warmed up", its still warm.

 

[Quentin2]

If I had an active lively flame on the wood I burn there is no way it would last 12 hours. I like how it doesn't seem to matter where in the burn cycle I'm at when I decide to add more wood. If need be I can load on very hot fuel and the t stat always keeps the stove in check.

 

[Woody Stover]

Nice info, webby!

Hmm. Can it rear vent?

Yeah, how come we who want to run the pipe inside a masonry chimney, get treated like the red-headed stepchild? Hell, my '84 Englander plate-steel stove could vent top or rear. I guess I have to keep waiting for them to design and build my 'final stove,' a rear-vented cat with a good ash system and a welded-seam box.
Webby, is just the top and rear convective, or are the sides also convective between the steel box and the cast shell? I guess I could top-vent it from inside the fireplace if the convection was good enough, and I could get it in there somehow. But like you, I'm not a big blower fan either....

I may have missed it, but have you used the ash dump? Got that on the Buck 91...it's usable (to me) but not near as slick as the Keystone's grate system.
Hey, can you measure the ash dump plug? Maybe I can use that to staunch that Buck air leak once and for all (3.5x5.5".)

I would now allow my sister to marry a guy that owns a cat Blaze King.

Sheesh, don't make me go find that post of yours, within the last few months, where you were talking about wanting to try out a big honkin' steel cat stove in that joint....

BKVP leaving Detroit now

How much did GM finally have to pay you guys for license to use the alien cat technology in their converters?

 

[webby3650]

Webby, is just the top and rear convective, or are the sides also convective between the steel box and the cast shell? I guess I could top-vent it from inside the fireplace if the convection was good enough, and I could get it in there somehow. But like you, I'm not a big blower fan either....

The sides are also convective, it has slots cast into the sides and the front at the top. The holes in the front is where the blower air would come out.

Webby, I may have missed it, but have you used the ash dump? Got that on the Buck 91...it's usable (to me) but not near as slick as the Keystone's grate system. Hey, can you measure the ash dump plug? Maybe I can use that to staunch that Buck air leak once and for all (3.5x5.5".)

I have used the ash dump and I loved it! It posted some pics of how it works early on in this thread. The plug is probably 2"x 3"? I'll let you know in March.

 

[BKVP]

This is correct.

Maybe BKVP will chime in here and shed some light on this topic. He's a wealth of knowledge on all things EPA/Efficiency related.

Great to be home..so now the truth....

1) There are many types of hang tags. There is only 1 EPA hang tag. The non cats all have a default efficiency that is the same. The cat stoves have another default, all the same again. Why?

2) Efficiency numbers are all derived from numbers recorded during emissions testing. There are some new test methods not yet 100% approved for wood stoves but in the works. The Canadian test method B415.1-10 is one way but as the NSPS is in review, nothing is firm. So now what?

3) For the 2008 Renewable Energy Tax credit, only a small number of stoves qualified as it was originally approved. There were no non cats on the he approval list. The trade association HPBA and EPA approached the IRS and asked for approval to use the low heat value method. (LHV). Guess what?

4) The IRS agrees and over night nearly all the other stoves qualify at 75%. Any doubters? Just look at the 2006 or earlier brochures for the noncats and you'll find the original thermal efficiency or HHV % for all stoves. Remember we make them too.

5) Now both EPA and HPBA will only endorse the HHV numbers in the future. So why do all the manufacturers (including BK) still use the LHV? The on going tax credit. Whereas before the * was always used to inform the consumer of the LHV use, that has gone to the way side. The cat is out of the bag.....we'll for now.

6) Under the new NSPS, the EPA hang tags will have both emissions and a tested thermal efficiency percentage.

7) yes webby, the EPA does grant ALL manufacturers the opportunity to list their thermal efficiency numbers on the EPA website, but few do. I would suspect you are correct....why would they want to report a thermal efficiency number that may in fact be lower than the default? That wouldn't look good, eh?

Sorry it took a while to respond. If you doubt this info, fine. But go get a brochure from any company that makes wood stoves and look at their own reported efficiency numbers prior to 2008. I collect the brochures and compared them to current numbers of both hang tags (the manufacturer ones) and brochures. There is an average of 10-11% points increase.....

Lastly, there were multiple formulas and option to us manufacturers to report the LHV%. My friends at WS can verify that some cat stoves had LHV numbers over 100% from one or more of the formulas. Truth is, we can legally use the highest numbers...so which ones do you suspect are being used?

Good night, stay warm and always look for the HHV or thermal efficiency % when comparing efficiencies.

 

[aaron1]

Very interesting info, thanks.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Sorry it took a while to respond. If you doubt this info, fine. But go get a brochure from any company that makes wood stoves and look at their own reported efficiency numbers prior to 2008. I collect the brochures and compared them to current numbers of both hang tags (the manufacturer ones) and brochures. There is an average of 10-11% points increase.....

I actually noticed this previously. Specifically with VC stoves.

Great post.

 

[Rickb]

Let me see If I have this right.......

Some/most stove manufacturers are not publishing correct efficiency numbers? They are publishing the minimum epa efficiency requirement even tho they my not meet that number?

 

[HotCoals]

The tax credit deal was the only reason we replaced our old BK King-non cat with a BK Cat.
So glad we did !

 

[BKVP]

Let me see If I have this right.......

Some/most stove manufacturers are not publishing correct efficiency numbers? They are publishing the minimum epa efficiency requirement even tho they my not meet that number?

Be careful not to confuse "publishing" with posting, promoting etc. The number most are using is the LHV % . This is a different number than the EPA default efficiency. In short, forget about the EPA at all when it comes to efficiency. Simply look to see if the % is LHV or HHV. The LHV is a great way to compare two items in a lab. But the HHV is regarded to best reflect real world %.

One other note. All the numbers are derived from testing with cribs. These are dimensional lumber cut and nailed together so three is a 1.5" gap between test fuel pieces. So even though the HHV best reflects real world numbers....it does so using test fuel.

Industry is currently working on a new cord wood test method. It will be some time, but it's on the way....

 

[BKVP]

Nice info, webby!

Yeah, how come we who want to run the pipe inside a masonry chimney, get treated like the red-headed stepchild? Hell, my '84 Englander plate-steel stove could vent top or rear. I guess I have to keep waiting for them to design and build my 'final stove,' a rear-vented cat with a good ash system and a welded-seam box.
Webby, is just the top and rear convective, or are the sides also convective between the steel box and the cast shell? I guess I could top-vent it from inside the fireplace if the convection was good enough, and I could get it in there somehow. But like you, I'm not a big blower fan either....

I may have missed it, but have you used the ash dump? Got that on the Buck 91...it's usable (to me) but not near as slick as the Keystone's grate system.
Hey, can you measure the ash dump plug? Maybe I can use that to staunch that Buck air leak once and for all (3.5x5.5".)

Sheesh, don't make me go find that post of yours, within the last few months, where you were talking about wanting to try out a big honkin' steel cat stove in that joint....

How much did GM finally have to pay you guys for license to use the alien cat technology in their converters?

Just worked hard and signed on a few new dealers. BK coming to the showroom near you!! GM...funny!

 

[Parallax]

Just worked hard and signed on a few new dealers. BK coming to the showroom near you!! GM...funny!

Can you help me find an Ashford that I can see somewhere in the vicinity of my home? I'm in Bellingham, Washington. Would drive up to Vancouver, B.C. or down to Seattle but I don't want to have to drive to Walla Walla. If there isn't a dealer who has one, perhaps there's a customer who would be willing to let me come by.

 

[aaron1]

Can you help me find an Ashford that I can see somewhere in the vicinity of my home? I'm in Bellingham, Washington. Would drive up to Vancouver, B.C. or down to Seattle but I don't want to have to drive to Walla Walla. If there isn't a dealer who has one, perhaps there's a customer who would be willing to let me come by.

Just use the search tool at

(broken link removed to http://www.blazeking.com/EN/wood-stoves.html)

on the bottom of the page.

 

[BKVP]

Can you help me find an Ashford that I can see somewhere in the vicinity of my home? I'm in Bellingham, Washington. Would drive up to Vancouver, B.C. or down to Seattle but I don't want to have to drive to Walla Walla. If there isn't a dealer who has one, perhaps there's a customer who would be willing to let me come by.

They are just starting to get caught up here in production. Black versions are shipping out first come, first served by order date to the dealers. Brown enamel are just being a bugger for us. The fit and finish isn't up to our standards so we tossed them...more to follow. No need to come to Walla Walla as we do not keep them more than a few hours before they ship. (Bascially, we're out as well).

There are a few dealers that may have them, I'll keep and eye out for one and if I hear about it I'll pm you. Truth be told, dealers are selling them so fast, they don't have the luxury of having a display.

 

[BurnIt13]

Oh my....you tossed them? Any chance you can "toss" one in my direction if I pay shipping (wink wink)? I'll take a fugly looking enamel just as an entrance fee into the BK world! Heck, I'd drive from Massachusetts to WA and back just to grab one out of your dumpster!

Just sayin.....

 

[Parallax]

They are just starting to get caught up here in production. Black versions are shipping out first come, first served by order date to the dealers. Brown enamel are just being a bugger for us. The fit and finish isn't up to our standards so we tossed them...more to follow. No need to come to Walla Walla as we do not keep them more than a few hours before they ship. (Bascially, we're out as well).

There are a few dealers that may have them, I'll keep and eye out for one and if I hear about it I'll pm you. Truth be told, dealers are selling them so fast, they don't have the luxury of having a display.

Thanks.

 

[webby3650]

They are just starting to get caught up here in production. Black versions are shipping out first come, first served by order date to the dealers. Brown enamel are just being a bugger for us. The fit and finish isn't up to our standards so we tossed them...more to follow. No need to come to Walla Walla as we do not keep them more than a few hours before they ship. (Bascially, we're out as well).

There are a few dealers that may have them, I'll keep and eye out for one and if I hear about it I'll pm you. Truth be told, dealers are selling them so fast, they don't have the luxury of having a display.

Wow, it sounds like I am very fortunate to have one heating my house as we speak!