Heritage 8024 questions\issues

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SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
Hi everyone. We are new to wood stoves. We have a new Heritage 8024 soapstone.
We purchased this over a cast iron due to the sale rep telling us it gives of a nice steady 20 hours heat, rather than a fast high temp heat that cast iron produces.
A friend has a very small cast iron stove and their living room is too hot to sit in, but the rest of their 1200sq hours is nice.

My main concern is run away burns. The manual says moving the air intake to low doesn't completely close it, so it seems if you get into trouble your out of luck???
We've had about 7 full burns. If we put too many small thin boards in then it gets too hot. It has never exceeded the catalytic zone, but was on the line between that and too hot for about 10 minutes last night.

Questions:
1) This forum had a posting that the catalytic thermometer should be pulled out about 1/2" where it has a stop point, rather than sitting up against the soapstone. Is there any official documentation on this? I want to be sure because if I pull it out to where it stops at about 1/2" then I want to be sure the stove is not overheating due to it being out when it's supposed to be in all the way. You know what I mean?
2) The chimney is a total of 15', the minimum requirement for the stove. We have farm fields all around our house and the wind speed doesn't normally exceed 2-11mph with storm gusts up to 40-60mph. Should we add a damper to the stove pipe? The manual says it may be necessary, but usually isn't. I read in this forum that you can get a blow back and destroy the stove if you close it all the way.
3) The manually says Canada requires a fresh air damper to be able to close the fresh air off completely. We live in the USA, but it sounds like maybe they require this to shut down stoves? Do you think we should add a damper to the fresh air intake?

We just ordered a stove top thermometer. I guess the only place to put it on this stove would be on the top burner plate and not on the soap stone? We have it rear vented, so the installers moved the cooking plate from the back to the top.

We were able to keep the stove running overnight using a full load of large logs about 4-6" in size. The stove was still very warm in the morning. The stove keeps the draft out of the house and makes the living room cozy warm. It doesn't seem like we will ever have to open a window because the stove never puts out that much heat, like our friends tiny cast iron stove. We wish we purchased a cast iron stove now, but are still learning about this one and hope to get better at using it.

Thanks in advance for any advise
 

jwoair23

Feeling the Heat
Oct 2, 2011
279
Ohio
I have a Heritage 8024 and at this point have learned the ins and outs of it. I would not worry too much about the catalyst temperature, as it took several weeks for mine to 'settle down'. In the beginning, both I and others have had a very over active catalyst that would get in to the "too hot" zone or close to it with a not so hot fire. After a few weeks it settled down and now it very rarely gets past the middle or just slightly past the middle even with very hot fires. As far as the positioning, mine is pushed all the way in.

I would not suggest adding a damper from my experiences, I think you just need to get to know the stove more and get it broken in. For me, if I am starting cold I have the bypass open and the fresh air lever all the way open. I let it run that way until the catalyst gets to the line where it is active, then I close the bypass and close the fresh air down.

When I am running a normal fire, I am usually leaving the fresh air lever open about 1/4 inch. If I close it all the way, I find I don't get as efficient a fire.

Typically I load 4-5 large size splits into the stove, then leave the fresh air lever open a 1/4 inch. I have a stove top thermometer on the upper left top of the stove, as with my IR gun that was the hottest part of the stove. I typically reach a max of 525-550F with the stove fully loaded, and it stays above 300F for roughly 9 hours. I get usable coals up to 15 hours later, and at that point the stove is 150-200F. For reference, I am mainly burning Ash firewood.

I did email Hearthstone about the max temp and where to place a thermometer, but so far have not heard back. They had this in prior manuals, but not for the 8024 for some odd and annoying reason.

I think once your catalyst settles down, and you are reaching 500F burns, you should find the stove heats the house nicely. I have about 2000 sq feet, well insulated, and I have to be careful not to run us out of the house at 78F or so lol.

Please let me know if you have any more questions I can answer from my experiences.
 
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SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
Something very odd happened this morning. Let me start with last night...
I experimented having the catalyst probe pulled out to where it stops about 1/2" from the stove. It reports a much cooler temperature. I pushed it back in and waited 20 minutes, and it was about half way into the catalyst range. The stove was hot, but not too hot. It didn't burn my fingers instantly. I placed 2 meat thermometers on the top of the stove and they moved quickly to about 70F and then slowly moved to 100F. This makes me think the probe is meant to be out and it freely moved the last 1/2" as if it was made to be pulled outward until it stops at that mark.

WOOF - PUFF OF SMOKE OUT OF STOVE - This morning the stove was a little warm still, There were 3 cup size chunks of wood that did not burn. There was a little red spits in the ash. The door glass was covered black. I put in kindling and a few thin 16" long pieces, that I consider large kindling. I left the stove for about 15 minutes. We were sitting int the living room and then suddenly the wood caught fire and it seems like all of the wood was burning at the same time and was very bright. About 30 seconds later there was a WOOSH or POOF and a large plume of brown smoke gushed from the top of the stove and then everything appeared normal, all of the wood was still burning. We also noticed that the glass was now almost clear.

We have a rear heat shield; I suppose the smoke could have escaped from the back of the stove and the heat shield would have directed it to the top of the stove.

Why did the kindling appear to spontaneous combust all at the same time? Is this normal? I'm glad it was a small amount of wood.
WHat was the POOF sound and why did a bunch of brown smoke leave from the top of the stove? I'd say the smoke gushed out for a good 5 seconds.

The fire has burned out now and I don't want to make another fire until I understand what happened.

Edit: In rectrospect, I suppose the glass cleaned itself as the fire was getting hotter. When we suddenly seen all of the wood on fire, it most likely was a sudden cleaning of the glass. I remember the kindling was burning for the whole time, but we could only see it from a small portion at the top of the glass that wasn't black. The woosh\puff of brown smoke is still concerning, and the glass cleaning almost instantly too.
 
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jwoair23

Feeling the Heat
Oct 2, 2011
279
Ohio
Something very odd happened this morning. Let me start with last night...
I experimented having the catalyst probe pulled out to where it stops about 1/2" from the stove. It reports a much cooler temperature. I pushed it back in and waited 20 minutes, and it was about half way into the catalyst range. The stove was hot, but not too hot. It didn't burn my fingers instantly. I placed 2 meat thermometers on the top of the stove and they moved quickly to about 70F and then slowly moved to 100F. This makes me think the probe is meant to be out and it freely moved the last 1/2" as if it was made to be pulled outward until it stops at that mark.

WOOF - PUFF OF SMOKE OUT OF STOVE - This morning the stove was a little warm still, There were 3 cup size chunks of wood that did not burn. There was a little red spits in the ash. The door glass was covered black. I put in kindling and a few thin 16" long pieces, that I consider large kindling. I left the stove for about 15 minutes. We were sitting int the living room and then suddenly the wood caught fire and it seems like all of the wood was burning at the same time and was very bright. About 30 seconds later there was a WOOSH or POOF and a large plume of brown smoke gushed from the top of the stove and then everything appeared normal, all of the wood was still burning. We also noticed that the glass was now almost clear.

We have a rear heat shield; I suppose the smoke could have escaped from the back of the stove and the heat shield would have directed it to the top of the stove.

Why did the kindling appear to spontaneous combust all at the same time? Is this normal? I'm glad it was a small amount of wood.
WHat was the POOF sound and why did a bunch of brown smoke leave from the top of the stove? I'd say the smoke gushed out for a good 5 seconds.

The fire has burned out now and I don't want to make another fire until I understand what happened.

Edit: In rectrospect, I suppose the glass cleaned itself as the fire was getting hotter. When we suddenly seen all of the wood on fire, it most likely was a sudden cleaning of the glass. I remember the kindling was burning for the whole time, but we could only see it from a small portion at the top of the glass that wasn't black. The woosh\puff of brown smoke is still concerning, and the glass cleaning almost instantly too.
My opinion would be that you are not burning your stove hot enough, and likely have your air lever closed too much. The tell tale sign of that is the glass being totally black. I have never had my glass completely back over, and the times I have had it black in parts were because I closed down the air too much or too soon.

I think you likely had a lot of built up coals that still had energy in them from a very slow burn, then when everything caught fire and caught at once it released a lot of pent up energy if you will. Thats my best guess.

I also do not think the catalyst probe is supposed to be pushed out, I suggest having the probe pushed all the way in.

I think due to your worries with the catalyst you are likely taking it too easy on the burns, I would suggest trying hotter burns when you can monitor it so you feel better about it, and see if that gets you started in a better direction.
 

SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
My opinion would be that you are not burning your stove hot enough, and likely have your air lever closed too much. The tell tale sign of that is the glass being totally black. I have never had my glass completely back over, and the times I have had it black in parts were because I closed down the air too much or too soon.

I think you likely had a lot of built up coals that still had energy in them from a very slow burn, then when everything caught fire and caught at once it released a lot of pent up energy if you will. Thats my best guess.

I also do not think the catalyst probe is supposed to be pushed out, I suggest having the probe pushed all the way in.

I think due to your worries with the catalyst you are likely taking it too easy on the burns, I would suggest trying hotter burns when you can monitor it so you feel better about it, and see if that gets you started in a better direction.
Thanks, you're right that we're making sure it doesn't get too hot and we did have a lot of 1/2" chunks of coals when I cleaned the stove out this afternoon.
We're going to wait until the stove top thermometers arrive next week before using it again. At least then we will not have to go by the catalyst probe for the heat setting.
 

electrathon

Minister of Fire
Sep 17, 2015
579
Gresham, OR
Hi everyone. We are new to wood stoves. We have a new Heritage 8024 soapstone.
We purchased this over a cast iron due to the sale rep telling us it gives of a nice steady 20 hours heat, rather than a fast high temp heat that cast iron produces.
A friend has a very small cast iron stove and their living room is too hot to sit in, but the rest of their 1200sq hours is nice.
.....
We just ordered a stove top thermometer. I guess the only place to put it on this stove would be on the top burner plate and not on the soap stone? We have it rear vented, so the installers moved the cooking plate from the back to the top.

We were able to keep the stove running overnight using a full load of large logs about 4-6" in size. The stove was still very warm in the morning. The stove keeps the draft out of the house and makes the living room cozy warm. It doesn't seem like we will ever have to open a window because the stove never puts out that much heat, like our friends tiny cast iron stove. We wish we purchased a cast iron stove now, but are still learning about this one and hope to get better at using it.

Thanks in advance for any advise
Fist you need to remember that soapstone is an insulator, it will slowly absorb heat and slowly release heat, the heat that is from the fire that can not be quickly absorbed into the stove will be moved up the chimney. Your friends stove that gets hot and heats the room faster/better is transferring the heat you are loosing up the chimney into the room. I stovetop thermometer wont tell you too much, you need to monitor the heat inside the firebox, not on the outside where there is a insulation wall keeping the heat in the stove. My hearthstone rarely gets "hot" on the outside surface. I am convinced if there was no glass door I would get about a third the heat output on the stove.

As to the smoke/puffing issue, I an guessing that you are choking the fire down and it got a surge of air, tried to ignite and made the smoke. This is similar to opening a door on a burning house and a flash fire ripping through the room. I suggest letting the stove have more air and see what happens. The black glass is a huge sign that you are either choking out the fire or your wood is not fully dry.
 

SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
Something very odd happened this morning. Let me start with last night...
I experimented having the catalyst probe pulled out to where it stops about 1/2" from the stove. It reports a much cooler temperature. I pushed it back in and waited 20 minutes, and it was about half way into the catalyst range. The stove was hot, but not too hot. It didn't burn my fingers instantly. I placed 2 meat thermometers on the top of the stove and they moved quickly to about 70F and then slowly moved to 100F. This makes me think the probe is meant to be out and it freely moved the last 1/2" as if it was made to be pulled outward until it stops at that mark.

WOOF - PUFF OF SMOKE OUT OF STOVE - This morning the stove was a little warm still, There were 3 cup size chunks of wood that did not burn. There was a little red spits in the ash. The door glass was covered black. I put in kindling and a few thin 16" long pieces, that I consider large kindling. I left the stove for about 15 minutes. We were sitting int the living room and then suddenly the wood caught fire and it seems like all of the wood was burning at the same time and was very bright. About 30 seconds later there was a WOOSH or POOF and a large plume of brown smoke gushed from the top of the stove and then everything appeared normal, all of the wood was still burning. We also noticed that the glass was now almost clear.

We have a rear heat shield; I suppose the smoke could have escaped from the back of the stove and the heat shield would have directed it to the top of the stove.

Why did the kindling appear to spontaneous combust all at the same time? Is this normal? I'm glad it was a small amount of wood.
WHat was the POOF sound and why did a bunch of brown smoke leave from the top of the stove? I'd say the smoke gushed out for a good 5 seconds.

The fire has burned out now and I don't want to make another fire until I understand what happened.

Edit: In rectrospect, I suppose the glass cleaned itself as the fire was getting hotter. When we suddenly seen all of the wood on fire, it most likely was a sudden cleaning of the glass. I remember the kindling was burning for the whole time, but we could only see it from a small portion at the top of the glass that wasn't black. The woosh\puff of brown smoke is still concerning, and the glass cleaning almost instantly too.
I've discovered the EcoStix Fatwood that we use to start the fires (instead of newspaper) seems to be a cause of the blackness. It lights instantly with a lighter and gives off a heavy black smoke, dripping black goo as it burns. I placed a strip of thin wood across the middle of the stove. I then placed 8 EcoStix perpendicular across the length of the wood. Each place the EcoStix burned as a black shiny puddle of black tar goo. It even leaked out a few drops from a hole in the bottom right side of the stove. They made the cleaned glass window 1/2 dark. The air was fully open the entire time.

Should we go back to using newspaper like the manual says?
 

jwoair23

Feeling the Heat
Oct 2, 2011
279
Ohio
I've discovered the EcoStix Fatwood that we use to start the fires (instead of newspaper) seems to be a cause of the blackness. It lights instantly with a lighter and gives off a heavy black smoke, dripping black goo as it burns. I placed a strip of thin wood across the middle of the stove. I then placed 8 EcoStix perpendicular across the length of the wood. Each place the EcoStix burned as a black shiny puddle of black tar goo. It even leaked out a few drops from a hole in the bottom right side of the stove. They made the cleaned glass window 1/2 dark. The air was fully open the entire time.

Should we go back to using newspaper like the manual says?
I recommend Super Cedar as they do an awesome job starting a fire with half a puck, and burn very cleanly.
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
2,220
SE North Carolina
I've discovered the EcoStix Fatwood that we use to start the fires (instead of newspaper) seems to be a cause of the blackness. It lights instantly with a lighter and gives off a heavy black smoke, dripping black goo as it burns. I placed a strip of thin wood across the middle of the stove. I then placed 8 EcoStix perpendicular across the length of the wood. Each place the EcoStix burned as a black shiny puddle of black tar goo. It even leaked out a few drops from a hole in the bottom right side of the stove. They made the cleaned glass window 1/2 dark. The air was fully open the entire time.

Should we go back to using newspaper like the manual says?
I use one or two smaller pieces of fat wood and lots of smaller split kindling top down. My typical fat wood piece is 6” king by 1/2” x1/2”. I use because it lights so fast and easy. IMO the eco stix are fire starters not kindling
 

SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
I recommend Super Cedar as they do an awesome job starting a fire with half a puck, and burn very cleanly.
Thanks, I just watched a video on them burning and they looked like they burned clean like you said. The fatwood sticks we are using now look like plastic burning. If you ever seen plastic burn, it gives off black thick smoke and the plastic drips down as it melts. The black goo puddles left behind by the 8 sticks disappeared from bottom of the stove, but looks like it is on the inside walls of the stove in places.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
92,795
South Puget Sound, WA
Super Cedars burn much cleaner with no drips or smoke. They are better for catalytic stoves.

As for the runaway stoves concern, kindling and smaller splits are going to ignite much faster. A stove full of small pieces of wood will have a better chance of a runaway fire. To avoid this use the kindling on top of thicker (3-5") splits for a top down start. That will provide a longer lasting steady burn without the worry. Close down the air in increments as the fire starts burning robustly.

Have you read this thread for starting tips?

This video may also be helpful:
 
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SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
Super Cedars burn much cleaner with no drips or smoke. They are better for catalytic stoves.

As for the runaway stoves concern, kindling and smaller splits are going to ignite much faster. A stove full of small pieces of wood will have a better chance of a runaway fire. To avoid this use the kindling on top of thicker (3-5") splits for a top down start. That will provide a longer lasting steady burn without the worry. Close down the air in increments as the fire starts burning robustly.

Have you read this thread for starting tips?

This video may also be helpful:

Thanks for the video. I learned a lot from it. I found this short video earlier today that also helped a bit for newer stoves.
 

SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
We are doing much better with our new stove thanks to all of you for helping.
In the photos the two thermometers show the stove temperature on the hot-plate (our flu is on the back of stove) and on the soapstone.
I imagine the hotplate is the true stove temperature.
Like others have said, the soap stone slowly absorbs the heat and is always 100F-200F behind the hot-plate temp.

The issue now is that the stove cannot get hotter than 400F due to the catalytic probe getting too hot. It stays in the catalyst range even when the stove is down towards 150F and when we can touch the stove with it feeling hot, but not burning out hands. The stove is basically cold, but the probe is often just in the lower range. If I pull the probe out so that it is not touching the soap stone, just an 1/8" then it seems to be much more accurate. I don't see how the cataylst could possibly be hot when there's basically just ash left in the stove, but the soapstone is still giving off heat for hours. I think that throws the probe temp off when the probe is touching the soapstone.

We no longer have black glass either, and the stove throws enough heat for the 2,200sf house. Based on how we run it now, with the thermometers, I'm guessing our previous burns were 100F-200F, maybe 300F for a short time.

Thank you for all of the help. They should probably give out free stove top thermometers with each stove they sell...

stove temp2.jpg stove temp1.jpg
 
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jwoair23

Feeling the Heat
Oct 2, 2011
279
Ohio
We are doing much better with our new stove thanks to all of you for helping.
In the photos the two thermometers show the stove temperature on the hot-plate (our flu is on the back of stove) and on the soapstone.
I imagine the hotplate is the true stove temperature.
Like others have said, the soap stone slowly absorbs the heat and is always 100F-200F behind the hot-plate temp.

The issue now is that the stove cannot get hotter than 400F due to the catalytic probe getting too hot. It stays in the catalyst range even when the stove is down towards 150F and when we can touch the stove with it feeling hot, but not burning out hands. The stove is basically cold, but the probe is often just in the lower range. If I pull the probe out so that it is not touching the soap stone, just an 1/8" then it seems to be much more accurate. I don't see how the cataylst could possibly be hot when there's basically just ash left in the stove, but the soapstone is still giving off heat for hours. I think that throws the probe temp off when the probe is touching the soapstone.

We no longer have black glass either, and the stove throws enough heat for the 2,200sf house. Based on how we run it now, with the thermometers, I'm guessing our previous burns were 100F-200F, maybe 300F for a short time.

Thank you for all of the help. They should probably give out free stove top thermometers with each stove they sell...

View attachment 287691 View attachment 287692
Glad to hear you are doing better! I am a little frustrated with Hearthstone as they have not responded to multiple emails from me asking about the placement of the thermometer and what the max temp is for the soapstone on this model. They discontinued their phone # as well. I would really like to get an official word on where to measure, and what the max burn temp is for the stove!
 

bikedennis

Member
Jun 21, 2021
81
Nor Cal
I was about to pull the trigger on a Hearthstone GM60 but read some negative reviews on defective door hinges. They did answer my email. They lost a sale due to poor CS. I ended up with a BK Sirocco. Happy that I did.
 

SuperDK7

New Member
Nov 1, 2021
9
USA
Glad to hear you are doing better! I am a little frustrated with Hearthstone as they have not responded to multiple emails from me asking about the placement of the thermometer and what the max temp is for the soapstone on this model. They discontinued their phone # as well. I would really like to get an official word on where to measure, and what the max burn temp is for the stove!
You know how the flames sometimes roll and burn at the top of the stove? If this is how we tell when the catalytic converters are working then they only kick on when the probe gets 3/4" into the setting, 1/4" from the max safe setting on the probe. If I pull the probe out 1/4" then it seems like it kicks on at the right time, rather than when it is about to hit the max safe setting. I just don't know yet if the flames burning at the top of the fire box (the cool looking rolling flames) mean if the catalytic converters are on\working. If so, then they do not get hot enough with the probe pushed in all the way. I also read that people run their normal wood stoves 500F-600F, but this can never happen if the probe is in all the way, only about 400F can be reached and then the stove can cool down for 6 hours and the probe is sometimes at the start of the catalytic burn setting. I think the probe should be pulled out. On our stove it slides very easily the 1st 1/2" and then stops. I figure they may have made it this way for a reason - so that we can pull it out and know when to stop.