Is this an overfire?

[Vg3200p]

So 1st week with this stove. Vogelzang vg3200p. Same chimney same wood as old stove. ( chimney is roughly 20 to 25ft counting interior)But I am having trouble controlling this stove. Pics are from this morning when I left for work with air shut all the way down operation? Stt at 917 at hottest point. Surface temp of sigle wall stovepipe at 373 18" above flue. Is this overfire? Already have sealed ashplug so shouldn't be leaking there. Checked that front door is tight. Should I try blocking off the secondary air intake? Key damper? Or is this reasonable operation? I've learned with this stove to shut down air way earlier than previous stove. But even then it seems to burn very robustly

 

[appointed EPA deviant]

That is scary hot when you are standing in front of such an animal.

 

[bholler]

So 1st week with this stove. Vogelzang vg3200p. Same chimney same wood as old stove. ( chimney is roughly 20 to 25ft counting interior)But I am having trouble controlling this stove. Pics are from this morning when I left for work with air shut all the way down operation? Stt at 917 at hottest point. Surface temp of sigle wall stovepipe at 373 18" above flue. Is this overfire? Already have sealed ashplug so shouldn't be leaking there. Checked that front door is tight. Should I try blocking off the secondary air intake? Key damper? Or is this reasonable operation? I've learned with this stove to shut down air way earlier than previous stove. But even then it seems to burn very robustly

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Yes it's an overfire. Not a horrible one but it definitely is. I would put a damper in

 

[begreen]

Yes, that is pushing overfire territory. Next load, take a picture before closing the door so that we can see how the stove is being loaded.

Don't worry and don't change anything yet. It can take a try or two to learn a new stove. This one has a lot more fuel in it. The most common issue is that people don't turn down the air soon enough. Start with that.

 

[Vg3200p]

Ok here is tonight's loads and temps. Temp pics are 45 min into burn with air shutdown maybe 5 min inRaked coals to the front. Filled firebox. I shut air down at maybe 200 surface flue temp. The thing I don't get is why wouldn't my smaller stove "run away" with this chimney but this one will. This stove has 2 air intake controls and to me the 2nd smaller one seems completely unnessacary. Is it just the amount of wood that cab fit in this stove that makes it burn so hot? If key damper is the solution I will try to get one this weekend

 

[begreen]

On a hot reload, leave the boost air (right side) control closed (pulled all the way out). Just use the left side (primary) air control.

Also, make sure that the ash plug is sealing well so that no air is getting by it.

 

[begreen]

I'd also inspect to see whether the right-side control is closing off its air intake port completely.

 

[Vg3200p]

@begreen I have sealed the ashplug with stove silicone. 3 layers of it. When I look in the ash pan door. I can see the secondary control is closing all the way. I can't see the primary. But if I hook my hand up I can feel the primary plate sliding with the lever. Do you think this is more of an to much air problem vs a to much draft problem? My old stove would never run away with air shutdown. In fact I had to leave the lever about 15% open to keep it from smoldering

 

[begreen]

Yes, after I posted that I recalled you sealing it up.

This stove is new to all of us. I think you are the first posting for it. When you got it I started studying the manual to better understand the operation. The language in the manual is confusing. If I understand it correctly, the right-hand air control is controlling boost air, not secondary air. They shouldn't call it secondary.

One thing that crops up on some new stoves is a loose air control where the air valve slide is sloppy and doesn't seal tightly. In some stoves, it's a simple matter of tightening the tension screw on the valve. That's something to check. Can you get your cellphone up in the primary air valve location to take a picture? Sometimes selfie mode works better for this.

If all is in order, then it could just be that US Stove dumped in too much air in order to meet EPA requirements. If so, a key damper in the stove pipe will slow it down.

 

[Vg3200p]

@begreen I will check tightening those on the morning when it's a little cooler in the Ashbox area. I know for a the boost air plate can be moved up and down. It is definitely not a tight seal. I would assume primary is the same. I'm beginning to think that you are correct and they made this stove way to easy breather to meet epa specs. When it comes to the key damper what is the best hieght on the flue to install one? Thanks for your and @bhollers help. I'm thankfull for this forum

 

[begreen]

If the valves are sloppy they are going to leak air. As a test, you could try using some metal tape or a strong magnet to hold the boost air closed.
A key damper can go anywhere in the first 18" above the stove.

 

[Vg3200p]

This is the boost air plate. The primary is not in a place where I can get a picture even in selfie mode. I can touch it but it's not visible

 

[Vg3200p]

Well I sealed the boost air port. Flames instantly became more lazy seems much more controled.. flue temps down to 250. Hoping this solves the problem. Would prefer not to have a damper if possible

 

[begreen]

Wow, that is quite a change. Give it a try for a couple of days and see how the stove burns.

What species of wood are you burning? Any locust or osage orange? I ask because they pack a lot of BTUs. When I burn locust my stove is usually 100-150º hotter than with doug fir.

 

[Vg3200p]

Nope tonight it's ash maple and cherry. Just did a hot reload to test it. It's running slightly hot but way better. Before it would've went nuclear in this situation. @begreen I'm Fairley certain you hit the nail on the head about us stove making this a heavy breather to pass emmisions

 

[Vg3200p]

Hoping on a normal reload situation and shutting the main down early I can get this stove under control. I'm optimistic it will work

 

[Gearhead660]

My stove is very similar in size, 3 cuft range. I found I needed to shut the air down sooner or it would get up in the 900 deg f plus, actual flue temp. I start shutting the air down when it gets around 650 deg f. Find the Auber to be a very valuable tool to keep the stove under control. My set up is 30+ ft internal chimney that drafts very well. I added a damper as a safety measure in case it does start to run away.

I believe the reason you are seeing higher flue temps is partly due to the stove breathing too well(to meet emissions), and the fact that you are able to load with more fuel, which is all off gassing at the same time, creating a hotter fire.

 

[begreen]

Nope tonight it's ash maple and cherry. Just did a hot reload to test it. It's running slightly hot but way better. Before it would've went nuclear in this situation. @begreen I'm Fairley certain you hit the nail on the head about us stove making this a heavy breather to pass emmisions

My suspicion is that you will be able to run without the boost air but time will tell. That control should not be leaky. If sealing it makes a huge difference then it's a poor design.

 

[FPX Dude]

Even though door shuts, could it still be leaky and cause a problem? Dollar bill test?

 

[Vg3200p]

Sealing the boost air seems to have done the trick. 23f outside so draft should be strong. Did a full reload and it's completely controllable might even have to open primary back up 10% or so to get clean burn. Now it runs more like our old stove. Much better.

 

[begreen]

Sealing the boost air seems to have done the trick. 23f outside so draft should be strong. Did a full reload and it's completely controllable might even have to open primary back up 10% or so to get clean burn. Now it runs more like our old stove. Much better.

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Thanks for the update. That's much better. I'm glad things have settled down and you are getting proper operation. You need heat right now.
How has the burn time been with the boost air sealed? Are you still getting good secondary combustion?

 

[begreen]

I haven't run this stove but what I suspect happened is that the boost air valve is loose, maybe just lying in place by gravity? If so, it seems like the vacuum created by strong combustion and draft is lifting up the valve plate up and admitting more air, even in the closed position. If so, that's a recipe for an overfire.

 

[Vg3200p]

I haven't run this stove but what I suspect happened is that the boost air valve is loose, maybe just lying in place by gravity? If so, it seems like the vacuum created by strong combustion and draft is lifting up the valve plate up and admitting more air, even in the closed position. If so, that's a recipe for an overfire.

That could be the plate is definitely loose in the slot by design I think. I can stick my finger up on the primary plate and it moves up and down to.

 

[Vg3200p]

Thanks for the update. That's much better. I'm glad things have settled down and you are getting proper operation. You need heat right now.
How has the burn time been with the boost air sealed? Are you still getting good secondary combustion?

Yes still good secondaries. The pic is what's left after 12hrs. Stt in hottest spot is 244f after 12hr. It's 32f outside right now. Wife was home all day and said house was hot all day. I'm more than pleased and think 12h reload cycles will be doable down to maybe 10f depending on winds. Our house is very drafty. Poor design on the ashplug and the boost air but still overjoyed to be hot instead of cold

 

[Vg3200p]

So after smoke testing door I found no leaks. Have sealed boost air plate. Have sealed ash plug. Thought I had this stove figured out. I did a reload after 12hr burn. Shut air down well before flue surface reached 300f this has produced nice controllable burns. Tonight stove run normal for about 20 min. I babysit it at every reload till it settles in. Then all of a sudden it starts to run away with air shut all the way down. Stove top in middle was glowing red and at almost 1000f flue surface temp at 18" was 725. Scared the piss outta me. Pulled 4 or 6 splits out of it ran them through the house and dumped them in the fire pit. It's under control now back to nice lazy Flames but it warped the brand new stove. Guess it's time for a key dampner