issues we are having reaching and communicating with our local Jotul dealer

[triceps]

we have one dealer in our area and unfortunately, he is not being very communicative, so we sent the below email to Jotul. Any other thoughts on things we can do? Thanks.

Dear Jotul,

We are hoping to speak with someone at Jotul about some issues we are having reaching and communicating with our local Jotul dealer.

We are based in northern California and have made repeated attempts to contact by phone, through email, and through the dealers online website, with zero luck.

We did go into the dealer’s showroom one time and spoke with the owner. We were advised to email, but then we never heard anything further.

Our extended family already owns a Jotul and loves it, and we very much would love to buy another, the Oslo model. However, we are running into real difficulties with our local dealer and need assistance. We are hoping this is something you can help with.

 

[Pinesmoke]

Much more gracious than I would have been.

 

[Ashful]

we have one dealer in our area and unfortunately, he is not being very communicative, so we sent the below email to Jotul. Any other thoughts on things we can do? Thanks.

Dear Jotul,

We are hoping to speak with someone at Jotul about some issues we are having reaching and communicating with our local Jotul dealer.

We are based in northern California and have made repeated attempts to contact by phone, through email, and through the dealers online website, with zero luck.

We did go into the dealer’s showroom one time and spoke with the owner. We were advised to email, but then we never heard anything further.

Our extended family already owns a Jotul and loves it, and we very much would love to buy another, the Oslo model. However, we are running into real difficulties with our local dealer and need assistance. We are hoping this is something you can help with.

Good luck. jotul has a USA division, which used to be called "Jotul USA", and I imagine still is. But they have a strict policy of not communicating directly with customers, forcing everything to go through dealers. If you're having zero luck with one dealer, I'd just try another, I imagine there must be at least a few Jotul dealers in your neighborhood.

Also note that the most recent class of Jotul stoves (particularly the F500) have had some very serious performance problems. Couple that with no factory support and dealers of variable knowledge and ambition, and there have been quite a few recently unhappy customers.

Jotul stoves are of excellent quality, really second to none, but quality and performance are two separate and independent things.

If you really like the Jotul look, and want a better-performing stove of similar quality, consider:

non-cat: PE Alderlea
cat: Blaze King Ashford

 

[Todd]

Also note that the most recent class of Jotul stoves (particularly the F500) have had some very serious performance problems.

Really? I don’t think I would base that on a couple threads on a wood burning forum. That’s like saying the most recent Blaze Kings rear fireboxes will rot out within 10 years.

 

[Ashful]

Really? I don’t think I would base that on a couple threads on a wood burning forum. That’s like saying the most recent Blaze Kings rear fireboxes will rot out within 10 years.

I'm not basing it on just a couple of threads, nor am I the one who first made this conclusion. One of our moderators who installs and services stoves for a living has cited numerous complaints and problems with the F500 v.3. Do a quick search, and you will find this particular version of this particular model has had more complaints than praise, since being introduced 2022. Here's two to get you started:

What should I sell my stove for?

Well, today was the final straw for my VC Dauntless. I was driving by a stove dealer and was stopped at the stop sign, when what did my wandering eye appear?! A Jotul burning nice and bright with a crystal clear glass window and a box full of primary and secondary flames heating a large store...

www.hearth.com

New member, looking for advice on a wood stove

Hello everyone, I have been doing some research to buying my first wood stove as a primary heat source in the basement. These are the dimensions, Basement is 1600 sqft fully open but in an L shape for the whole house design. First floor is the same sqft so by 50% calculations this would total...

www.hearth.com

Not to pick on @bholler alone, though, there are literally dozens of other posts from individual users describing problems. However, I don't value the opinion of individual users as much as one who sees and works on dozens of stoves per week. You are correct in saying we can find individual complaints from individual users of most stoves, even BK.

For full disclosure, here's a few on the F500, although you have to take every individual user complaint with a grain of salt. Some of these may just be operator error or bad installs, so it's more the sum total of love/hate posts on any model that show its true nature. I see a more animosity directed toward the F500 than love, which is the opposite scenario of the two models I recommended in its place, although you can surely find individual complaints about those models, too.

F500 junk 2022

Stupid me just downgraded from Dutchwest to garbage Jotul f500 v3 in November 2022. After doing proper seasoning this stove would not shut up. Clink cklink clink bang bang clink.... 24hrs. Can't sleep. My dealer Wood Heat in Flemington and in PA is useless, I can't get them over to fix. Idiot...

www.hearth.com

Jotul f500 v3 questions

Hello everyone, I'm looking to replace a better 'n bens stove from I think the 70's in my new-to-me colonial. The better 'n bens is an insert, in a double wall steel firebox. The stove is a very simple (inefficient) design, and the previous owner did a partial liner job that is terrible...

www.hearth.com

Jotul Oslo V3

Mod Edit: Move to its own thread to make this discussion easier to discover in the future. Hi All! I'm in the market for a new wood stove and have contacted a few dealers to price out options. For reference, my house is about 2000 square feet, and the existing fireplace is on the first floor...

www.hearth.com

 

[Todd]

I'm not basing it on just a couple of threads, nor am I the one who first made this conclusion. One of our moderators who installs and services stoves for a living has cited numerous complaints and problems with the F500 v.3. Do a quick search, and you will find this particular version of this particular model has had more complaints than praise, since being introduced 2022. Here's two to get you started:

What should I sell my stove for?

Well, today was the final straw for my VC Dauntless. I was driving by a stove dealer and was stopped at the stop sign, when what did my wandering eye appear?! A Jotul burning nice and bright with a crystal clear glass window and a box full of primary and secondary flames heating a large store...

www.hearth.com

New member, looking for advice on a wood stove

Hello everyone, I have been doing some research to buying my first wood stove as a primary heat source in the basement. These are the dimensions, Basement is 1600 sqft fully open but in an L shape for the whole house design. First floor is the same sqft so by 50% calculations this would total...

www.hearth.com

I’m aware of those threads and again I wouldn’t base it off of one moderator’s opinion. You trashed the whole recent Jotul class of stoves not just the F500.

 

[Ashful]

I’m aware of those threads and again I wouldn’t base it off of one moderator’s opinion. You trashed the whole recent Jotul class of stoves not just the F500.

True, and perhaps that was unfair. I have not heard the same level of issues from the F55, for example. It's really this "no bypass cat" system designed for 2022 compliance, that seems to be their main issue today.

But the trash talk about "Jotul USA" and their refusal of direct support, combined with dealers that are often not very good, comes from personal experience. I have owned three Jotul stoves, and have my share of dealings with the web of local Jotul dealers, and with Jotul USA.

In keeping with historical norms, my 1990's Jotuls were also of excellent build quality, and horrendously bad performance. I guess they're keeping the tradition alive, 25 years later, with that F500.

 

[Todd]

Yeah I agree I wish every manufacturer had customer service like Woodstock. Too bad most just rely on dealerships.

 

[Ashful]

Agreed. In 12+ years on this forum, I've witnessed a lot of love shared for Woodstock customer service, by their various customers. I can't even remember a complaint, although I'm sure the search function could turn up one or two.

BK is similar, in a less formalized manner, with BKVP being very active on this forum. New England used to also have an active member here, although I don't see him much anymore.

I suspect Woodstock's direct-sales model probably scares off some (maybe a lot?) of new woodburners, I know I used to look ascance at them, before I came here and learned more about the company. "Mail order stoves" doesn't exactly smell like the mark of high quality to the outside observer, but they're bucking that stereotype, with top quality product as reported by their owners.

The best of both worlds would be a company with a solid dealer network with first-level support (eg. Jotul or PE model), plus access to direct manufacturer support (BK or Woodstock model) when the dealer is unable to resolve a technical issue. Cost could be kept very manageable by simply requiring documentation of a dealer consult prior to assigning manufacturer support or case number, and this would prevent at least some of the negative feedback that has been posted here about some manufacturers relating to support issues.

 

[bholler]

I’m aware of those threads and again I wouldn’t base it off of one moderator’s opinion. You trashed the whole recent Jotul class of stoves not just the F500.

The rest of jotuls stoves are very good reliable performers. The f500 v3 though has some issues. Going to look at another one today that won't burn after a year of use. Probably just a clogged cat but we will see.

 

[Ashful]

Any idea on why they deployed this new tech on only the F500, and not the entire 300 - 600 line-up? Do they even still make the 600?

 

[Todd]

The only Jotul’s available in North America are the 602, F35,45,55 and F500V3. All castings come from Norway and are put together in Maine I believe. Over in Europe they have different ECO designs of the 602, F400 and F500. Not sure if Jotul is working on more models to pass the EPA 2020 regs, I think the Euro standards are less strict.

 

[Prometeo]

in general
I want to break a spear,
The sellers are too penalized,
people believe they can pretend anything,
You can be the best seller,
But only 0.1 percent will write negativeness
99.9 positives will never be posted.

 

[bholler]

in general
I want to break a spear,
The sellers are too penalized,
people believe they can pretend anything,
You can be the best seller,
But only 0.1 percent will write negativeness
99.9 positives will never be posted.

This is true. But doesn't change the fact that the f500 v3 has some serious issues

 

[Todd]

The rest of jotuls stoves are very good reliable performers. The f500 v3 though has some issues. Going to look at another one today that won't burn after a year of use. Probably just a clogged cat but we will see.

So what was the culprit?

 

[bholler]

So what was the culprit?

Oh it wasn't a 500 it was a 55 and user error

 

[begreen]

In keeping with historical norms, my 1990's Jotuls were also of excellent build quality, and horrendously bad performance. I guess they're keeping the tradition alive, 25 years later, with that F500.

That's a myopic viewpoint considering that the only experience is with one model of Jotul at a time when there were at least 6 others in their model line and that the all of these F12s were used, not new stoves.

The F35. F45, F55, F602 are solid, simple performers that these postings have ignored.

 

[begreen]

The only Jotul’s available in North America are the 602, F35,45,55 and F500V3. All castings come from Norway and are put together in Maine I believe. Over in Europe they have different ECO designs of the 602, F400 and F500. Not sure if Jotul is working on more models to pass the EPA 2020 regs, I think the Euro standards are less strict.

Just to clarify, the F35,45,55 jackets are cast in Norway, but the steel stove body at the core is fabricated in Maine.

 

[Ashful]

That's a myopic viewpoint considering that the only experience is with one model of Jotul at a time when there were at least 6 others in their model line and that the all of these F12s were used, not new stoves.

The F35. F45, F55, F602 are solid, simple performers that these postings have ignored.

That's fair. But the F12 wasn't their only problematic stove at that time, either. A few of the various flavors of the model 8, earlier equivalent to today's Oslo, had just as many issues.

But like you, I only ever hear good about the F45/F55's and 602. Haven't heard much either way on F35, maybe not enough of them out there, yet.

 

[begreen]

I've owned 3 different models of Norway-made, cast iron Jotuls, old and new, all non-cat. They have all been good stoves.

 

[Ashful]

Agreed, their pre-2022 cast iron stoves seemed to be solid performers. I guess they had to discontinue them due to low efficiency, compared to the new requirements?

But the OP is having issues with dealer responsiveness, not a particular stove model. My recommendation to consider PE or BK over Jotul, for stoves of similar price, quality, and cosmetics, was based more on this than anything else.

 

[triceps]

Thanks everyone for the information and suggestions.

Are there any defenders out there of the v3 Oslo model? As I understand it, that’s their only model eligible for the federal tax credit, so that’s the one there’s that we would want for financial reasons.

The other brand that we like for aesthetic reasons and that we’ve heard nice things about is Vermont Castings (eg Defiant). Thoughts ?

Is there anything about installing a Defiant or Oslo that is terribly complicated? What I mean by that is could someone with stove installation experience handle it pretty easily, or does it require specific training or knowledge to that model?

here is more about our installation situation in this post:

Advice on insert vs stove to replace Superior zero clearance fireplace

Hello, looking to improve upon our current Superior zero clearance fireplace in our mountain cabin. From what I’ve read it sounds like there aren’t very many insert options that work with this fireplace? Also, does anyone know if any of the inserts that do work are 2020 EPA rated and...

www.hearth.com

Thanks.

 

[triceps]

Photo of existing fireplace

 

[Todd]

VC Defiant is a great looking stove but there are so many poor reviews here with these down drafting stoves I’d stay away. They just seem to finicky and need a lot of close attention when burning.

As far as the F500v3 I’ve talked with two different local dealers a couple of times if they’ve seen any issues and they said no but you have to take that with a grain of salt. I’d definitely chose this stove over any VC.

Looks like you will need a rear exhaust stove so that makes you pretty limited. The Jotul F45 or F55 May work but no tax credit but I wouldn’t totally base my choice on that.

 

[begreen]

Consider an insert instead. If looking at catalytic, consider a Blaze King Ashford 25 or a Kuma Cascade hybrid.