Pacific Energy and 2020

Newburnerwisconsin

Feeling the Heat
Jul 8, 2015
452
wisconsin
Hi everyone. Does anyone from Pacific Energy know when the new 2020 stoves will be available to the public? Thanks
 

mar13

Feeling the Heat
Nov 5, 2018
271
California redwood coast
Hi everyone. Does anyone from Pacific Energy know when the new 2020 stoves will be available to the public? Thanks

I'm in line to order a PE this spring, so I hope they don't convert to the 2020 design until later.

Their lab tests are from a few years ago.

(Sorry not to answer your question, but just feeding this thread...)
 
  • Like
Reactions: coreboy83

coreboy83

Member
Nov 3, 2016
51
MN
I'm in line to order a PE this spring, so I hope they don't convert to the 2020 design until later.

Their lab tests are from a few years ago.

(Sorry not to answer your question, but just feeding this thread...)
Me too. We are going with the Alderlea T5 Classic, White. We'll wait until July when the overtime is plentiful and the money tree starts to bud
 

Sodbuster

Minister of Fire
Sep 22, 2012
1,444
Michigan
Not saying they will have any issues to speak of, but I hate to buy the first model year of anything. Might be some good deals of existing inventory.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newburnerwisconsin

Samsquanch

New Member
Mar 2, 2019
25
Alberta
I was in at a dealer that distributes PE yesterday and was told that they believe that the updated models of the Super, the Summit, and possibly the Vista are ready to ship. Still waiting to hear back on dates for other models. They didn't have any new ones there to ogle yet. It will be interesting to see how the changes roll out and if its reflected in price changes. Apparently there have been some production delays at the PE plant lately according to the dealer. Anyone have an inside scoop?
 

Sodbuster

Minister of Fire
Sep 22, 2012
1,444
Michigan
Having a Summit, I'll be curious to see if the changes are visible, or all internal. I do not believe we have any PE insiders on the list, which is really a shame.
 

mar13

Feeling the Heat
Nov 5, 2018
271
California redwood coast
Well, I may end up being a guinea pig for you all regarding the super/T5. The new local stove replacement program I'm in is having hiccups, thus my delays in ordering. I'm hoping to get the pre 2020 model, but I guess I shouldn't complain too much if a clean air program ends up making me get an epa2020 model. (If I had known delays would have pushed me into epa2020 models I might have extended my hearth a few inches and gone for a long tested Ashford 30 and then only worry about the slight chance of dealing with creosote smells.)

Worrying about the unknown....
 
  • Like
Reactions: coreboy83

Samsquanch

New Member
Mar 2, 2019
25
Alberta
Well, I may end up being a guinea pig for you all regarding the super/T5. The new local stove replacement program I'm in is having hiccups, thus my delays in ordering. I'm hoping to get the pre 2020 model, but I guess I shouldn't complain too much if a clean air program ends up making me get an epa2020 model. (If I had known delays would have pushed me into epa2020 models I might have extended my hearth a few inches and gone for a long tested Ashford 30 and then only worry about the slight chance of dealing with creosote smells.)

Worrying about the unknown....
Yeah, I hear ya...the first model year of anything is a bit unnerving! I’m in the same boat...probably have a good deal lined up on a pre 2020 T5, but am eagerly awaiting information regarding the new model. I suspect it will just be some kind of revision to the baffle/secondary layout. Provided that they don’t do anything drastic, or just limit minimum burn rates (which looks unlikely based on their epa reports), the lower emissions are welcome, but I would hate to see them forced into abandoning a proven product. Let’s just hope they knock it out of the park. Keep us posted if you end up with a new one!
 
  • Like
Reactions: coreboy83

heavy hammer

Minister of Fire
Jul 18, 2015
1,624
Kirtland Ohio
If you think about it Pacific energy makes a pretty nice product. With it being new it will be under warranty, granted that still could mean problems but I would think they have it some what together. is there any info about what they have done to change from pre 2020 to the current standards?
 

mar13

Feeling the Heat
Nov 5, 2018
271
California redwood coast
PE now has their brochure for their Summit LE online: http://pacificenergy.net/support/support/literature/ It's not very informative. Interestingly, they state a 3 cubic foot box even though the EPA testing lab states (confusingly) 2.5 cubic feet. ( I'm sure how to measure stove volume is its own long thread.)

There's also a thread, https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/over-burning-over-draft.175120/ , that is covering a person's experience with a Super LE. Hopefully, though, the original poster has - for some reason - an unusually strong draft and it's not the stove's design causing the issue.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,463
South Puget Sound, WA
Tom (chimneysweep) has sold a few LEs already. They went through the test of our cold February and folks appear to like them. The main change in the Super line is replacement of the linked secondary air to the EBT2.

Not sure how they measured the test stove. Our T6 is right around 2.75 cu ft. useable.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
17,194
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
I am thrilled to see that we are finally seeing some honest firebox measurements. Heck, honest efficiency numbers and honest output numbers are pretty great too.

Not so thrilled that some previously great stoves are being eliminated or changed in ways that may make them suck. Glad to be able to wait a few years for the bugs to be worked out.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,463
South Puget Sound, WA
The court is out so far. We may just as well see that good stoves get even better. Tom reports the new LEs he's sold are working well. And he is one of the rare seller/installers that follows up on their work. One thing we have to be careful about here is that we rarely hear about stoves and setups that are working perfectly. Mostly we hear the complaints from the few. And the most common complaints we hear about end up being operator error with a new stove. (too wet or too dry wood, incorrect loading, incorrect air control, unrealistic expectation, etc.). The second group of complaints are usually due to installation problems (weak draft, too much draft, negative pressure, etc.).
 

mar13

Feeling the Heat
Nov 5, 2018
271
California redwood coast
I recall seeing a post this winter where a stove shopper was thinking about the Super vs Summit series. The EBT2 was an attraction to the person posting. I have to admit, PE's description of that had me wanting the EBT2 as well. For better or worse, now, the Super series people will get The EBT2 too.

I do wonder a few things, (1) Did/can the PE engineers tweak the EBT2 to get it to work so that it'd meet EPA2020 rules, especially for the new Summit series which already had it, and (2) was why wasn't EBT2 used earlier for the Super series? Regarding (2), I'd guess it was either an extra manufacturing cost or the old "linkage" set-up worked great so why bother. If only the engineers at PE could talk...
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,463
South Puget Sound, WA
It costs a lot, a whole lot, to have a stove certified and tested. The Super series worked great with the previous technology. The linked secondary control was an excellent design. The only reason for the change(s) was to meet the new certification requirements. My guess is they may have tweaked other parameters too, like in the baffle, besides just swapping in the EBT, but don't quote me on it.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
17,194
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
Tom loves all of his products. Even hearthstones!

Right now the jury is still out and buying a 2020 compliant model is truly a gamble. The changes are not minor and only after many years will we be able to look back and say whether the first compliant stoves were better or not. I expect further refinement of the designs as needed so I would recommend either getting a good old version or waiting a few years. Clock is ticking!
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
82,463
South Puget Sound, WA
He sells what he can stand behind. Tom has one of the few companies I know of that stands behind the customer being satisfied with their product and will take it back if they are not satisfied.

Like what happened in the mid-80's I am hoping to see some nice improvements in stove performance with these tweaks and new designs. Yes, there will be some misses, but most all of us have benefitted by the changes brought about then. FWIW, buying a new car and crossing the street are also a gamble.
 
Last edited:

Newburnerwisconsin

Feeling the Heat
Jul 8, 2015
452
wisconsin
He sells what he can stand behind. Tom is one of the few companies I know of that stands behind the customer being satisfied with their product and will take it back if they are not satisfied.

Like what happened in the mid-80's I am hoping to see some nice improvements in stove performance with these tweaks and new designs. Yes, there will be some misses, but most all of us have benefitted by the changes brought about then. FWIW, buying a new car and crossing the street are also a gamble too.
Great info everyone. Thank you all very much for responding. I am defining excited about his new stove. I wonder if the T6 will still be available with the door on either side?
 
  • Like
Reactions: coreboy83

mar13

Feeling the Heat
Nov 5, 2018
271
California redwood coast
I'll just be excited (and grateful) to get a new stove, whether or not it's EPA2020.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: coreboy83

Woody Stover

Minister of Fire
Dec 25, 2010
12,157
Southern IN
Tom (chimneysweep) has sold a few LEs already. They went through the test of our cold February and folks appear to like them.
Who are these "folks?" Probably not discriminating stove nerds like we are... ;)
I would recommend either getting a good old version or waiting a few years. Clock is ticking!
I may take your advice... ==c
 

mar13

Feeling the Heat
Nov 5, 2018
271
California redwood coast
Well, I'm in a generous stove replacement program and I had to commit to a stove last October. The PE super series fit my quarter circle hearth limitations (barely), had a decent size firebox, and good reputation. Delays in the program are making it seem like I will be getting an LE version. It'll almost certainly be a big upgrade from my worn out old VC. Someone has to be an early adopter to move the advances onward - chance has it I may be in that group.
 

Woody Stover

Minister of Fire
Dec 25, 2010
12,157
Southern IN
Thought you had already order a 2020 stove for your sis.
Yeah, I was just teasing it in my reply to Highbeam, heheh. I've got the old version coming for my SIL, a T5 classic in brown. Cat stoves blow. ;)
I think I would be fine with the new LE. It may actually turn out to be better, but could need a stack damper if it wants to burn a little too fast. I decided to go with the old one, a proven long-burner.
My actual Sis...I'm trying to get her to buy a stove also. ;lol That's another kettle of fish, super tiny fireplace in a 150-y.o. NM adobe house. Maybe a rear-vent hearth mount.
Delays in the program are making it seem like I will be getting an LE version. It'll almost certainly be a big upgrade from my worn out old VC. Someone has to be an early adopter to move the advances onward - chance has it I may be in that group.
I'm looking forward to you updating us with your burn reports. :)
 

Newburnerwisconsin

Feeling the Heat
Jul 8, 2015
452
wisconsin
I'll just be excited (and grateful) to get a new stove, whether or not it's EPA2020.
Me too. At some point, the older models will not be available. I don't know when but it will be interesting. I spoke with a dealer near me recently who told me that Jotul had advised them clear out all the pre-2020 inventory. So the next 4 to 6 months will see a lot of new products hit the market. If PE can meet 2020 without a CAT, I am impressed.
 

bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
21,388
central pa
Me too. At some point, the older models will not be available. I don't know when but it will be interesting. I spoke with a dealer near me recently who told me that Jotul had advised them clear out all the pre-2020 inventory. So the next 4 to 6 months will see a lot of new products hit the market. If PE can meet 2020 without a CAT, I am impressed.
There are noncats already on the market that meet the new standard.