Basement woodstove, backdraft, carbon monoxide

[BarrelStove69]

Good day folks!

We are first time woodstovers who just moved to our dream home in the country, located in Northern Ontario.

We have been running into issues regarding carbon monoxide and backdraft.

We have a very large, locally forged, cast-iron, barrel style, top-loading woodstove. This is was installed in the home in ' 92 when it was built.

It is located in the basement of our 3-story home and has a very tall external chimney. There is no damper. There is a fresh air intake located to the left of the stove, and the flue has two 90 degree bends before shooting straight up.

We have been running into issues lately with the colder weather (-30C) in regards to carbon monoxide and backdrafting.
Establishing successful updraft to light our fire and keep it going is not the problem whatsoever, although, when we allow the fire to cool completely it seems the backdraft becomes so strong that it reignites the embers, resulting in buildup of carbon monoxide in our home. The gasses still escape the woodstove, even with the airvents on the top closed. This is clearly due to our perfect storm of the stack-effect, and a cold chimney as a result of it being outside. The reason this never posed an issue for the previous owner is because 1. Burnt hot all winter (Full cords were about 650$ less 30 years ago) and 2. He would turn all of the CO detectors off.

We have a few viable options to help our situation, and I was hoping some of the woodstove-veterans here can tell me if we are on the right track.

1. UNINSULATE the woodchute door.
- We have a wood chute door located in the woodstove room. When we moved in it was quite drafty, so we sealed that bad boy up (thinking the more air tight, the more heat we will retain from the already inefficient woodstove). I am now thinking that the cold albeit fresh outside air helped with the negative pressure, and helped feed the fire for complete combustion.

2. SEAL the cracks in the stove itself
- There are a few hairline cracks in the cast iron that we will temporarily seal with cement glue, while we wait for a welder to come out and seal them closed.

3. SEAL the door
- We plan to glue in a rope gasket to ensure proper seal on the woodstove door.

4. DRAFT INDUCER
- Given how we have the perfect storm for potentially going to bed and not waking up, I feel like a draft inducer would help with the issue and give us peace-of-mind. How effective do you think this will be in establishing updraft and preventing CO problems, despite the external chimney still being very cold? I would hate to invest in a 400 dollar piece of equipment just for it to not work. However, I would also hate to cut my life short because the woodstove was installed to be a death trap.

5. OTHER THINGS
- We do not open windows upstairs (the front door could probably stand to be weather sealed), we barely have any fans/other exhausts going, we only burn dry seasoned wood (<20% moisture), we had a chimney sweep done beginning of the season, and the stove was WETT certified before we moved in.

So, if anybody has any advice, i'm all ears. If anybody has ever encountered a woodstove in this style I would like to hear your opinions on it, as I can't find anything online about anyone else having a similar style. And when the time comes to get a new woodstove, would we still have the same issues that we're having now?

Attached below are photos of our setup, and a horrible drawing showing the layout of the flue/chimney system.

BONUS points if you can tell us how to make this thing function more efficiently too; we are having a hell of a time getting the house nice and hot without burning an insane amount of wood. We were thinking of installing some floor grates throughout the house to help with heat dispersal and air flow.

 

[begreen]

Visually, this looks like a combination of bad design and implementation. The long tall outside chimney is bound to be cold. As the fire dies down, draft reversal is likely. The thimble is low. A 3ft vertical rise off of the stove would help a bit. If the upstairs has air leaks, then that will contribute to negative pressure in the basement. The stove should not be run with any cracks like that. If the basement is not insulated, a ton of heat is being wasted to the outdoors through the walls.

Is that an air supply tube next to the flue thimble?

A good solution would be to put a new stove on the main floor instead of heating it from the basement.

 

[kborndale]

The only advice I have is not to use that stove. It does not appear to be safe. Any money you planned to put into that stove I would put towards a new stove.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Can you post a picture of the nameplate?

 

[BarrelStove69]

Can you post a picture of the nameplate?

I don't believe it has a nameplate, I will check again when I get home to be sure - but I believe it was made locally in 90s.

 

[BarrelStove69]

Visually, this looks like a combination of bad design and implementation. The long tall outside chimney is bound to be cold. As the fire dies down, draft reversal is likely. The thimble is low. A 3ft vertical rise off of the stove would help a bit. If the upstairs has air leaks, then that will contribute to negative pressure in the basement. The stove should not be run with any cracks like that. If the basement is not insulated, a ton of heat is being wasted to the outdoors through the walls.

Is that an air supply tube next to the flue thimble?

A good solution would be to put a new stove on the main floor instead of heating it from the basement.

Yes, that is an air supply next to the flue thimble.

See, putting in a woodstove on the main floor would prove difficult, as pretty much the entirety of the main room, in the main floor is windows. It's super unfortunate that the house was built this way. It's a beautiful home, don't get me wrong. But a country home heated by woodstove should be designed around the main heating source, in my opinion.

If we can't install a woodstove on the main floor, do you think a new, certified would stove would help rectify the issue? Would it be capable of heated the main floor? Sorry for all of the questions, just so green to all of this!

 

[BarrelStove69]

The only advice I have is not to use that stove. It does not appear to be safe. Any money you planned to put into that stove I would put towards a new stove.

Dang :'( Things ain't cheap these days!

 

[begreen]

Yes, that is an air supply next to the flue thimble.

See, putting in a woodstove on the main floor would prove difficult, as pretty much the entirety of the main room, in the main floor is windows. It's super unfortunate that the house was built this way. It's a beautiful home, don't get me wrong. But a country home heated by woodstove should be designed around the main heating source, in my opinion.

If we can't install a woodstove on the main floor, do you think a new, certified would stove would help rectify the issue? Would it be capable of heated the main floor? Sorry for all of the questions, just so green to all of this!

If the stove has a good and close back clearance spec then the windows shouldn't be an issue, but the flue system may need to be redone and go straight up through the roof.

A new stove would solve the cracks and would have no top openings, but that will not solve the inherent problems with the chimney and basement install. Note that a good used stove will help bring the cost down. Just be very careful with what is bought.

 

[kborndale]

For a new stove that is good quality and inexpensive (relatively) look at drolet stoves. Also that stove looks like it would burn thru wood almost as fast as an open fireplace.

 

[Whitenuckler]

I don't believe it has a nameplate, I will check again when I get home to be sure - but I believe it was made locally in 90s.

To be honest, I would start to question the guy who gave you a WETT certificate. Or maybe never contact him again.
Any stove that is to be WETT certified (for your insurance), the step A is the nameplate info.

 

[kborndale]

To be honest, I would start to question the guy who gave you a WETT certificate. Or maybe never contact him again.
Any stove that is to be WETT certified (for your insurance), the step A is the nameplate info.

Looks homemade to me, I doubt it was ever certified.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Looks homemade to me, I doubt it was ever certified.

People are selling their old wood stoves for $50 and you come pick it up. Their insurance companies want WETT certified in Canada, and those old stoves don't have the approvals they need. Plus, I've seen stoves where the nameplate was removed or un-readable. The next thing they look at is the chimney system.

 

[BarrelStove69]

For a new stove that is good quality and inexpensive (relatively) look at drolet stoves. Also that stove looks like it would burn thru wood almost as fast as an open fireplace.

Why, is it because of the gargantuan size of it?

Thank you for the recommendation! I will certainly look into that.

 

[BarrelStove69]

Looks homemade to me, I doubt it was ever certified.

Yeah, when our chimney sweep came by he said some guy in one of the surrounding townships makes them. I'm assuming that's where this absolute beast came from.

 

[BarrelStove69]

To be honest, I would start to question the guy who gave you a WETT certificate. Or maybe never contact him again.
Any stove that is to be WETT certified (for your insurance), the step A is the nameplate info.

Good to know. After all of these trials and tribulations I too am surprised it passed the inspection.

 

[BarrelStove69]

People are selling their old wood stoves for $50 and you come pick it up. Their insurance companies want WETT certified in Canada, and those old stoves don't have the approvals they need. Plus, I've seen stoves where the nameplate was removed or un-readable. The next thing they look at is the chimney system.

Aaaah okay. When the times comes to invest in a new woodstove system we'll probably buy new. We're so green to the world of woodstoves and I know used can come with some quirks, haha.